An insight on Bitcoin

[hellhamster]

I can't use paypal at my local grocery store, nor any of the local restaurants nor gas stations.

So far*.

Crypto is only a decade old and started off in the underbelly of the internet, just give it some time. Decentralization is really fucking hard to pull off when it comes to monetary practices, especially with governments controlling currencies. But look what it's achieved so far and where the technology is heading. How can you not see further than your nose?

When I'm getting sick and tired of losing value due to the loss of purchasing power year after year, I'll go to crypto. When I, as a company, move money to various accounts all around the globe with time being of the essence due to liquidity being paramount, I'll go to crypto. When a hyperinflationary event takes place in the coming years, I'll go to crypto.

All roads eventually lead to fiat losing its way, unless central banks find some magical method to keep it afloat. So far, the only solution is to just create more out of thin air.

Let's see how long we'll last. Or rather, I really wish I won't, because it won't be pretty.

[Shadowferal]

I should think you crypto lovers would ask your respective employers to let you all get paid in crypto currency rather than cash transferred into the bank.

[Jastall]

so then how do you plan to keep developing countries in the loop with cryptocurrencies that don't have readily available access to internet infrastructure or any internet at all. if your answer is "i don't care." then that's the wrong answer. as those same countries supply valuable resources also used by the rest of the world.

I mean this person lives in a world where their local groceries and shops apparently accepts crypto and Paypal no problem, take what you will from that. Me, I wouldn't trust their takes from here on out.

I also love their conspiracy theories around Musk's tweets, as if the pump and dump/trolling explanation isn't miles easier to justify and totally in character as well.

[hellhamster]

I should think you crypto lovers would ask your respective employers to let you all get paid in crypto currency rather than cash transferred into the bank.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tommybe...rs-in-bitcoin/

[Edge-]

[QUOTE=hellhamster;53190194]So far*.[/qutoe]

Yes, and PayPal predates crypto by quite a bit, so that it's taking so long for PayPal adoption should give you an idea on the timeline for crypto, which is far more fragmented and questionable as PayPal is simply the payment service, not a currency itself.

Decentralization is really fucking hard to pull off when it comes to monetary practices, especially with governments controlling currencies.

And with companies wanting to operate in those countries, and pay their employees etc.

But look what it's achieved so far and where the technology is heading. How can you not see further than your nose?

What has it achieved so far? I honestly haven't seen anything I could really call a "big win", so if I've missed something please let me know.

When I'm getting sick and tired of losing value due to the loss of purchasing power year after year, I'll go to crypto.

Why would crypto be immune from inflation? Prices for things go up even without "money printer go brrrrrrrrrrr", so even if we ignore the volatility of most crypto's pricing won't remain static in an economy.

When I, as a company, move money to various accounts all around the globe with time being of the essence due to liquidity being paramount, I'll go to crypto.

Except that if you're a global company you have access to all kinds of tools to move money around quickly and deal with exchange rates.

When a hyperinflationary event takes place in the coming years, I'll go to crypto.

Why would there be hyperinflation? What country(ies) are going to start turning the money printers to 11?

All roads eventually lead to fiat losing its way

They do? Can you share more on this? Are there any articles on this I can learn more by reading? I don't see this at all.

[hellhamster]

I mean this person lives in a world where their local groceries and shops apparently accepts crypto and Paypal no problem, take what you will from that. Me, I wouldn't trust their takes from here on out.

I also love their conspiracy theories around Musk's tweets, as if the pump and dump/trolling explanation isn't miles easier to justify and totally in character as well.

Well, time will tell who was right.

[Edge-]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tommybe...rs-in-bitcoin/

But has anyone taken them up on it? I'm not seeing anything about players/staff switching from their normal paychecks to BTC. The cynic in me sees them likely sitting on a bunch of crypto they don't know what to do with following their choice to start accepting it at games, and they're looking to dump it. And if you can swap player payments from fiat currency to crypto, that's a no-cost way to dump it and let others figure out the problem of liquidating it so it's useful.

[hellhamster]

Yes, and PayPal predates crypto by quite a bit, so that it's taking so long for PayPal adoption should give you an idea on the timeline for crypto, which is far more fragmented and questionable as PayPal is simply the payment service, not a currency itself.



And with companies wanting to operate in those countries, and pay their employees etc.



What has it achieved so far? I honestly haven't seen anything I could really call a "big win", so if I've missed something please let me know.



Why would crypto be immune from inflation? Prices for things go up even without "money printer go brrrrrrrrrrr", so even if we ignore the volatility of most crypto's pricing won't remain static in an economy.



Except that if you're a global company you have access to all kinds of tools to move money around quickly and deal with exchange rates.



Why would there be hyperinflation? What country(ies) are going to start turning the money printers to 11?



They do? Can you share more on this? Are there any articles on this I can learn more by reading? I don't see this at all.

Paypal is just one service, more will come as the public becomes more aware and inclined to use their crypto. So far, most people don't even know what it is.

Companies have shown time and time again that they are way more flexible and can adapt faster than governments.

The total market capitalization of crypto is increasing exponentially, being over $2 trillion right now. I'd say that's a pretty big win for an asset class that is supposedly purely speculative.

Inflation is impossible with a limited supply, which is what's most cryptocurrencies are all about. In contrast, your purchasing power increases with every transaction using a limited medium of transaction. Fiat, being infinite, works inflationary with every transaction, propelled by an increase of money velocity. Volatility will be removed once the speculative facet wanes due to adoption.

Even established companies waste a huge amount of money and, more importantly, a huge amount of time trying to move liquidity around.

The money printers have begun printing at an insane rate, exacerbated by the covid pandemic. Read more here: https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/05/the-...in-the-us.html

So far it's under control, but it can go tits up at a moment's notice especially now that markets are opening up again. Evidence is noted by commodities, assets, stock markets, derivatives etc all exploding in price in the last year, when unemployment especially is at an all time high.

We are, by definition, in a zombie economy.

[Edge-]

The total market capitalization of crypto is increasing exponentially, being over $2 trillion right now. I'd say that's a pretty big win for an asset class that is supposedly purely speculative.

Honestly, this worries me more than anything else. That it's seeing such massive and rampant speculation while still having minimal utility seems like a recipe for disaster to me.

Inflation is impossible with a limited supply, which is what's most cryptocurrencies are all about.

That presumes fiat currencies die out and crypto becomes the standard, along with a few other magical things. And that only handles issues surrounding monetary driven inflation, not standard inflation that often comes as prices of things may increase over time. Worker pay goes up? Maybe products cost 2% more, that's inflation crypto can't stop.

In contrast, your purchasing power increases with every transaction using a limited medium of transaction.

Given the extreme volatility we see on a daily basis, this doesn't seem accurate at all.

Fiat, being infinite, works inflationary with every transaction, propelled by an increase of money velocity. Volatility will be removed once the speculative facet wanes due to adoption.

They will always be speculative as long as they remain backed by nothing, that's kinda the point. And tying it to something like gold is a terrible idea, we moved away from the gold standard for a reason, so the current alternatives I've seen are to tie it to...fiat currencies.

Also, the long-existing lack of inflation despite insanely low interest rates like, kinda counters what you allege here. Inflation isn't worked into every transaction, that's not why it's remained persistently low over the years.

Even established companies waste a huge amount of money and, more importantly, a huge amount of time trying to move liquidity around.

Quantify this for me then, because I guess I don't understand it.

The money printers have begun printing at an insane rate, exacerbated by the covid pandemic. Read more here: https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/05/the-...in-the-us.html

Yes...and we actually need some inflation. Inflation is a function of economics, and it's good to a point.

We are, by definition, in a zombie economy.

Well right now yeah...we're still in the midst of a global pandemic that's gutted global economies and required countries to prop up business so they don't fold. It's what's supposed to happen in a situation like this, and if companies can't regain their footing afterwards that's on them.

How would crypto handle the current situation, out of curiosity? Without the ability to add money into the economy, would everyone just have been massively fucked over the past year or something?

[Fluttershy]

What has it achieved so far? I honestly haven't seen anything I could really call a "big win", so if I've missed something please let me know

https://thetokenizer.io/2021/02/10/p...energy-sector/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnb...mperature.html

https://mobile.twitter.com/hedera/st...35464216215552 = emtech already has cbdc for the bahamas and ghana

https://cointelegraph.com/news/eftpo...mpression=true

https://www.google.com/amp/s/cointel...e-operator/amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/finance...140100069.html

I can go on and on with the use case of DLTs. Notice how not a single one of these use ledgers as a "currency" ? Anyone who thinks any crypto outside central bank digital currency can replace fiat is an idiot.

[Edge-]

https://thetokenizer.io/2021/02/10/p...energy-sector/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnb...mperature.html

https://mobile.twitter.com/hedera/st...35464216215552 = emtech already has cbdc for the bahamas and ghana

https://cointelegraph.com/news/eftpo...mpression=true

https://www.google.com/amp/s/cointel...e-operator/amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/finance...140100069.html

I can go on and on with the use case of DLTs. Notice how not a single one of these use ledgers as a "currency" ? Anyone who thinks any crypto outside central bank digital currency can replace fiat is an idiot.

First link is for a UK company that appears to have a single investor and less than 10 employees, not exactly much of an accomplishment - https://www.crunchbase.com/organizat...wer-transition

250K British Pounds ain't a huge investment.

CNBC is about blockchain, not crypto.

Twitter link for Emtech is similarly a tiny company, though bigger than Power Transition. This is literally just a white paper dude.

Eftpos is similarly blockchain tech, not crypto.

Electricite de France is similarly embracing blockchain, not crypto.

Last link for Hala Systems similarly seems to be about blockchain as a security tool for their early conflict warning system, not crypto.

I was asking about what "big wins" crypto has had, I'm well aware that blockchain tech itself is being continually improved and as those improvements happen has increased utility for a lot of networks as a security measure.

[Muzjhath]

So far*.

Crypto is only a decade old and started off in the underbelly of the internet, just give it some time. Decentralization is really fucking hard to pull off when it comes to monetary practices, especially with governments controlling currencies. But look what it's achieved so far and where the technology is heading. How can you not see further than your nose?

When I'm getting sick and tired of losing value due to the loss of purchasing power year after year, I'll go to crypto. When I, as a company, move money to various accounts all around the globe with time being of the essence due to liquidity being paramount, I'll go to crypto. When a hyperinflationary event takes place in the coming years, I'll go to crypto.

All roads eventually lead to fiat losing its way, unless central banks find some magical method to keep it afloat. So far, the only solution is to just create more out of thin air.

Let's see how long we'll last. Or rather, I really wish I won't, because it won't be pretty.

Or, you can as I suggested, use wise.com and have the money you move insured.

[Fluttershy]

First link is for a UK company that appears to have a single investor and less than 10 employees, not exactly much of an accomplishment - https://www.crunchbase.com/organizat...wer-transition

250K British Pounds ain't a huge investment.

CNBC is about blockchain, not crypto.

Twitter link for Emtech is similarly a tiny company, though bigger than Power Transition. This is literally just a white paper dude.

Eftpos is similarly blockchain tech, not crypto.

Electricite de France is similarly embracing blockchain, not crypto.

Last link for Hala Systems similarly seems to be about blockchain as a security tool for their early conflict warning system, not crypto.

I was asking about what "big wins" crypto has had, I'm well aware that blockchain tech itself is being continually improved and as those improvements happen has increased utility for a lot of networks as a security measure.

The LEDGER and the native coin are not separateable.

They are used for governance, consensus and for fees. Stop taking the term "cryptocurrency" literally, they are only "currency" in name.

There is no DLT ("blockchain" for you) that has no native coin, how the hell would it function? Do you actually know how proof of stake works?

[gordon15wp]

250K British Pounds ain't a huge investment.

It depends in what exact things you're going to invest them...

[Edge-]

The LEDGER and the native coin are not separateable.

They are used for governance, consensus and for fees. Stop taking the term "cryptocurrency" literally, they are only "currency" in name.

There is no DLT ("blockchain" for you) that has no native coin, how the hell would it function? Do you actually know how proof of stake works?

So what the fuck is actual crypto"currency" then? Why do people keep wanting us to pay for shit with it? You're making me more confused now, and given how many explanations I've had to listen to about blockchain and crypto I'm getting tired of people being unable to explain this magical technology.

[Fluttershy]

So what the fuck is actual crypto"currency" then? Why do people keep wanting us to pay for shit with it? You're making me more confused now, and given how many explanations I've had to listen to about blockchain and crypto I'm getting tired of people being unable to explain this magical technology.

They are idiots thats why, bitcoin was originally meant to be used as currency but its shitty coding, slow, extremely wasteful for power, high fees, etc

Here, watch the 16:40 timestamp

https://youtu.be/IjQkag6VOo0?t=1005

[Edge-]

They are idiots thats why, bitcoin was originally meant to be used as currency but its shitty coding, slow, extremely wasteful for power, high fees, etc

Here, watch the 16:40 timestamp

https://youtu.be/IjQkag6VOo0?t=1005

I'm not look in for a ted talk right now, but I'll listen to it later.

Still doesn't change the rampant currency speculation, pushes for the practical use/acceptance of everything from Bitcoin to fucking Dogecoin etc. which I guess isn't "real" cryptocurrency or something.

[Fluttershy]

I'm not look in for a ted talk right now, but I'll listen to it later.

Still doesn't change the rampant currency speculation, pushes for the practical use/acceptance of everything from Bitcoin to fucking Dogecoin etc. which I guess isn't "real" cryptocurrency or something.

They are retards, almost all money in btc/doge is all retail investors and grifters, they only put money on it cause "bitcoin only go up lol" see : michael saylor

Dogecoin is LITERALLY made to be a joke with copy pasted code by the original creator,

Hedera is governed and owned by IBM, banks, major law firms, etc and thats why there is ACTUAL institutional use

[Muzjhath]

,

Hedera is governed and owned by IBM, banks, major law firms, etc and thats why there is ACTUAL institutional use

I'd argue any use where the tokens are used for other significance than just value as coin/fiat shouldn't be clumped under the umbrella of cryptocurrency.
Blockchain tokens used for security has great applications. For identity as well.
"Coins"? Less so.

[Shadowferal]

Dow falls 400 points as Bitcoin, other cryptocurrencies plummet

“It’s a sea of red this morning following Tuesday’s lackluster session, despite a fresh set of solid results from the retail sector,” wrote JJ Kinahan, chief market strategist at TD Ameritrade, in a Wednesday analysis.

Kinahan cited China’s decision to ban cryptocurrency transactions and lingering inflation fears as the primary drivers behind Wednesday’s rough open.

- - - Updated - - -

Bitcoin loses all gains since Musk comments in February

The cryptocurrency Bitcoin has lost its gains after a rise in value in February when Tesla CEO Elon Musk said that his company would accept the cryptocurrency to purchase Tesla vehicles, Bloomberg reported.

Bitcoin took a dive of almost 22 percent to $35,000, a decrease that has wiped out more than $500 billion from the currency's peak market value, according to Bloomberg.

The decrease marks almost a complete loss in gains since Tesla announced Feb. 8 that it would buy Bitcoin and accept the currency to buy the company's electric vehicles. At its peak, Bitcoin was worth over $64,000.

Other cryptocurrencies such as Dogecoin and Ethereum also fell over 40 percent, according to the news outlet.

The news comes after a series of dizzying tweets from Musk about the cryptocurrency that threw investors last week. Musk that his company has suspended sales of vehicles using Bitcoin, citing concern of rapid use of fossil fuel for Bitcion’s mining and transactions.