"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
I don't pay blizzard anything more than my monthly sub. I do end content also. Pay 2 Win means if you want to do something like get 2.4k in arenas or mythic the latest raid then you would only be able to get that done by paying $$$ so that you can be on par and do it. Because you don't have to pay anyone anything to get any of these done it isn't P2W. Its your own choice to pay.
It's direct because it's directly available in the game itself.
I am spending cash to up my power. That is P2W.
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Where in the world does it say that you have to? The definition is in the phrase itself. You pay, to win.
Doesn't matter how, or why, or how many steps. You're still paying cash in exchange for power.
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Exactly. You only get a chance, which is even shittier considering how much you gotta pay for that chance.
Chance or no chance though. You are still paying.. to win.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
What they are saying is that the moment you add ANY additional step in, it immediately stops being P2W. So unless you swipe your card and the actual items are sent to your in game mail, it is not P2W. For example, apparently purchasing Tier Tokens with a credit card, which are traded at a vendor for mythic raid gear would NOT be P2W, because you buy the Tier Token with the card, not the item itself, and the Tier Token does not grant you power.
Which means you do not directly buy the power with cash like you've claimed. Having to go to players and ask them to offer a run at that moment is not direct.
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It is weird that you cling to a lie when you've been directly told that the situation you describe would be pay to win and is 100% different to how the token functions. A tier token supplied by blizzard from a blizzard vendor is direct pay to win. The tier token in your example does grant power because its sole purpose is to grant gear, the power, for your real money transaction. Thus pay to win.
The purpose of gold is not just to grant power. The power it can grant is a natural part of the game design since Vanilla (BoE and group play). You pay for gold to skip the effort needed to farm it yourself. What you do with the gold does not mean the purchasing of gold is a win.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
How does having gold grant you an advantage over other players in the game? A subscription technically gives advantages over a free/starter trial account. But both are indirect cash for power transactions if we use your definitions. But a subscription is not pay to win and a token is not as well. The gold gained from a token was already the advantage of another player. That player choose to give you their advantage so you didn't gain something other players do not have already.
It is why the design of the currency and source matter to a discussion like this.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
What are you talking about? These services are directly in the game.
I'll buy gold to purchase these things and Bkuzz receives 100% of the proceeds. P2W.
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How doesn't it hold an advantage? Players without it can't afford these boosts. Purchasing the gold allows you to undermine the work that goes into making the gold organically. You're skipping the process of farming so that you can get what you want faster.
That's exactly P2W lol
$15 goes to the player that gave you their gold. $5 goes to Blizzard. The cash transaction is directly for gold. It has nothing to do with what you intend to use the gold for. There is no direct link to winning when you use the token. "Directly in the game" is meaningless.
How do players afford to buy tokens with gold? It does not undermine the work that goes into making the gold because a player did that work for you. You purchase that work from a player by giving them $15. You skip the process of farming as you say. You don't win gear by buying the token as you just stated. It can't be pay to win.How doesn't it hold an advantage? Players without it can't afford these boosts. Purchasing the gold allows you to undermine the work that goes into making the gold organically. You're skipping the process of farming so that you can get what you want faster.
Last edited by rhorle; 2021-06-15 at 11:40 PM.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
That's an opinion, not a fact. Why people can't understand that is beyond me. It's very simple. Water is wet. That is a fact. Fire is hot. That is a fact. Saying a game is pay to win is an opinion. Or perhaps a belief. But not a fact.
And so what if Blizzard profits off the token? They also profit off the game itself. And the merchandise they sell. They're a business, and the purpose of having a business is to make money. This is not a new concept. If they didn't make a profit, they wouldn't be able to afford to make games, or pay employees, or anything after a while, and we would have no games to play. Is that really what you want?
How joyous to be in such a place! Where phishing is not only allowed, it is encouraged!
It's meaningless because you want it to be for the sake of your nonsensical argument.
$20 goes directly to Blizzard. Gold enters your pockets, and you give it to another player to boost you.
No matter how many steps, at the end of the day you're spending cash directly to Blizz so that you may buy power.
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Why are you acting as if I'm offended in any way that Blizz profits off of this? It's way better that the cash goes to them and not third party websites.
I'm just stating the fact that purchasing currency to purchase carries and AH gear is P2W.
So that you may buy power. Or may not. Buying gold isn't paying to win because of the steps needed in order to win. You may pay Blizzard $20 but they give $15 to the player that gives you their gold. That is the transaction. Their gold for your $15. What you do with the gold doesn't matter here. It isn't pay to win to buy a token. Gold normally has the ability to grant gear of group play and did so prior to the token even existing. So you don't pay to win anything. You pay to have gold and options gold allows.
Last edited by rhorle; 2021-06-16 at 01:03 AM.
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
Expect new world is owned by a trillion dollar company . At launch ur rite there will be no pay to win items but after 2022 there will be .
Black
You value power, ambition, and darkness. You love power at any cost, and are a corrupting influence on those around you. At your best, you are resourceful and unashamed. At your worst, you are parasitic and amoral. Your symbol is a skull. Your enemies are white and green