An insight on Bitcoin

[Elegiac]

this is from a blog but its a pretty good go of it

Oh boy I'm gonna requote this part in particular because it is one of the best summaries of cryptocurrency I have ever seen:

Bitcoin ideology bought into the entire Federal Reserve conspiracy package. The Fed is a plot to use inflation to steal value from the people and hand it to a shadowy cabal of elites who also control the government; the worldwide economy is in danger of collapse at any moment due to central banking and fractional reserve banking; gold – sorry, Bitcoin – has intrinsic value that will protect you from this collapse. Advocates repackage and propagate these ideas almost verbatim, even when they almost certainly don’t know who or where they trace back to.

@Edge there's the dire threat that fiat currency poses to the common man that only crypto can save us from, lol.

[Edge-]

https://medium.com/@coinandcrypto/ho...p-a8d4a1622df8

Heyyyyy, a guide to how you too can join in the profiteering off of pump-n-dump crypto schemes!

Is this the hallmark of a stable, reputable currency?

[Howel]

https://medium.com/@coinandcrypto/ho...p-a8d4a1622df8

Heyyyyy, a guide to how you too can join in the profiteering off of pump-n-dump crypto schemes!

Is this the hallmark of a stable, reputable currency?

Uhm... Yes. There are cases of FIAT currency speculation and, pump-n-dump-esque methods one can use. Of course, the margins are absolutely minimal, and your investments have to be absolutely massive to see any profits off it (which is more fun when it fails, and those people lose out). But it is something that happens, occasionally, usually in currencies that are already headed downwards.

[Elegiac]

Uhm... Yes. There are cases of FIAT currency speculation and, pump-n-dump-esque methods one can use. Of course, the margins are absolutely minimal, and your investments have to be absolutely massive to see any profits off it (which is more fun when it fails, and those people lose out). But it is something that happens, occasionally, usually in currencies that are already headed downwards.

So, it is not in fact the hallmark of a stable and reputable currency?

If crypto traders are so desperate for a commodity to bank in case of fiat currency collapse just stock up on cigarettes and learn how to give a half decent handjob - we know from prison economies that they're clearly the most stable financial instruments in existence, lol.

[Edge-]

Uhm... Yes. There are cases of FIAT currency speculation and, pump-n-dump-esque methods one can use. Of course, the margins are absolutely minimal, and your investments have to be absolutely massive to see any profits off it (which is more fun when it fails, and those people lose out). But it is something that happens, occasionally, usually in currencies that are already headed downwards.

Can you think of any off the top of your head? I honestly can't think of one, and some casual searching around just turns up a lot of stuff on cryptocurrencies rather than an actual fiat currency pump n dump scheme.

Though to the bolded...if the currency is already headed that way, it's already lost its value and it's likely not going to be any part of some pump n dump scheme. That's like, a feature of fiat currencies, big trends downwards aren't just random blips on a volatile market value graph, they're indicative of bigger structural issues for the currency and the country backing it.

[Howel]

So, it is not in fact the hallmark of a stable and reputable currency?

If crypto traders are so desperate for a commodity to bank in case of fiat currency collapse just stock up on cigarettes and learn how to give a half decent handjob - if prison economies have taught us anything they're clearly the most suitable financial instruments for their needs.

Nah, there you only do standard speculation, which again, requires massive investments with very marginal returns.

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Can you think of any off the top of your head? I honestly can't think of one, and some casual searching around just turns up a lot of stuff on cryptocurrencies rather than an actual fiat currency pump n dump scheme.

Though to the bolded...if the currency is already headed that way, it's already lost its value and it's likely not going to be any part of some pump n dump scheme. That's like, a feature of fiat currencies, big trends downwards aren't just random blips on a volatile market value graph, they're indicative of bigger structural issues for the currency and the country backing it.

The Greek currency was victim off it, when they were heading south. It is not a particularly normal thing nor something one should be screaming to the skies about being the end of the world, I just had to point out that it is something that does occur, so one can't entirely brush it off as something that doesn't happen at all. Wasn't a point for or against anything, just a fact to the conversation

[Edge-]

Nah, there you only do standard speculation, which again, requires massive investments with very marginal returns.

You write this as if it's a bug when like, that's kind a feature? Again, stability is a huge boon to fiat currencies and is generally something economists really like.

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The Greek currency was victim off it, when they were heading south.

It was on the Euro come 2009, hadn't been on its own currency for nearly a decade at that point. That was a budget/debt problem, not a problem related to it using the Euro.

It is not a particularly normal thing nor something one should be screaming to the skies about being the end of the world, I just had to point out that it is something that does occur, so one can't entirely brush it off as something that doesn't happen at all. Wasn't a point for or against anything, just a fact to the conversation

But it's not related to its use of the Euro, which it would seem to need to be to fit as an example here. If Greece was on crypto, it wouldn't have mattered because their problems were with their economy as a whole, not their currencies and currency value fluctuations.

[Howel]

You write this as if it's a bug when like, that's kind a feature? Again, stability is a huge boon to fiat currencies and is generally something economists really like.

I would say it is neither, it just exists, because something of value exists that has ebs and flows in it. But yeah, it is indicative of FIATs stability, and also a notion of why currently in its form, cryptocurrency is something no economist worth their salt would touch outside of a purely speculative concept.

[Elegiac]

You know what, I am fucking idiot... I was conflating debt speculation with currency speculation. Just forget I ever said something, this was a monumental blunder on my part.

It's fine, honey. At least you aren't a crypto trader.

[Edge-]

I would say it is neither, it just exists, because something of value exists that has ebs and flows in it.

From an economic standpoint, it actually is good. Yes, value will fluctuate over time, but the fact that it largely remains stable and isn't prone to double digit dips and valleys, and doesn't change its value over the course of a decade by triple digit increases/decreases is a huge boon.

But yeah, it is indicative of FIATs stability, and also a notion of why currently in its form, cryptocurrency is something no economist worth their salt would touch outside of a purely speculative concept.

Bingo, which is why it remains kinda some pie in the sky nonsense right now and nothing that anyone outside crypto circles takes too seriously.

The fact that crypto circles still have such a challenging recruiting others and convincing them of the worth of crypto as a whole, especially within economic circles, speaks volumes.

[Howel]

It's fine, honey. At least you aren't a crypto trader.

I mean I am, but only as a investment, not because I have some vested interest in totally taking down the man

[callipygoustp]

My other favorite comments in these bitcoin related threads are those arguing/suggesting that the US dollar has no real backing. Very convincing.

[Howel]

Bingo, which is why it remains kinda some pie in the sky nonsense right now and nothing that anyone outside crypto circles takes too seriously.

The fact that crypto circles still have such a challenging recruiting others and convincing them of the worth of crypto as a whole, especially within economic circles, speaks volumes.

I think the circle part is what speaks the most about it to me. I've yet to encounter anyone that isn't fairly sizably invested into crypto, and totally is for it.

Just like I've yet to encounter any homeless or poor people, that are super into libertarianism. It is usually people on the edge of being rich enough to have a good day-to-day car, and then an expensive sports car, but those pesky taxes are in the way for society to become good (AKA society = sports car for me).

[Acidbaron]

My problem with bitcoin is, we are all told to make an effort to reduce or carbon footprint to think more about the environment and than you have this being promoted and mining being promoted.

Some people i guess believe energy is some sort of magical resource that just comes out of no where with no environmental cost attached to it. I think people are greatly unaware of how much this whole mining operation needs to keep these coins going and they keep making more. 2500 watt for a mining setup is nothing.

It's a coin that can be used for mostly criminal enterprises to benefit of, i will stick to stocks with a nice average 7% growth. Big companies that buy coin do so with the intention to sell not invest long term in it, i mean that's not really a sign of trust that even they believe this will be around 10, 20 years from now. I think once more people become aware that with all the efforts governments and people are making to build up more sustainable energy that these cryptocoins much like oil and cigarettes will start to lose public appeal.

Chances are the coins might also continue to grow in criminal circles and governments will eventually go against that with yet another War on terror...drugs... etc.

[Mister K]

might as well go into the caves again? lmao

you admit crypto energy is better used on....well...anything and then pretend its vital. Its not its garbage and completely unimportant.

Vital? Never said that. Once again. I will just quote myself.

Civilisations only get greater with larger power consumptions and if we can't handle mining crypto we might as well go into caves again because the use of silicon is only going to get greater. Hey sure we could use all that power for greater good like folding but I am pretty sure most of us here aren't exactly eco-friendly, no matter how many oat drinks we might drink.

Straight over the head tho aint that.

[Elegiac]

Civilisations only get greater with larger power consumptions and if we can't handle mining crypto we might as well go into caves again

It was a silly thing to say the first time, sweaty, since many civilizations have driven themselves to collapse by plundering their resources beyond sustainability.

Providing a mechanism for individuals to put out emissions on par with small cities (which isn't remotely comparable to the actual individual footprints even including agriculture, so shove off with that 'hurr durr oatmilk' gotcha) so some dudebros can gamble on the latest unregulated financial instrument du jour is wasteful no matter what way you spin it.

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The way some people (most, from my experience) talk about Bitcoin specifically, I would swear it was a genuine cult.

That's because it is.

"Buy bitcoin" is the new "buy gold".

[Fluttershy]

Imagine having more faith in something that's being printed by the trillions and handed to bankers/insiders as opposed to something that's openly visible, finite and far harder to manipulate by our big nosed friends.

[Calfredd]

Imagine having more faith in something that's being printed by the trillions and handed to bankers/insiders as opposed to something that's openly visible, finite and far harder to manipulate by our big nosed friends.

What do big noses have anything to do with cryptocurrency being shady?

[jonnysensible]

What do big noses have anything to do with cryptocurrency being shady?

antisemitic crypto guy, imagine my surprise.

[Cæli]

the long term effect of bitcoin is massive deflation (instead of consuming, people hold on their savings because they know it'll increase in value)
which removes waste and over consumption, in favor of only what people really want to consume
which is a kind of extreme ecology