Recent writing has been dubbed "the worst ever" by the community & mainstream media

[Mardux]

Only one Azmontroll reaction video? How am I supposed to know what thoughts I'm allowed to have with only one video by him?

[GreenJesus]

And why would you put punish under quotes? He literally leaves her two feet away at the mercy of three people that want her dead. Also, now she will be tormented by all the horrible stuff she has done. People generally loved the soul split/personality change from Uther.

Also, I fail to see any evidence that Sylvanas will get a redemption, people are outraging themselves in advance lol.

Anyway, no matter how SL ends, Bastion Afterlives cinematic alone is one of the best pieces of WoW story i have ever seen. To mee, that video was perfect, and i still get goosebumps when i revisit it. Revendreth and Arden were also really cool, Maldraxxus one a little less.

I generally liked how Blizzard envisioned SL as a WoW afterlife, i really liked the structure and the zones. I also applaud them from actually creating new lore and stepping into the unknown.

For the main story plot, I am curious. It is not excellent, but it is not trash. I think many people are too emotionally invested in some chars and prone to outrage if the story didn't fit their narrative.

Having a few cool cinematics doesn't make up for all the bad lore and writing inbetween.

[PenguinChan]

Honestly Shadowlands is better than BfA for more 'main-ish' story lines. BfA still has good side stories, as is always the case with any WoW expansion. A lot of things in the main story for Shadowlands had potential or were actually neat - but squandered due to poor foresight with lore. The entire Sylvanas vs Tyrande arc springs to mind.

But ultimately no matter how many flashy cinematics they throw at us, it doesn't make up for bad decisions or just poor choices. If I'm being honest though, BfA had a better premise due to established lore but threw it away. Shadowlands created a promising premise, but is clearly throwing it away.

[Xilurm]

Wish people would stop with the excuse that just because "iNfLuEnCeRs" are talking about it means it's bs.

Most people actually think it's bs. Those who don't at this point can't really be convinced otherwise, and are probably the same people who think S8 GoT is good, and that The Last Jedi was also good.

It's embarrassing.

[Lorde Snow]

This Writing achieves the impossible, to be worse than GOT season 8 ande Star Wars Skywalker Ascension
what did they do with the lore i loved so much?? they destroyed what made wow so special.

[Jastall]

WoW almost always gets the individual zones right; questing in them usually feels good and makes sense. It is astounding that the people in charge of the main plot can't get the bigger picture together and present it in a meaningful way. It feels as though they don't spend a minute thinking how well something translates onto the playerbase.

That's the thing that annoys me most. When they stick to self-contained stories, they do fine. Off the top of my head: Stormheim, Suramar, Nazmir, Drustvar, Zuldazar, Maldraxxus, Revendreth, in the past 3 expansions they had several zones deliver neat stories. But then they try to tie it all together and it's like a different team takes over and injects as many "shocking" twists, stilted dialog, and fanfiction-tier characters doing stupid shit as they can into the mix. At this point I'm actually convinced they have a "main" writing team who handles the main plotline, which sucks, and a secondary team handling the individual zones and lower-level lore who do a better job for whatever reason. Maybe they're given the time to work on it, maybe the main plotline is dictated from above while the zones aren't as much, I dunno at this point.

[Sithalos]

Warcraft's lore died with Teldrassil.

Anyone who still defends this story, the game, or the company itself is so high on copium that there is no hope for you.

[Every Pwny]

The wow story has been bad for a long time, but yeah this is probably the worst writing they've ever done for sure. Even the characters seem pointless, Bolvar, Jaina, Thrall, Baine all just being there, the jailer is a blank slate of a villain who turns into a torghast trash mob, Sylvanas seems to be schizophrenic as if they have several different people writing her with no communication between them, then you have Tyrande and the night warrior accomplishing nothing with that disaster of a storyline and Elune saying things like "she must choose" right after Elune took that choice away from her and they think these lines sound good just because they have the voice actors deliver them in a slow and whispery way as opposed to working on the content of what they are saying. But hey at least the cutscene look okay, the content can be trash and pointless as long as there are enough sparkly lights to distract viewer.

[Magnagarde]

That's the thing that annoys me most. When they stick to self-contained stories, they do fine. Off the top of my head: Stormheim, Suramar, Nazmir, Drustvar, Zuldazar, Maldraxxus, Revendreth, in the past 3 expansions they had several zones deliver neat stories. But then they try to tie it all together and it's like a different team takes over and injects as many "shocking" twists, stilted dialog, and fanfiction-tier characters doing stupid shit as they can into the mix. At this point I'm actually convinced they have a "main" writing team who handles the main plotline, which sucks, and a secondary team handling the individual zones and lower-level lore who do a better job for whatever reason. Maybe they're given the time to work on it, maybe the main plotline is dictated from above while the zones aren't as much, I dunno at this point.

It definitely feels like that and I honestly believe it to be true. I see no other way to explain a recurring phenomenon like this.

[KevyB]

Legion was pushing it, but what SL did is completely erase any suspension of disbelief from WoW, it strayed too far from its "core" lore while completely shitting on powerlevel definitions of the past, the titans were the be all end all of life for the longest time in warcraft lore, yet suddenly it turned out they were nothing but lego toys and theres a bunch of voodoo ghost hippies above them that seemingly are dumber than goblins, and are in no way above the "petty quarrels" of mortals.

It's just... no, the train has derailed all the way into the ocean.

[Magnagarde]

I feel like Legion did incredibly well to tie in all the various plots from Warcraft's past, primarily through the Artifact Weapon questlines and Order Hall questlines. It felt like Legion was trying to put an umbrella above everything we knew and tie it together, with a modicum of respect towards the universe of Warcraft and what it meant for those invested in the franchise. It didn't do an excellent job on all fronts, but it showed that a huge amount of work, understanding and passion went into it.

[Jackstraw]

I feel like Legion did incredibly well to tie in all the various plots from Warcraft's past, primarily through the Artifact Weapon questlines and Order Hall questlines. It felt like Legion was trying to put an umbrella above everything we knew and tie it together, with a modicum of respect towards the universe of Warcraft and what it meant for those invested in the franchise. It didn't do an excellent job on all fronts, but it showed that a huge amount of work, understanding and passion went into it.

You're exactly right: it didn't do an excellent job and it didn't need to. It was respectful to its origins and told a good story. I have some issues with the latter cinematics starting from the ending of Tomb of Sargeras, but overall Legion sticked to its guns and did Warcraft things.

Which leads me to the following point: a writer is allowed to tell one's own story. But if the story is an original one then it has legs to stand on its own, and doesn't need to lean on the expectations of old estabilished characters or franchises, depauperating their legacy in the process and morphing them into something else via either retcons or nonsensical twists. Saurfang is the biggest, saddest case in point, who sees his final moments having two contradictions and fights his last fight with Shalamayne, ideally bridging the Horde and the Alliance and ultimately getting nowhere.

Nowadays disrespectful is a big word whose impact got diluted by overuse. And here it fits exactly right, with the story being told not being trusted enough to be pushed by its logical conclusion after all the BfA narrative got done, even after all it got butchered to feed it.

[Dhrizzle]

You're exactly right: it didn't do an excellent job and it didn't need to. It was respectful to its origins and told a good story. I have some issues with the latter cinematics starting from the ending of Tomb of Sargeras, but overall Legion sticked to its guns and did Warcraft things.

Which leads me to the following point: a writer is allowed to tell one's own story. But if the story is an original one then it has legs to stand on its own, and doesn't need to lean on the expectations of old estabilished characters or franchises, depauperating their legacy in the process and morphing them into something else via either retcons or nonsensical twists. Saurfang is the biggest, saddest case in point, who sees his final moments having two contradictions and fights his last fight with Shalamayne, ideally bridging the Horde and the Alliance and ultimately getting nowhere.

Nowadays disrespectful is a big word whose impact got diluted by overuse. And here it fits exactly right, with the story being told not being trusted enough to be pushed by its logical conclusion after all the BfA narrative got done, even after all it got butchered to feed it.

Do you think the zones of Legion should have been kept separate from the Broken Isles and Tomb of Sargeras? After all they are new stories that should have legs and shouldn't be leaning on the expectations of old established characters or franchises. Did the nonsensical twists of surviving/ghostly Night Elves and retcons to the structure of the islands depauperate the legacy of WC3?

[Devilyaki]

Maybe they wrote it so bad cause of how they were being treated in the company? Just f it up on purpose to get back at them lol

[Jackstraw]

Do you think the zones of Legion should have been kept separate from the Broken Isles and Tomb of Sargeras? After all they are new stories that should have legs and shouldn't be leaning on the expectations of old established characters or franchises. Did the nonsensical twists of surviving/ghostly Night Elves and retcons to the structure of the islands depauperate the legacy of WC3?

Setting and narrative are two wildly different things. Same goes for characters who exist contained in WoW as a game.
Whatever happens in the singular zones is another thing entirely. I am interested in what's expanded and stays true to its roots, and of course Legion played heavily on the expectations generated by the name. Beat by beat Legion takes handfuls of what preceded it in the perceived golden age of the game and iterates on it remembering what it was and being respectful with it, respectful enough that the material is then put again to rest and the narrative is allowed to proceed.

Karazhan's remake is not just a Frankenstein that uses old Kara and what it means to the older audience as a crutch. It does its own thing, spins its own stuff, comically winks at the player with the chess event loot and furthers Khadgar's arc leaving Medivh behind. Same goes for Aegwynn.

And as said Legion does not do it all flawlessly. Cathedral and all the quips between Illidan and Maiev are unbearable, and Kil'jaeden's final repentance severely undermines the legacy of one of the great masterminds of the history of the game, and all that happens after relegates him as an afterthought forever.

[Mendzia]

I like how some people will dodge the OP's direct question and still COPIUM Blizzard no matter of what with resposnes that are not even answers:

TBC was way worse!
Still better than GoT
Stop watching X streamer that says its bad!
They did great job with X thing atleast
It can still end good!

[Nzx]

I could not care less what the writing is like. I haven't read quest text since 2004 and I esc -> skip cinematic immediately if addons don't do it for me. Why am I supposed to give a shit about articles from websites or "creators" that would be committing career suicide if they did anything except capitalise on the anti-Blizzard zeitgeist right now? Asmongold lives in an attic surrounded by his own garbage and literally who is Pyromancer?

To answer your questions I'd improve the story by doing exactly what the majority aren't asking for, strongly encourage them all to leave, and then sideline the story entirely in favour of allowing people to just play the game.

[msmollymillions]

I could not care less what the writing is like. I haven't read quest text since 2004 and I esc -> skip cinematic immediately if addons don't do it for me. Why am I supposed to give a shit about articles from websites or "creators" that would be committing career suicide if they did anything except capitalise on the anti-Blizzard zeitgeist right now? Asmongold lives in an attic surrounded by his own garbage and literally who is Pyromancer?

To answer your questions I'd improve the story by doing exactly what the majority aren't asking for, strongly encourage them all to leave, and then sideline the story entirely in favour of allowing people to just play the game.

wanna pass me some of that copium?

[Dhrizzle]

Setting and narrative are two wildly different things. Same goes for characters who exist contained in WoW as a game.
Whatever happens in the singular zones is another thing entirely. I am interested in what's expanded and stays true to its roots, and of course Legion played heavily on the expectations generated by the name. Beat by beat Legion takes handfuls of what preceded it in the perceived golden age of the game and iterates on it remembering what it was and being respectful with it, respectful enough that the material is then put again to rest and the narrative is allowed to proceed.

Karazhan's remake is not just a Frankenstein that uses old Kara and what it means to the older audience as a crutch. It does its own thing, spins its own stuff, comically winks at the player with the chess event loot and furthers Khadgar's arc leaving Medivh behind. Same goes for Aegwynn.

And as said Legion does not do it all flawlessly. Cathedral and all the quips between Illidan and Maiev are unbearable, and Kil'jaeden's final repentance severely undermines the legacy of one of the great masterminds of the history of the game, and all that happens after relegates him as an afterthought forever.

What I'm talking about is how they managed to pull 3 groups of Elves, some new special Tauren and a whole zone of Titans and Vrykul out of their asses. You can't say that it's treating past lore with respect when it completely changes the way the Tomb of Sargeras was portrayed in WC3 and totally undermines the mysteries of Ulduar in WotLK. Why was it such a big deal finding out about the Keepers, Vrykul and Valkyr if the centre of druidism was practically next door to Odyn's place? Also why didn't the druids do anything about those ghosts who were hanging around near them for 10,000 years?

[Super Dickmann]

Suppose everything is restored as normal, then every time a character dies, people would have a legitimate question as to where they are in the Shadowlands right now. Which zone did the Arbiter send them to?

It's an ugly idea in that regard.

You'd have an ever present asterisk over every fate. "Yes, they keeled over, but did they get their nipples pinched by vampires for ten thousand years until they became good?" people would debate on forums. So long as it stays forum speculation and the narrative doesn't burden itself further it's survivable precisely because it's a post-hoc element of the narrative. The day to day functioning of the races and factions being bricked is a significantly greater hurdle to overcome because to even get to the point where people are debating the retarded afterlife events need to be able to take place and unlike the afterlife you can't just put a big sticker on it and never address it going forward.

This is incidentally why WoD's story getting as much hate as it does is baffling to me. At the end of the day, nothing really happens that affects the main proceedings except that we got one (1) Gul'dan, everything else you can safely ignore and salvage for the fairly juciy setting. It's also why Cataclysm's main story having the weakest villain and protagonist up to and including the current Avengers vs Thanos reprise doesn't really matter. Yes, Metzen Thrall breaking time and space so he can fry a Deathwing who has zero relation to his previous portrayal besides being a dragon after the player has been his marriage counselor is total shit on a crusty roll but if you assume that Deathwing just blinked out of existence after 4.0 none of the plot would be remotely affected. The actual events unrelated to that shambles are among the best the franchise has ever produced.

Simultaneously, it's why I can't take praise of Legion all that seriously. At the end of the day it fully removed the main baddie of the game after a pathetic post-release performance while giving one of the title races, the orcs, who's background relates entirely to the Legion zero role in engaging it. I know more about how Sika the owl feels about her work-leisure balance thanks to her time in the Ember Court than I do about what literally anyone in the Horde thinks about Gul'dan and Kil'jaeden's defeats, which is just as well since Sika underwent character development to learn to chill whereas the Horde's total role on Argus consists of Aethas putting a hit out on a neon otter because it stole his muffin. We spent an entire zone running errands for the Highmountain tauren - now can anyone tell me a single thing about their culture relative to regular tauren or a character trait of any of their leaders short of Ebonhorn who isn't even a tauren? Yeah, I thought not.