View Poll Results: Did retail WoW just hit rock bottom?

54. This poll is closed
  • Yes

    26 48.15%
  • No

    19 35.19%
  • Other…

    9 16.67%
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  1. #21
    Every patch is "the worst its ever been" for SOMEbody...these threads have been going on least Wrath, if not BC
    "We must make our choice. We may have democracy, or we may have wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both."
    -Louis Brandeis

  2. #22
    Nah WoW most certainly had worse times than this. People warmed up to BFA a tad and Shadowlands is not really a bad expansion, it's not WoD/Cata.

    I do think that for 10.0 Blizz needs to pull out another Legion. Legion was a great expansion with many innovations and huge amount of content. BFA and Shadowlands on the other hand are too "safe", too "iterative".

    Shadowlands specifically feels small, they really should have made Suramar out of Korthia. The biggest secret in the "city of secrets" is where is the damn city...

    I think a lot will ride in 10.0, if they will manage to pull out another Legion - WoW will do well.
    All my ignores are permanently filtered out and invisible to me. Responding to my posts with nonsense or insults is pointless, you're likely already invisible and if not - 3 clicks away. One ignore is much better than 3 pages of trolling.

  3. #23
    Most AOTC raiders will be finished in a few weeks. The time gated story will drag on for a while but 9.1 will be basically finished for most players in a month. Then 9.2 will be what, 8-10 months maybe? They already started laying the ground work for a delayed release and woth all this drama yeah, I'd say we are at an all time low.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post

    Is the recent state of retail World of Warcraft the worst the game has ever been? Is Shadowlands (9.1) the lowest point of retail WoW‘s history?

    Lawsuit and Cosby Suite left aside, it seems like WoW has lost more content creators and players in Shadowlands than ever before. Players are disgruntled, outraged, angry, by the gameplay, the systems and the story. The only thing admired about retail WoW right now just seems to be the art and the music.

    After having seen Preach‘s farewell video and looked up some of the fallout Shadowlands has created in the WoW universe, it seems like WoW hit rock bottom with light speed over the span of just a few months. Was there a point in WoW‘s lifetime where the game was in a worse state, gameplay wise, lore wise, reputation wise? What’s your take on this?
    Well, IMO BfA was way worse in many aspects, but 9.0 till 9.1 were terrible.
    It's not only the gameplay, its the missed potential and (at least for me) the terrible, terrible story line.

    IMO 9.1 brought us a great raid and a great new Zone, but it seems nobody enjoys Torghast still, the new dungeon is... Mainly for alts and can not compete with Kara. The Assaults are ok, but irrelevant for many people already since they only use one legendary and that is upgraded by now.
    The story gets worse and worse every week.
    That said, I still really enjoy 9.1 but there needs to be stuff to do besides the raid and at least 9.1.5 needs to come soon and it needs to bring a lot more than a usual .5 patch does.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Palapop View Post
    Great Vault is a looooooooot worse than BFA. In BFA we had at least 2 guarantee items. 1 from M+, 1 from pvp. Now, if you play both pvp/pve, you're f*cked.
    I'd rather take one item I can pick out of a few random items, rather than a random loot box every week.
    In BfA, I never got a single trinket from the chest. How fun those days were.
    My friend who was really into PvP never got vers gear on his DH, but his non-PvP warrior was around 35%.

    Fun fun fun!

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Gestopft View Post
    Every patch is "the worst its ever been" for SOMEbody...these threads have been going on least Wrath, if not BC
    The reason is that every patch since then makes the have a little bit worse

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sentynel View Post
    Dunno, m+ ques are insane right now. So many people sign for keys lol.
    ? Dafuq, I am playing on the biggest German alliance server and we have like 3-4 +15 keys listed after ~22:00.
    Even in BfA we had at least 5x that, 10x that in legion

  7. #27
    I judge an expansion by how many of my RL friends I can play with. As of right now I am the only one that still has an active sub. One still has a few months left on his. So there is that.

    If they haven't hit rock bottom, it seems like they're doing everything they can to close the gap.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Palapop View Post
    What do you consider as "world content"?

    How is m+ a clear step up compared to BFA? Which part of M+ you consider as "clear step up"?

    Great Vault is a looooooooot worse than BFA. In BFA we had at least 2 guarantee items. 1 from M+, 1 from pvp. Now, if you play both pvp/pve, you're f*cked.

    Torghast and "leggies" are NOT ok. They are beyond broken, obligatory and clearly they have BIS list. They are pain in ass to craft and they are huuuuuuuge gold sink.

    The fact that you couldn't care less about PVP doesn't make it look any good. It's worse than BFA/Legion (even tho we have pvp vendors now)

    We don't need extra new/groundbreaking things. That's the issue with current dev team. They want more, more, more, MORE... Sometime the less is more. Better focus on quality than quantity.

    About last 1? I can't say anything. I don't follow ANY youtuber/streamer/etc/etc...
    Tho I still don't understand why people call Legion good expansion. It had just good quest lines (order hall + weps) and mage tower challenge. Rest was pre-bfa/sl sh*t fest. (endless grinds, chores, systems, systems, systems, systems....)

    Last good (and THE BEST) expansion was MOP to me. (I know this is subjective, but I'm just going with "logical thinking" on this 1)
    I don't think dailies are as bad as BFA's and Korthia annoys me less than Nazjatar and Mechagon. Plus no AP grind means I only have to do like 1 hour of world content/week for Renown if I don't feel like doing it which is just fine with me.

    For M+, the seasonal affixes are much better, the balance is better even if hardly perfect, the trash is both less numerous and less annoying, the dungeons themselves are more fun, and there's a lot less buggy nonsense like Tol Dagor. Only downgrade is the big nerf to Drums having me need both a lust and a brez when forming groups.

    I don't PvP at all so I can't sympathize with that front. Being able to choose items between raids and dungeons is a godsend. Maybe next time around they can make a separate PvP one.

    Torghast is OK. It's a lot better then the Island and Warfront chores. As for BiS lists, newsflash, literally every aspect of this game has a BiS list. I do agree the gold sink is ridiculous and they need to cut required mats by half at least.

    If I don't care about PvP I can hardly comment on it now can I? Anyway even dating back to Wrath I remember PvPers saying the PvP is the worst ever in every single expansion.

    For casual players we need real new stuff, like a new class, for the expansion to be memorable. I don't think it a coincidence that Wrath, Mists and Legion are consistently highly rated, with only TBC trailing them for those who like it.

    Legion had the things you said, plus good raids, the best M+, WQs were still fresh, the story was a bit less stupid, the best open world content we ever got IMO in Suramar, and killer transmogs. I can stomach badly baked systems if that's the worst it has to offer, as for the grinds I couldn't care less about obsessively grinding AP and I still got my CEs, funny that.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

    The internet: where to every action is opposed an unequal overreaction.

  9. #29
    Bloodsail Admiral SunspotAnims's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palapop View Post
    Tho I still don't understand why people call Legion good expansion. It had just good quest lines (order hall + weps) and mage tower challenge. Rest was pre-bfa/sl sh*t fest. (endless grinds, chores, systems, systems, systems, systems....)
    The artifact grinds in Legion were, in retrospect, probably a mistake, but since it was the first expansion to do so it was still seen as a good step up from WoD. It wasn't until after Legion that people realized that becoming literally superpowered over the course of the expansion only to have it stripped away felt bad, and made even worse where the response in BfA was to keep the grind but dial back the superpowers.

    Beyond that, Legion just had a lot going on. M+ and world quests were new and promising. You had story-driven questlines for class halls, artifacts, Suramar, class mounts, professions, and even just extra story stuff like the attack on the Exodar. And these questlines took you everywhere, making it feel like a global invasion. The release cadence for patches was solid as well.

    I think it was a huge mistake for devs to ditch the concept of Suramar; an entire zone's worth of extra storyline that you unlock after hitting max level, hardly time gated at all. It remains one of my favorite zones in the game and, quite frankly, zones like Suramar should have been a given for all expansions going forward. None of this "weekly campaign" shit with a fraction of the scope.

  10. #30
    Herald of the Titans Advent's Avatar
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    Oct 2008
    The Other Side.
    The better question is, have the mmo-champion usual suspects finally hit rock bottom?

  11. #31
    Titan Orby's Avatar
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    Jul 2010
    Under the stars
    As of right now...yes!
    "People fear, not death, but having life taken from them. Many waste the life given to them, occupying themselves with things that do not matter. When the end comes, they say they did not have time enough to spend with loved ones, to fulfill dreams, to go on adventures they only talked about... But why should you fear death if you are happy with the life you have led, if you can look back on everything and say, 'Yes, I am content. It is enough.'" - Wynne ( Dragon Age: Origins.)

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    Legion was berated only slightly less on MMO-C but now people say it's a good expansion, for the most part at least.
    Legion deserves to be berated for RNG legiondary drops that were doing upwards of 20% of your dps, absolutely killed competitive parsing. Not to mention the bug for the people who go one early accidentally doubling their chance of getting a second.

    If I'm being honest with myself the other DK on the server getting the wrists drop on like the first day and me getting nothing until a godamn prydaz after we had EN on-farm (even though I was no living maw like the rest of my guild) was the day WoW died for me.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  13. #33
    I’m not sure I’d say WoW has hit rock bottom or that this is as bad as it’s ever been. (6.1: forever the worst in my mind.)
    I think it’s more accurate to say Blizzard just hit their rock bottom.
    They haven’t made a ‘new’ game of any sort excluding WoW/HS expansions since Overwatch.
    Overwatch came out over 5 years ago fam.
    They ruined WC3 Reforged and Warcraft 3 proper in the process. They gutted HotS. They’ve been having layoffs and closed down Team 1. There is still no release in site for Diablo 4 and OW2. WoW is getting its slowest mid-expansion content updates ever.
    And then, to top it all off, now they’re getting hammered by employee walkouts and State investigations into their shitty-ass conduct.

    9.1 is not the worst content patch in WoW’s history, and SLs is not the worst expansion.
    But can you or anyone else honestly point to a worse time for Blizzard proper?

  14. #34
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Oct 2009
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    "WoW is Dying/Dead" type threads don't tend to produce much in the way of constructive discussion or debate. Closing this.

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