Israel and Palestine Conflict Heats Up

[Felya]

Erm... That's exactly what I'm saying... What's wrong with you dude. Jesus christ.

You just denied something that is a basic reality, to ask what is wrong with me... I think you have a problem that Israel withdrawing from Gaza, hurts your narrative, so you need to continue to deny reality, by insulting me. It’s obvious...

Not sure, we could ask them. No you're right. Gaza had two years of pure freedom!

You are still denying the basic fact, that Israel withdrew from Gaza? Are you planing to dig up Arafat and take away his Nobel peace prize that resulted from it?

[PC2]

how you are this inept at empathizing with other people yet claim to care so much is staggering.

I empathize with both populations but yeah I empathize with Israelis more because I view them as more rational actors. Maybe you view Palestinians as more rational or you view both sides as being equally irrational, which we simply disagree in that case.

Also which culture I support in a disagreement is heavily influenced by how tolerant they are especially in regards to free expression and self-criticism. In Israel their society and government tolerates many different and opposing views and there is always lively debates. Where as in Palestine they are much more likely to get killed if they criticize their own culture, religion, leaders, policies, and so on.

[Cringefest]

You just denied something that is a basic reality, to ask what is wrong with me... I think you have a problem that Israel withdrawing from Gaza, hurts your narrative, so you need to continue to deny reality, by insulting me. It’s obvious...



You are still denying the basic fact, that Israel withdrew from Gaza? Are you planing to dig up Arafat and take away his Nobel peace prize that resulted from it?

Im sorry I wish to continue this conversation but I literally do not know what you mean. Maybe calm down a little and rephrase?

[Felya]

Im sorry I wish to continue this conversation but I literally do not know what you mean. Maybe calm down a little and rephrase?

How am I the one that needs to calm down, when you are insulting me and replying like this?

Israel withdrew from Garza... you not being able to acknowledge that, is not a fault with me... it doesn’t mean I’m mad. /shrug

Edit: Can you add a joker “why so serious” meme for old times sake?

[Captain Proton]

Straight up lying...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel...ment_from_Gaza

Do you even read what you link?

The United Nations, international human rights organizations and many legal scholars regard the Gaza Strip to still be under military occupation by Israel.[5] This is disputed by Israel and other legal scholars.[6] Following the withdrawal, Israel has continued to maintain direct control over Gaza's air and maritime space, and six of Gaza's seven land crossings, it maintains a no-go buffer zone within the territory, and controls the Palestinian population registry, and Gaza remains dependent on Israel for its water, electricity, telecommunications, and other utilities.

The unilateral disengagement plan has been criticized from various viewpoints. In Israel, it has been criticized by the settlers themselves, supported by the Israeli right, who saw Ariel Sharon's action as a betrayal of his previous policies of support of settlement. Conversely, the disengagement has been criticized by parts of the Israeli left, who viewed it as nothing more than a mode of stalling negotiations and increasing Israeli presence in the West Bank.[citation needed] The disengagement also did not address wider issues of occupation. Israel retained control over Gaza's borders, airspace, coastline, infrastructure, power, import-exports, etc.

[Theodarzna]

Pick up a history book my friend.

Well apparently to discuss with you I cannot read any history book talking about anything that happened before 2002, and history starts in 2002. So what gives? I talk history and you say "Shit, if it happened over 20 years ago it doesn't matter"? Which is it?

[Cringefest]

Theo:

Between 1947 and 1949, at least 750,000 Palestinians from a 1.9 million population were made refugees beyond the borders of the state. Zionist forces had taken more than 78 percent of historic Palestine, ethnically cleansed and destroyed about 530 villages and cities, and killed about 15,000 Palestinians in a series of mass atrocities, including more than 70 massacres.

And also, pretty extensive:

https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aj...e_main.html#t3

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Well apparently to discuss with you I cannot read any history book talking about anything that happened before 2002, and history starts in 2002. So what gives? I talk history and you say "Shit, if it happened over 20 years ago it doesn't matter"? Which is it?

For someone that talks about history, you seem to not know much about it my friend.

[Theodarzna]

I...

You...

Like...do you even understand that Israel is the one doing the robbing and beating in this context?

I guess if history starts 20 years ago, though I'm aware of events and the history going back just a smidgen longer than that.

[Cringefest]

How am I the one that needs to calm down, when you are insulting me and replying like this?

Israel withdrew from Garza... you not being able to acknowledge that, is not a fault with me... it doesn’t mean I’m mad. /shrug

Edit: Can you add a joker “why so serious” meme for old times sake?

I did acknowledge that Palestinians had "freedom" for 2 whole years!
I did that sarcastically by the way because they never did withdrew.
"Following the withdrawal, Israel has continued to maintain direct control over Gaza's air and maritime space, and six of Gaza's seven land crossings, it maintains a no-go buffer zone within the territory, and controls the Palestinian population registry, and Gaza remains dependent on Israel for its water, electricity, telecommunications, and other utilities."

Your link ^^^

[Felya]

Do you even read what you link?

You literally bolder... following the withdrawal... you copied it from an article about Israel withdrawing... The fact that hamas was able to take over Gaza, is because Israel withdrew. Bibi literally proposed returning just two days ago. This is absurd...

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I did acknowledge that Palestinians had "freedom" for 2 whole years!
I did that sarcastically by the way because they never did withdrew.
"Following the withdrawal, Israel has continued to maintain direct control over Gaza's air and maritime space, and six of Gaza's seven land crossings, it maintains a no-go buffer zone within the territory, and controls the Palestinian population registry, and Gaza remains dependent on Israel for its water, electricity, telecommunications, and other utilities."

Your link ^^^

That does not change the fact that Israel withdrew from Gaza. There are no Israeli military or police in Gaza. It’s why hamas killed and continues to kill so many Palestinians.

I will ask you again... what did Israel get in return for withdrawing?

Edit: I never claimed that Palestinians gained freedom... that’s all you buddy...

Edit 2: Sorry... “freedom”...

Edit 3: ... and to just refresh your memory:

Israel did not withdrew from Gaza and the border wasnt given up.

[Theodarzna]

Theo:

Between 1947 and 1949, at least 750,000 Palestinians from a 1.9 million population were made refugees beyond the borders of the state. Zionist forces had taken more than 78 percent of historic Palestine, ethnically cleansed and destroyed about 530 villages and cities, and killed about 15,000 Palestinians in a series of mass atrocities, including more than 70 massacres.

And also, pretty extensive:

https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aj...e_main.html#t3

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For someone that talks about history, you seem to not know much about it my friend.

Ahh, so we CAN talk about history before 2002? Or are we only permitted to discuss things selectively and only cite that which presents the Arabs in the most flattering way possible? Heck, lets just cite Hamas' and Fatah's own accounts? So on the one hand all historical facts before 2002 don't matter, but also they do but only when they present the Arabs in the post positive light possible. Fascinating man.

[Captain Proton]

You literally bolder... following the withdrawal... you copied it from an article about Israel withdrawing... The fact that hamas was able to take over Gaza, is because Israel withdrew. Bibi literally proposed returning just two days ago. This is absurd...

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That does not change the fact that Israel withdrew from Gaza. There are no Israeli military or police in Gaza. It’s why hamas killed and continues to kill so many Palestinians.

I will ask you again... what did Israel get in return for withdrawing?

Edit: I never claimed that Palestinians gained freedom... that’s all you buddy...

Edit 2: Sorry... “freedom”...

Edit 3: ... and to just refresh your memory:

They withdrew illegal civilian settlements, big whoop when you're still militarily occupied in every regard.

he Israeli disengagement from Gaza (Hebrew: תוכנית ההתנתקות‎, Tokhnit HaHitnatkut) was the unilateral dismantling in 2005 of the 21 Israeli settlements in the Gaza Strip and the evacuation of the settlers and Israeli army from inside the Gaza Strip.

That's hardly a fucking withdrawl. Try reading the bolded parts again, its why they're bolded.

[Endus]

I empathize with both populations but yeah I empathize with Israelis more because I view them as more rational actors. Maybe you view Palestinians as more rational or you view both sides as being equally irrational, which we simply disagree in that case.

Also which culture I support in a disagreement is heavily influenced by how tolerant they are especially in regards to free expression and self-criticism. In Israel their society and government tolerates many different and opposing views and there is always lively debates. Where as in Palestine they are much more likely to get killed if they criticize their own culture, religion, leaders, policies, and so on.

Y'know, trying to rationalize racism like this doesn't make it not-racism.

[Gaidax]

They withdrew illegal civilian settlements, big whoop when you're still militarily occupied in every regard.

That's hardly a fucking withdrawl. Try reading the bolded parts again, its why they're bolded.

2005 withdrawal from Gaza withdrew everything - military, police and Israeli citizens from Gaza strip to what amounts to 1967 border there.

2 years later Hamas took over, killed and exiled their political opponents creating rift between Palestinians that persists to this day.

You can whitewash it all you like, but that's history.

[Cringefest]

You literally bolder... following the withdrawal... you copied it from an article about Israel withdrawing... The fact that hamas was able to take over Gaza, is because Israel withdrew. Bibi literally proposed returning just two days ago. This is absurd...

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That does not change the fact that Israel withdrew from Gaza. There are no Israeli military or police in Gaza. It’s why hamas killed and continues to kill so many Palestinians.

I will ask you again... what did Israel get in return for withdrawing?

Edit: I never claimed that Palestinians gained freedom... that’s all you buddy...

Edit 2: Sorry... “freedom”...

Edit 3: ... and to just refresh your memory:

Your own link answers your question.

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Ahh, so we CAN talk about history before 2002? Or are we only permitted to discuss things selectively and only cite that which presents the Arabs in the most flattering way possible? Heck, lets just cite Hamas' and Fatah's own accounts? So on the one hand all historical facts before 2002 don't matter, but also they do but only when they present the Arabs in the post positive light possible. Fascinating man.

That's al Jazeera. You were depicting Israel as this innocent entity throughout the years. You're wrong. Simply as.

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2005 withdrawal from Gaza withdrew everything - military, police and Israeli citizens from Gaza strip to what amounts to 1967 border there.

2 years later Hamas took over, killed and exiled their political opponents creating rift between Palestinians that persists to this day.

You can whitewash it all you like, but that's history.

Actually it's not. Israel kept control of borders as per reported. That's history. Yours are opinions.

[Gaidax]

Actually it's not. Israel kept control of borders as per reported. That's history. Yours are opinions.

What, we're not allowed to enforce our own borders with what amounts to terrorist entity state? Funny.

You have crossing with Egypt completely under their control - go pester them, Che.

[PC2]

Y'know, trying to rationalize racism like this doesn't make it not-racism.

No I was saying I think Israelis act more rationally than Palestinians. All races must be equally rational in my opinion so it has nothing to do with Arabs or Jews or anything genetic.

[Cringefest]

What, we're not allowed to enforce our own borders with what amounts to terrorist entity state? Funny.

You have crossing with Egypt completely under their control - go pester them, Che.

They enforce the blockade too, lol.

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No I was saying I think Israelis act more rationally than Palestinians. All races must be equally rational in my opinion so it has nothing to do with Arabs or Jews or anything genetic.

They really don't though. Extremism is rabid on both sides. Look at who they elected.

[Gaidax]

They enforce the blockade too, lol.

Yes, because they don't want even more terrorists in Sinai filling it with weapons, than they already have.

Even their "brothers" are locking them out, not sure what do you want from us. We're out of there, it's back to 1967 border there, what else? You want us to open borders free for all into Israel with guys who literally just tossed 4k missiles our way? Funny.

/shrug

[Theodarzna]

That's al Jazeera. You were depicting Israel as this innocent entity throughout the years. You're wrong. Simply as.

Ah, so can I cite the Jewish Virtual Library? Times of Israel? I wonder.

And what became of:

1) I'm really not interested in going further back than the past 20 years.

So, when I bring up any historical facts that interject some nuance into this morality play you have ginned up you act all mealy mouthed and say "Sure maybe, but sins of the grandfathers shouldn't count and that was over 20 years ago! lets live in the present!" but when it suites you, some facts from before 20 years ago matter and are very important. Wild.