Spoiler I can't believe it. Tyrande did something.

[Moonrage]

Again, that is a bullshit ass excuse, its not time consuming from someone with her power lv, she could just blast their ass like she did with Saurfang, or at least one of then, its just bad plot devices and generic villain shenanigans, like the classic villain monologue.

Saurfang was an old orc with no magical abilities or protections. Ysera is a dragon aspect and Tyrande is empowered by an actual goddess. There is no way Sylvanas could've just "blasted" either of them. She was already struggling against Tyrande.

[Syegfryed]

Oh No Galokrond the Dragon they killed when they were PROTODRAGONS. When they didnt knew magic or had titan powers. What a worry for them that must be to fight a weakend version. Which they havent even come close to even revive

weak version? they almost got destroyed by galakrond back then with help, this time no DW, you think they could have taken and super empowered giant zombie dragon? rofl

Also you mean the dragon soul was stronger than alex, not the orcs.

now you know why our logic hold no ground

The dragon soul , the artefact which could oblitarate Icecrown in one spell?

??? and with what source you affirm that?

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Saurfang was an old orc with no magical abilities or protections. Ysera is a dragon aspect and Tyrande is empowered by an actual goddess. There is no way Sylvanas could've just "blasted" either of them. She was already struggling against Tyrande.

i didn't know if you watched the trailer, but she literally lost her powers in there, making her totally vulnerable just like an old orc. Ysera is a dead dragon and sylvanus should be stronger by the Janitor power up.

[Karrde]

I had a good laugh, so once again nothing was achieved and the night warrior arc had a very pitiful payoff. That Tyrande tried to strangle someone, who doesn't need to breath was just amazing XD

Haha This made my day.

[thottstation]

By withdrawing her power, Elune is teaching Tyrande to forgive.

The devs played The Last of Us II, and loved it.

[geco]

By withdrawing her power, Elune is teaching Tyrande to forgive.

The devs played The Last of Us II, and loved it.

My question is why didn't they let us Forgive Nzoth or that evil Troll Priest.
At least they had style.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight]

Well they really suck at portraying the message that vengeance is bad when the persons who have been wronged get no justice and even keep getting chewed by the story, and that those who wronged them, and very often commit incredibly odious and unforgivable don't get the comeuppance they deserve.

[Lane]

I spent an entire expansion, from at least War of Thorns until into SL, wondering how and why Sylvanas was as powerful as she was until we found out she was in league with the Jailer. I don't understand these comments about Tyrande not even being able to defeat her with the power of Elune when Sylvanas has been hulked out on borrowed Jailer power, she is basically the Night Warrior of Zovaal whether she has glowing markings or not. No lore character has been able to touch her except for that scar from Saurfang, in fact, other characters have arguably been powered down a lot. Malfurion, for example, has been an absolute joke from what he should be capable of doing. Neither Jaina or Anduin with Genn were able to fight off a couple of Mawsworn who came to kidnap them.

As far as I'm concerned, this was an equal footing battle, especially if Elune is an Eternal One same as Zovaal, both Tyrande and Sylvanas are basically the champions of their patron eternals.

[Brocksley]

What are people talking about. This was a super bad-ass cinematic.

Sylvanas was awesome
Tyrande was awesome

I liked it too. There wasn't a single moment in the fight where Sylvanas was winning. She was on the defense the whole time. Tyrande just shrugged off the chains that bound other strong heroes. I do think they they can't let Tyrande kill Sylvanas (and not the players) , especially in a cinematic, or the player base would riot.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

If Eluna cared about Tyrande it makes no sense to intervene here and not simply deny the Night Warrior transformation which has always been fatal in the past.

Again, that supposition only works if you don't really think of Elune as a character with no growth. Did she only really cared when she saw the reality that Tyrande's life was actually going to end instead of being just an intellectual awareness of it, in other words, the realization of her real attachment to Tyrande? Or it could also be that Elune, who has always favored her, thought that all of her subjects she could have survived, but realized that at the end not even her could.

The whole "makes no sense" doesn't work as a criticism because we simply don't know Elune's motivations. And I will say that those might end up actually sucking, but for a character that has yet to make an actual appearance, it's an unfair criticism -for now-

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As far as I'm concerned, this was an equal footing battle, especially if Elune is an Eternal One same as Zovaal, both Tyrande and Sylvanas are basically the champions of their patron eternals.

I both like and dislike that.

I really like it because it's just interesting to see two mortals duking it out empowered by eternal beings of cosmic power, but also it gives me pause because I do worry about the power escalation. If eventually all the major conflicts are about beings empowered by cosmic forces, it would really just removes us a lot from the whole being part of the world bit.

[Swnem]

Now that i watched... she actually didn't. XD

She was almost there but ran out of steam. I mean, she couldn't even get an injury on Sylvanas. It was the same usual Sylvanas cartoony villain routine.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

With what we do know and how Elune has acted up until this point as well as the surrounding events, the most logical answer is sadly that Sylvannas needs to be a raid boss so we can't kill her but we want a flashy Night Warrior scene. The way Night Warrior powers have been described and work up until this point do not align with Elune's characterization thus far, and that's the issue. There could be some double-secret 5-D chess for Elune to intervene at this point, but I still surmise that even following such intervention there are better, more consistent, and more believable ways to do so while following the same theme.

I mean the core pin form me is that we just don't know Elune's motivations nor personality, really. We just know she's benevolent and seems to have an attachement for Tyrande, but how far that goes is just speculation. Did Elune allow the other Night Warriors to live and die by her power because that's just what it does to a mortal body? Did she hope for Tyrande to be able to resist it? Was she going to let Tyrande die like the rest but she *couldn't* go through it because of her attachement?

As a slight example for the scene itself, if Tyrande does her little speech to herself to build up power to suicide herself to intercept and kill Sylvannas, regardless of Elune's intent it would've been the most logical thing to intervene before she launches herself to catch Sylvannas so they never get close. If Elune is 'protecting' Tyrande, you don't depower your warrior next to the person who is going to kill them. If Elune wants Sylvannas to escape, you don't give Tyrande the power boost she's asking for to get to Sylvannas flying away. If Elune had second thoughts about Tyrande blowing herself up after she allowed them to grapple, you don't depower Tyrande to the point where she's in danger as you're just having Tyrande jump out of the pan and into the fryer. All this leaves aside the whole history of self-destrutive tendencies of Night Warriors and Elune's apparent disregard and lack of intervention in the past, which makes the situation even more bizarre.

My general problem is that while I'd like to expect a well, thought-out narrative that can have surprises like you suggest, the writing up to this point doesn't really support it. I'd be more inclined to see deus ex machina to 'fix' narrative issues at this point.

I mean that does come across as a bit nitpicky, but I get it; it would have been better if Elune's intentions had been clearer, let's say, she depowers Tyrande, but the moment Sylvanas attempts to harm her, she shields her, but then there's no doubt about Elune's intentions, right?

So right now we have the question as to *why* Elune depowered Tyrande, and AFAIK, the story (in the PTR) implies we will get that answer, so I think I can't give a final opinion until that plays out. I'm really holding my final judgement until that face to face between Elune and Tyrande, and neing honest, while I hope it answer things satisfactorily, I also know it won't be everything I would want, because this is WoW after all.

[Gorsameth]

Again, that supposition only works if you don't really think of Elune as a character with no growth. Did she only really cared when she saw the reality that Tyrande's life was actually going to end instead of being just an intellectual awareness of it, in other words, the realization of her real attachment to Tyrande? Or it could also be that Elune, who has always favored her, thought that all of her subjects she could have survived, but realized that at the end not even her could.

The whole "makes no sense" doesn't work as a criticism because we simply don't know Elune's motivations. And I will say that those might end up actually sucking, but for a character that has yet to make an actual appearance, it's an unfair criticism -for now-

But that is a problem in and of itself with the current storytelling. There is way to much we don't know, and Blizzard probably doesn't know either, because the things we are told are then blatantly ignored.

Like being constantly told that the Night Warrior transformation is fatal and that all previous incarnations have died only for Elune to, apparently, go 'lol nope' this one time.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

A whole lot of assumptions in this post. Literally where did I say anything about W3 or past writing? Don't just make up shit about me, I don't appreciate that. I'm the last person to pretend that Warcrafts writing has ever been good. That's not the point here.

It's just that recently the shit writing has been affecting my favorite character, that's why I'm vocal with my opinion instead of just ignoring it. When something is shit, I call it just that. It's not complicated. Don't make it complicated

I mean yeah, maybe I was off the mark about what is causing your bias, but you yourself admit to it. "The shit writing that has been affecting my favorite character" Have you self reflected on that? Is the writing as atrocious as your posts claim or is there some heavy bias going on? Because that's the thing, a whole lot of your posts where short of pure vitriol, and that is what I think WoW's writing doesn't deserves, because honestly the quality hasn't really changed all that much.

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But that is a problem in and of itself with the current storytelling. There is way to much we don't know, and Blizzard probably doesn't know either, because the things we are told are then blatantly ignored.

Like being constantly told that the Night Warrior transformation is fatal and that all previous incarnations have died only for Elune to, apparently, go 'lol nope' this one time.

Yeah, and if we don't get a good answer it will be a bummer, so that's why I am holding off until that chapter of the campaign, but not after that. We have the set up, but they have to deliver on the pay off, and the odds of that? Eh, not the best, but also not horrible?

[Kithelle]

Grom was literally manipulated by a time traveler to throw away countless lives in an unwinnable battle only for them to get corrupted by demons and have the lightbound convert them.

Id say Grom got the short end of the stick

While not wrong, it wont from him being a enemy to buddy buddies with zero transition...just like how Tyrande and Anduin suddenly forgive Sylvanas.

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Tyrande literally did nothing?

She beat Sylvanas....hate to break it to you

[geco]

Tyrande literally did nothing?

Dress up Tyrande against Sylvanas in BFA.
or fighting on the Warfront?
or Against Azhara?
Or going to save elmas from the elves in the jaws?

Not? It's easy to improve when you start at 0 XD

[Combatbutler]

She beat Sylvanas....hate to break it to you

She did for like 10 seconds and then gets mocked by her, while becoming weaker than her as well. The whole arc was just so pointless

[Syegfryed]

well, she kinda killed that big mob in the begining, i guess its something.

[Chumahki]

She did the same thing she's done for 10,000 yrs...failed. Illidan is better off with Sargeras than Tyrande.

[Maxilian]

Thanks, I hate it.

just gonna repost my post from the other thread

But... it does make sense that Sylvanas is surprised, I mean is not like death is new to her or anything like that, but just like US, she expected that whenever Nathanos would meet his end, he would go to the Shadowlands and land on her side.

So its not that weird.

[Nathreim]

She fought a fight she never could win because Sylvanas can turn into mist....

Wow its fucking nothing.