An insight on Bitcoin

[jonnysensible]

https://cryptopotato.com/us-cftc-sue...0-immediately/

And some sauce on what I imagine you're referencing.

'Binance founder CZ sued by the CFTC. CZ was countertrading his own customers with hundreds of controlled accounts.'

theres loads of other shit in there about laundering money for hamas etc.

I think ive said it before but crypto is literally 40 guys who are all in a whatsapp group, wash trading and scamming.

[Poopymonster]

Anyone else read "Stable" in the name in the same way you read FREEDOM, PATRIOT, LIBERTY in other marketing bullshit?

[Belize]

https://cryptopotato.com/us-cftc-sue...0-immediately/

And some sauce on what I imagine you're referencing.

Welp. Let's see how things shake out.

[jonnysensible]

so SBF is facing 100+ years in the can, his dad and his brother are getting pulled into it as well. Very good stuff.

[hellhamster]

so SBF is facing 100+ years in the can, his dad and his brother are getting pulled into it as well. Very good stuff.

Nice if it actually happens, but I'm not keeping my hopes up.

[crewskater]

Interesting thread I found in regards to Bitcoin and the US government. As someone said in the comments, I could see them using BTC to bail out the country if the dollar collapses. It's pretty funny seeing all the criticisms against crypto as we see banks failing. If the government believes in crypto, so should you because it's not going anywhere. https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurre...ins_more_than/

[Edge-]

Interesting thread I found in regards to Bitcoin and the US government. As someone said in the comments, I could see them using BTC to bail out the country if the dollar collapses. It's pretty funny seeing all the criticisms against crypto as we see banks failing. If the government believes in crypto, so should you because it's not going anywhere. https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurre...ins_more_than/

isn't that just the bitcoin seized from criminal activity and shit? Like, it's still worthless, the government holding onto it doesn't mean they suddenly believe it's actually super valuable.

bitcoin remains magic beans so far

[Rasulis]

Well I also just found out that 10 days ago the creator of Block's Cash App was straight up murdered by another IT executive. Feels like there's more to this story...

Sounds like girl problem?

Cash App founder Bob Lee was stabbed to death after argument about the suspect's sister, court documents show

[I]

Cash App founder Bob Lee was fatally stabbed by an IT consultant near downtown San Francisco after the two men got into an argument over the suspect's sister, according to court documents obtained by NBC News on Friday.

The suspect — 38-year-old Nima Momeni of Emeryville, a suburb of San Francisco — drove Lee to a secluded area and stabbed him three times with a 4-inch kitchen knife, including twice in the chest, according to the documents. At least one of the stab wounds punctured Lee's heart.

In the wake of the dispute, Momeni's sister sent a text to Lee, the documents show. “Just wanted to make sure your doing ok Cause know nima came wayyyyyy down hard on you," she wrote, according to the documents.

"Thank you for being such a classy man handling it with class," she added. "Love you Selfish pricks."

[Endus]

Interesting thread I found in regards to Bitcoin and the US government. As someone said in the comments, I could see them using BTC to bail out the country if the dollar collapses. It's pretty funny seeing all the criticisms against crypto as we see banks failing. If the government believes in crypto, so should you because it's not going anywhere. https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurre...ins_more_than/

The main stories about recent financial failures were FTX, a crypto exchange, and SVB, Signature, and Silvergate banks, the latter two of which were heavily working with crypto companies, and SVB with tech startups including crypto.

This is not an accounting that looks favorably on crypto concerns in any way whatsoever.

Especially as all crypto remain completely non-functional as actual currencies in any meaningful respect. They aren't currencies, despite the name. They're speculation tools with zero inherent value. Buying beanie babies was more financially sound than buying crypto is today, because when the market crashes, you've at least still got your plush toys, whereas with crypto, you have literally nothing.

[crewskater]

isn't that just the bitcoin seized from criminal activity and shit? Like, it's still worthless, the government holding onto it doesn't mean they suddenly believe it's actually super valuable.

bitcoin remains magic beans so far

How it was obtained is irrelevant. How can it be worthless if you can use it to buy stuff? I can guarantee you Edge, crypto is here to stay because it's inevitable for currency to evolve into the digital world. The US govt recently sent 1B worth of coins to Coinbase.

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Especially as all crypto remain completely non-functional as actual currencies in any meaningful respect. They aren't currencies, despite the name. They're speculation tools with zero inherent value. Buying beanie babies was more financially sound than buying crypto is today, because when the market crashes, you've at least still got your plush toys, whereas with crypto, you have literally nothing.

You act as if you can't buy anything with it, which is completely false. You could say the same thing about the dollar and printing cash out of thin air.

[Endus]

You act as if you can't buy anything with it, which is completely false. You could say the same thing about the dollar and printing cash out of thin air.

You can't walk into 99.99% of vendors and buy anything with crypto. I just bought some IKEA bookshelves; crypto was not a payment option. You can buy stuff at select locations with arcade tokens or tickets, too; that doesn't make them currency.

Worse, it's non-functional from the outset as currency because it has no stable value. The entire point of a currency is to act as a stable medium of exchange; the value of a gold nugget might vary day-to-day, but the value of a dollar is by comparison incredibly stable. If you have to check the value of a currency before buying a good, it's not functioning as a currency, it's a complicated form of barter and the valuation isn't even being made in that crypto; the buyer is saying "okay, this product is worth $50, and $50 of Bitcoin is how much Bitcoin? Okay, I'll accept that amount of Bitcoin instead of the $50". The value is still in dollars, not Bitcoin.

All cryptocurrencies are completely non-functional as currencies. They're not currency, at all. In any respect. And no; you can't make these same arguments about actual currencies. That's the point.

[crewskater]

You can't walk into 99.99% of vendors and buy anything with crypto. I just bought some IKEA bookshelves; crypto was not a payment option. You can buy stuff at select locations with arcade tokens or tickets, too; that doesn't make them currency.

Worse, it's non-functional from the outset as currency because it has no stable value. The entire point of a currency is to act as a stable medium of exchange; the value of a gold nugget might vary day-to-day, but the value of a dollar is by comparison incredibly stable. If you have to check the value of a currency before buying a good, it's not functioning as a currency, it's a complicated form of barter and the valuation isn't even being made in that crypto; the buyer is saying "okay, this product is worth $50, and $50 of Bitcoin is how much Bitcoin? Okay, I'll accept that amount of Bitcoin instead of the $50". The value is still in dollars, not Bitcoin.

All cryptocurrencies are completely non-functional as currencies. They're not currency, at all. In any respect. And no; you can't make these same arguments about actual currencies. That's the point.

Crypto has been around for a little over a decade, it will take time for adoption. The dollar has been around for over 230 years. Let's not forget that on the black market alone, there are millions if not billions of dollars being exchanged with crypto. How do you explain that? I guess you're right you can't make the same arguments against most currencies because it isn't fiat.

[Endus]

Crypto has been around for a little over a decade, it will take time for adoption. The dollar has been around for over 230 years.

The dollar was also "adopted" in far less than a decade, dude. Crypto's just a continuous open failure, because the goal wasn't ever to replace currency, it was to create a speculation tool that would let early adopters skim off the top in a glorified MLM, until the whole system eventually collapses, as happens to all MLMs eventually.

Let's not forget that on the black market alone, there are millions if not billions of dollars being exchanged with crypto. How do you explain that?

I explain that by pointing out it wouldn't be any different if they were exchanging rough-cut diamonds or bricks of cocaine. Which also aren't currencies.

I guess you're right you can't make the same arguments against most currencies because it isn't fiat.

Nothing I've said has anything to do with fiat currencies specifically. You're moving goalposts.

[crewskater]

The dollar was also "adopted" in far less than a decade, dude. Crypto's just a continuous open failure, because the goal wasn't ever to replace currency, it was to create a speculation tool that would let early adopters skim off the top in a glorified MLM, until the whole system eventually collapses, as happens to all MLMs eventually.

That's all conjecture considering all time it's up over 28K% since 2009. How long does it have to be around for you to consider it not a failure? I'd like to see some evidence on that last part because it's goal from beginning has always been a decentralized currency. It sounds like you don't know what the Blockchain is and it's use.

I explain that by pointing out it wouldn't be any different if they were exchanging rough-cut diamonds or bricks of cocaine. Which also aren't currencies.

That's what they used to do before the dollar, they would exchange goods for other goods based on the supply and demand.

Nothing I've said has anything to do with fiat currencies specifically. You're moving goalposts.

It's relevant to the debate. You're defending fiat currency and telling me crypto is worthless. That is incredibly ironic. That would be true if the internet collapsed.

[Edge-]

How it was obtained is irrelevant.

Not at all.

It's the difference between the local police having two kilos of cocaine because they confiscated it in a bust and having two kilos of cocaine because someone there has a wicked nose candy habit.

How can it be worthless if you can use it to buy stuff?

What can it buy? Didn't BAYC's restaurant have to ditch crypto because nobody wanted to pay using it and nobody wanted to be paid in it?

Yes, everything has theoretical value, even the rocks in my back yard. That doesn't mean it has any actually agreed upon value outside of personal feelings on it. Which is how crypto mostly works since you can give someone 1 whole bitcoin for a dry cleaning bill and they'd still probably laugh in your face and ask you to give them something of value.

I can guarantee you Edge, crypto is here to stay because it's inevitable for currency to evolve into the digital world. The US govt recently sent 1B worth of coins to Coinbase.

"Crypto is inevitable" remains one of the most common arguments of the crypto crowd. But y'all continually refuse to ever say why, usually just vague platitudes with a few buzzwords but nothing of actual substance.

The article doesn't state "why" they moved the BTC there or say why it's significant. Is that simply the most practical way to store it? Could be!

You act as if you can't buy anything with it, which is completely false. You could say the same thing about the dollar and printing cash out of thin air.

What can you buy with it that's not online? Few places online accept it and I've yet to see a single place IRL that accepts it and has actually done any meaningful amount of transactions with it rather than "We accept it but nobody ever pays with it". Like the lady who runs the gas station down the road from me. She got suckered into a bitcoin vending machine by some liars that told her Canada ditched their currency and moved to bitcoin. She accidentally let it slip that literally nobody has used it in the years it's been there. Not a single soul.

And the dollar printed out of thin air is actually backed by the promise of the US government, not just hope and faith. Monetary policy exists.

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That's all conjecture considering all time it's up over 28K% since 2009.

Yeah but what volumes are we talking about are used for anything other than just buying and selling other crypto? Like, how much crypto is actually used for like, buying groceries? Paying rent or utilities? Making loan payments? You know, things that people actually need to do to survive and not just have fun playing a pretend speculative market?

How long does it have to be around for you to consider it not a failure?

Ideally until we have at least a few successful cases, which hasn't happened yet. Again, BAYC burger joint ditched crypto because nobody wanted magic beans.

I'd like to see some evidence on that last part because it's goal from beginning has always been a decentralized currency. It sounds like you don't know what the Blockchain is and it's use.

How many times have coins been tanked by whales? Or have whales made major shifts in price due to dumping/moving a massive amount of coins somewhere? Like, that ability to do that is baked into crypto as a feature, as we've discussed in this thread.

That's what they used to do before the dollar, they would exchange goods for other goods based on the supply and demand.

Yes, barter systems are great for small-scale commerce. They're absolutely useless for anything beyond small communities.

It's relevant to the debate. You're defending fiat currency and telling me crypto is worthless. That is incredibly ironic. That would be true if the internet collapsed.

I mean...it's true now. If I have a US dollar it doesn't matter what anyone thinks of the value of that dollar - just about everywhere in the world will accept that dollar at its current value. Sure, some small shop in the middle of nowhere in Uganda probably won't accept it due to the hassle of exchanging it or whatever, but elsewhere the US dollar is accepted with an agreed upon value.

Crypto has theoretical value, but the vast majority of the world would not accept it as payment because that value only matters to a small handful of people within crypto circles to begin with. Outside those circles nobody agrees that crypto is worth shit. That's why it has no value.

[crewskater]

What can it buy? Didn't BAYC's restaurant have to ditch crypto because nobody wanted to pay using it and nobody wanted to be paid in it?

Yes, everything has theoretical value, even the rocks in my back yard. That doesn't mean it has any actually agreed upon value outside of personal feelings on it. Which is how crypto mostly works since you can give someone 1 whole bitcoin for a dry cleaning bill and they'd still probably laugh in your face and ask you to give them something of value.

As I mentioned to Endus, it's most likely a billion dollar industry on the dark net, drugs are big business. The adoption has been slow but that's because of crypto's complexity and bad reputation.

"Crypto is inevitable" remains one of the most common arguments of the crypto crowd. But y'all continually refuse to ever say why, usually just vague platitudes with a few buzzwords but nothing of actual substance.

The article doesn't state "why" they moved the BTC there or say why it's significant. Is that simply the most practical way to store it? Could be!

Because printing money out of thin air is not a sustainable process. Getting the control of currency out of the hands of the government is a good thing. You seem to have a lot of faith in our government despite it's history.

Yeah but what volumes are we talking about are used for anything other than just buying and selling other crypto? Like, how much crypto is actually used for like, buying groceries? Paying rent or utilities? Making loan payments? You know, things that people actually need to do to survive and not just have fun playing a pretend speculative market?

Bitcoin is ranked the 18th largest currency valued over 1 trillion dollars. Again the adoption has been slow and will take time. You're not making arguments against crypto but it's integration.

Ideally until we have at least a few successful cases, which hasn't happened yet. Again, BAYC burger joint ditched crypto because nobody wanted magic beans.

I figured you would dodge that question. You will be saying the same thing in 50 years

How many times have coins been tanked by whales? Or have whales made major shifts in price due to dumping/moving a massive amount of coins somewhere? Like, that ability to do that is baked into crypto as a feature, as we've discussed in this thread.

You're talking about people scamming ignorant people and nothing to do with blockchain or crypto. Like that doesn't happen under any monetary system.

Crypto has theoretical value, but the vast majority of the world would not accept it as payment because that value only matters to a small handful of people within crypto circles to begin with. Outside those circles nobody agrees that crypto is worth shit. That's why it has no value.

Do you have a source on that? Weird how things come from all across the globe on the dark net. 1 trillion net worth and it's worthless.

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Cool thing to say and all, but my hard earned pound sterling are already digital, and I can use them anywhere in the country already. I haven't used physical cash in years.

I'm not sure why the digital side of it is still some sort of argument.

What if you wanted to buy something you weren't proud of?

[Calfredd]

What if you wanted to buy something you weren't proud of?

Use pound sterling? Unless you mean illegal drugs, people, and cp then yeah, crypto is the winner's choice.

[gondrin]

Interesting thread I found in regards to Bitcoin and the US government. As someone said in the comments, I could see them using BTC to bail out the country if the dollar collapses. It's pretty funny seeing all the criticisms against crypto as we see banks failing. If the government believes in crypto, so should you because it's not going anywhere. https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurre...ins_more_than/

Call me as soon as Wells Fargo, CapitalOne, JPMorgan Chase, Bank of America or any other bank of that type starts to collapse. Otherwise, the only banks that are failing are the ones that are specifically tied to crypto in some fashion.

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That's all conjecture considering all time it's up over 28K% since 2009. How long does it have to be around for you to consider it not a failure? I'd like to see some evidence on that last part because it's goal from beginning has always been a decentralized currency. It sounds like you don't know what the Blockchain is and it's use.



That's what they used to do before the dollar, they would exchange goods for other goods based on the supply and demand.



It's relevant to the debate. You're defending fiat currency and telling me crypto is worthless. That is incredibly ironic. That would be true if the internet collapsed.

Why do crypto enthusiasts care what Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency is valued in US dollars? I mean, if fiat is worthless, who cares what Bitcoin is worth in it. However, irony is that you bring up if the internet collapsed and talking about crypto. You cannot use crypto in anyway without the internet as there is no means to verify that it is legitimate.

Right now, the only uses for Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency is as a speculative tool and to scam people out of their money that they earned.

[Endus]

That's all conjecture considering all time it's up over 28K% since 2009.

"Beanie baby prices haven't crashed yet so it's all upward growth forever!"

How long does it have to be around for you to consider it not a failure?

Has nothing to do with how long it's been around, it has to do with whether it can perform the basic functions of a modern currency.

And as it stands, all cryptocurrencies completely fail on that.

I'd like to see some evidence on that last part because it's goal from beginning has always been a decentralized currency. It sounds like you don't know what the Blockchain is and it's use.

And here we go with the mystical handwaving about the Blockchain and its magical, mysterious powers to solve every problem. How? That's not for you to know! OoooOOooOOoo.

That's what they used to do before the dollar, they would exchange goods for other goods based on the supply and demand.

Errr, no. While barter's had presence in every society, we've had coin currency for about 3,000 years or so. Predates the dollar by a wee margin.

It's relevant to the debate. You're defending fiat currency and telling me crypto is worthless. That is incredibly ironic. That would be true if the internet collapsed.

Again; nothing I've said is specific to fiat currency. Every argument I've made would apply to any currency backed by a commodity standard, too, though they have pretty significant problems in and of themselves. Problems crypto doesn't just share, like potential volatility, but actively encourages as its central reason for existence.

Crypto is beanie babies for techbros. It's the newest, freshest type of MLM. And the dogmatic propaganda isn't new or meaningfully different from those earlier iterations on the concept.

[Edge-]

As I mentioned to Endus, it's most likely a billion dollar industry on the dark net, drugs are big business. The adoption has been slow but that's because of crypto's complexity and bad reputation.

...and you think that will make legitimate companies remotely inclined to adopt or accept this "currency" that gained a foothold specifically with illegal activities?

In what reality does that make sense?

Because printing money out of thin air is not a sustainable process. Getting the control of currency out of the hands of the government is a good thing. You seem to have a lot of faith in our government despite it's history.

It 100% can be. It's monetary policy, the whole point is a sustainable and stable economy which includes the creation of new money to account for a growing population. Fiat currency is one of the best things that's happened for the global economy ever.

Bitcoin is ranked the 18th largest currency valued over 1 trillion dollars. Again the adoption has been slow and will take time. You're not making arguments against crypto but it's integration.

That says nothing about transactions outside of crypto circles, that's just a big number to try to impress me. I'm not impressed.

I figured you would dodge that question. You will be saying the same thing in 50 years

What's the alternative answer? Existence is not success, and until it finds actual success it's not successful. And given recent history, largely a failure. Again, it's incredible that it's theoretically worth so much - various crypto and especially bitcoin - but that's all it is. Theoretically worth something. Let me know what the actual volume/value of BTC transacted outside of crypto circles (i.e. not just one person paying another person for some NFT art with their BTC rofl) and into the real world/economy and we'll be able to have a discussion on this topic.

You're talking about people scamming ignorant people and nothing to do with blockchain or crypto. Like that doesn't happen under any monetary system.

No, this has happened repeatedly throughout multiple cryptos.

Do you have a source on that? Weird how things come from all across the globe on the dark net. 1 trillion net worth and it's worthless.

Again, if your "proof of success" is that it's used for criminal transactions and then laundered into useful fiat currency later that's kinda such a massive self-own I don't know if I really need to write anything more.