Good for Blizzard - ambiguity for you.

[hulkgor]

You say shadowlands has more content. But I think it’s pretty darn clear that a majority of it is content we don’t want. Or at the very least is content that we might want if the systems surrounding it weren’t garbage.

Well, i feel like Shadowlands has way more content that me and my circle of friends \ guildies enjoy more.

Whereas in BFA we had Island Expeditions and Warfronts, both of which we absolutely abhorred, we actually enjoy The Maw and Torghast, and regularly ran it with friends. I also feel like raid wise, CN and SOD are leaps ahead of Uldir and Battle for Dazar Alor. I'll never forget the shit show that was G'huun requiring 4 warlocks, or the 4-6 sub rogue stack on Zul. SOD loses some points for being balanced on the easier side though.

Dungeon wise, its a close affair, but my favorites comparing both expansions are from BFA (Freehold and Underrot were great!).

So the whole "we don't want" is highly subjective. Shadowlands is my jam, and hoping for a great 9.2!

[dictainabox]

Data scientist here. Two things:

1) it always weirds me out when people call data analysts by the business analyst title. BAs typically do requirements gathering and act as a sort of emissary between devs and business. Thats not your fault, just a problem I have with the industry. But more importantly,
2) why bring up your bona fides if you arent going to provide evidence outside of "just look at society?" It seems like a pretty naked appeal to authority without providing much but your opinion and little else.

[Aloie]

Well, i feel like Shadowlands has way more content that me and my circle of friends \ guildies enjoy more.

Whereas in BFA we had Island Expeditions and Warfronts, both of which we absolutely abhorred, we actually enjoy The Maw and Torghast, and regularly ran it with friends. I also feel like raid wise, CN and SOD are leaps ahead of Uldir and Battle for Dazar Alor. I'll never forget the shit show that was G'huun requiring 4 warlocks, or the 4-6 sub rogue stack on Zul. SOD loses some points for being balanced on the easier side though.

Dungeon wise, its a close affair, but my favorites comparing both expansions are from BFA (Freehold and Underrot were great!).

So the whole "we don't want" is highly subjective. Shadowlands is my jam, and hoping for a great 9.2!

I do agree with you that it’s better than BFAs content outside of dungeon and raid, but I think the falling player count via armory data does tell a decent tale of the majority not enjoying what has been set before them. Loved me some heroic nzoth though, I thought it was a really fun encounter.

[Ringthane]

Looks like a bot... Smells like a bot...

Must be Chicken Drummer v2.0.

Whichever mod gave me an infraction for this post is both an idiot and a coward. "Report bad threads"? We all have. We've all reported this idiot. You keep banning it and letting it come back. Stop targeting me and do your job.

[unbound]

Corporate culture. - It is in blizzards best interests to hide subscriber numbers from you. Not because the game is dying - because they can hide the game is performing better than the past, in that way, they can get away with producing as little content as you deem acceptable.

Yes and no. It can be done because the game is performing better, but it is also done to hide a more poorly performing product / game. Quarterly and Annual reports / meetings are more about hype than actually providing important information. A corporation whose product that isn't particularly popular, but generates large revenue for various reasons (in gaming, microtransactions driven by whales is one example) will want to talk about financial numbers and not want the negative impression of lower popularity. Even business analysts get fooled by this. In the case of Blizzard, WoW almost certainly has severely declined subscription base that can be easily inferred from looking at the substantial decline in MAUs.

Social bots/decline of MMO social interaction - I have noticed recently that people selling in game services for gold is often looked upon as a negative thing, trade chat is often antisocial and spammed with services that imitate real life products. These characters on my server are often level 60, not level one, and there are many. I am able to ignore those that advertise around my current, structured play times (usually afternoons). However if i am to log on in the morning, or midday i am again inundated with offers.

To me, this also seems to indicate game health. If they were level 1 toons then you could assume bots, if toons were boosted and churned over at the same times of day then you could also assume bots. The game has reached maturity with a mixed player base, who imitate a proven way to generate revenue. Its quite ingenious, especially if those groups of players leverage the ease of technology like square space to turn that into a legitimate way to earn gold.

Laughably wrong here. Leveling services have been so common for so long on WoW that it is easy to see why plenty of the sales are from level 60 characters. This logic only makes sense for new games.

Content . Shadowlands has more content that any expansion in the last 3, more than legion and certainly more than BFA and WOD. It has had revamps of meaningful systems like pvp tallents, texture updates, cinematics and tried very hard creating a cohesive framework that ties the past expansions, with storylines that are difficult to bring to the forefront, into the limelight in a way that makes sense, is meaningful to future expansions (such as the partnership with Beluar gaming to explain concepts of Wrath and Yogg Saron/The black empire in with the aims of the current antagonist.

Not more content than Legion, but possibly more than BfA and WoD. PvP talent modifications were moderate at best, and texture / cinematic updates are cheap to produce. Considering the continued minimum of dungeons and raids (as well as the laughable Torghast that wasn't remotely as random as they claimed), they probably put in no more effort than they did for BfA...which is still one of the laziest expansions.

What you already know about clickbait You're all aware, and likely do not watch mainstream news, because they feed you BS. It's proven that people react more to negativity than to positivity. Therefore you can assume (and this is backed up by data - you could verify by looking at the state of society) that people who understand this paradigm launch advertising campaigns around "negativity" as a sham to play off how "you" as a person, interpret and work.

Sooo. What's the deal, is it just a function that a large corporation can function better praying on the intellectual incapacity of the average human being? it's pretty obvious to look from the outside of this box to see that this narrative is written to empower people who cant conceptualise that they're not the most intelligent person in their surroundings. eveyones so mad, they think that they need to be listened to. They rant and propagate a system that makes them feel bad, continuing the cycle. Its like a parasitic way to play off idiots. "Cement yourself as the bad guy in the industry - but profit forevermore"

Do you have a place where you and others are able to communicate and debate ideas without narcissism and negativity? How do you intend to grow and mature into a human that not just understands the influences that are thrust upon you but, work to curb the behaviours by showing that they not in line with your consumer profile. Because the answer isn't - complain until i get my way.

This is just pop psychology mumbo-jumbo. It is meaningless and purely speculative.


Overall, if you are a business analyst, you aren't a very good one. I've also had my own company for 5 years (it isn't that hard to create and run one). You've demonstrated poor overall knowledge of fundamental industry basics and 3/4 of your post is either factually incorrect or just mumbo-jumbo.

[RobertoCarlos]

K nice to know that you're an accountant/business owner/data analyst. Now we know you're not some average Joe and graced us with your presence, I can defiantly take your thread more seriously now.

Your takes are awful. Level doesnt mean shit when promoting material to sell. Many active players have dozens of level 1 bank alts. Nor does the time of day matter. Have you heard of this novel concept called time zones? WoW is played by people across the globe not just limited to America east or west coast.

And shadowlands has the most content of any expansion? Thanks for the laugh.

The only "point" you made that was slightly interesting was saying why they dont release sub numbers, so they can get away with less work and dont draw negative press by highlighting the fact they are just milking the whales. That I can see happening and didnt think of.

[Vespian]

Good morning,

I'm a business analyst .

Clearly you are not. I have never seen so much unfounded nonsense in any post ever. Not even my own

[Mosotti]

I've always thought business analysts are useless and shouldn't exist and this thread confirms my thoughts.

[Gnomesized]

Gave up at " Shadowlands has more content that any expansion in the last 3". Nice troll, 3/10.

[Marrilaife]

Well the guy did do accounting in Australia. Everything is upside down there, so I bet if you read his post backwards it will make more sense at least, because right now I'm 100% with ya that this post is just pointless

This is even funnier than Bellular who over the years became a self-proclaimed expert on game development because he opened an indie game studio that hasn't released a single title yet...

1. Not publishing sub numbers - we can assume safely they're bad. Why? Because when any number is good, it gets trumpeted from the rooftops for the PR value. For example "Shadowlands had more day1 sales than any expac before" (day1 = 1 year+ of preorders btw).

2. Not having to put effort into retail is deemed acceptable because WOW and its sub model will survive off Classic. It's more financially prudent to monetize Classic than retail too, because retail can take a turn playerbase will dislike while Classic has already outlined every possible turn on their trajectory.

3. Corporate culture can be summed up as this: how do we get the most revenue with the least possible costs and effort. Therefore staff cuts, low pay, unfinished, half-assed or buggy content, more cash shop stuff and 6-month "promos", etc. This is how nearly every big gamedev corp. operates, it's nothing new or surprising.

4. Boosts. Blizzard deliberately turned WOW into World of Boostcraft. They reinforced the cycle of spend money -> buy gold -> buy boost -> booster takes the gold and spends it on gametime / bnet balance. They're printing money off it, it won't go away. The costs of raiding also reinforce the cycle of "raiders have to boost to sustain themselves" especially since the only other lucrative avenue requires tons of free time (camp AH 24/7 and flip) and competitive players spend their time raiding, pvping or spamming m+ rather than camping AH. They also made progression a chore to encourage people to buy boosts to skip it.

5. Content. Nobody wants to grind half a dozen different currencies and have a weekly checklist of stuff you must do to stay competitive. It's been a problem since Legion and is getting worse with every passing xpac. People wanna pick and choose content they like then binge on it, but unfortunately WOW is becoming more and more on-rails rather than a sandbox. It was never a full sandbox game, but it's becoming more and more constricting in "play the way we tell you to play".

6. Bad PR. Blizz doesn't need bad PR to become famous, they already are. The only people / organizations that need notoriety are the ones who can't get fame through legit avenues. Blizzard is getting bad PR because they sat on their laurels counting on their past fame carrying them forever. They had multiple failed products like HOTS, cancelled Titan, cancelled D3 xpac, Warcraft Reforged dubbed Warcraft Refunded, and now are just living off empty promises like D4 and Overwatch2 we won't see for years still.

Their policy for WOW is to assume players are addicts and won't quit no matter what, so they can keep testing how low the bar can drop and how high the monetization can be pushed without drawbacks. I'm pretty sure Square Enix thanks them for this "experiment" because they got an influx of players who were hopeless MMO addicts but couldn't take Blizz's bs anymore. Same with all the "influencers" like youtubers and twitch streamers who started promoting other MMOs over WOW. But hey, apparently there's no downside to bad PR according to the OP.

- - - Updated - - -

Gave up at " Shadowlands has more content that any expansion in the last 3". Nice troll, 3/10.

Hey, don't you like the smell of Torghast grinding in the morning?

[Thage]

Must be a slow day at the office, and if this post is any indicator of your firm's talents in business analysis, I can see why.

[Alydael]

Good morning,

I'm a business analyst and would like to share with you some thoughts about advertising and this blizzard mess, contrary to what you might find intuitive. My k Because the answer isn't - complain until i get my way.

You posted this in the wrong forum. People here just yell, shout and troll each other really. I would recommend a forum for you, but most of the ones that are not like this one are private (to avoid what you see here).

I expect you to be fully trolled by people who know nothing (or very little) about how the industry (or any industry) works for that matter.

I agree with you about SL. I am enjoying it. There is a ton to do and I find that I don't even have time to work on all of it. I have been meaning to finish up some of the other covenants storylines and jump into some pvp with my mage, but I am so busy on my main that I don't have the time.

I judge the expansions by how much I actually play during that x pac and how often I have that feeling of looking forward to playing later when I am doing something else. I would rate SL medium to high (7.5 ish). I agree with most of the posters that the systems are trash. The dungeons are good, the raids have been really good. They are even (noticeably) trying different things with raid mechanics. They went a little crazy with the knockbacks though.

At the end of the day, profits are what matters to a company. I think it is funny how players compare numbers they pull off various websites to compare WoW and other games (like FF14) and then claim (based on the numbers they pulled off some random site) that WoW is failing or dying, etc. I even heard a poster predict WoW was going into "maintenance mode" after SL. It was hilarious.

To really compare WoW with another game- we would have to look at profits for each game and compare. I am sure WoW is still making a killing and beating the pants off most games by a long shot. I would even bet it beat out FF14 last year (in profits) even though FF14 got a huge boost from those chicken little ("sky is falling") streamers. FF14 probably experienced a large surge of game sales off that boost. I would bet that WoW still beat it out.

[The Stormbringer]

Content . Shadowlands has more content that any expansion in the last 3, more than legion and certainly more than BFA and WOD. It has had revamps of meaningful systems like pvp tallents, texture updates, cinematics and tried very hard creating a cohesive framework that ties the past expansions, with storylines that are difficult to bring to the forefront, into the limelight in a way that makes sense, is meaningful to future expansions

Bullshit. I don't play the game anymore, but I try to keep current on what's going on and what's available, and this is absolutely false. Legion definitely had more content. Even if your claim was "Shadowlands at launch had more than the past three expansions at launch", you would be wrong. Shadowlands is a SINGLE MAJOR PATCH IN. It does not have more content than the other expansions. Period.