(Spoiler)Well then the court martial is as bad as a warchief.

[geco]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...nts/1147065/42

According to the Spoilers and summaries of the new pound the current Horde is still invading the Kaldorei lands and not only that, Rezzar wonders why the Kaldorei keep fighting while they are invading them.

So how do I improve the advice of the Horde? He is still invading lands without a reason and starting a war again without having finished signing the peace treaty of the previous one.

The strangest thing about all this is that the Kaldorei made peace with the troll in their lands who fought for the Horde twice.
I mean, you can negotiate with the Kaldorei, you just have to stop attacking them.

WHAT IS THE COUNCIL IMPROVEMENT?

PS: Then we have a lot of empty words that Zekkan and Rezzar feel bad for the Kaldore, While they still invade them, and that they hope they get better, while they do not stop attacking them.

PS2: they also clarify that the Kaldorei will not have renewal if they do not have justice making Elune's choice even more false than before.

[Varodoc]

I've said this before and I'll say it again.

If there will ever be a renewed faction war, it's very likely that the Horde will start it once again. While the Horde Council is fundamentally a good turning point for the Horde and a massive improvement from the old, dark times of the Warchief (the mere existence of this position was barbaric and completely against freedom of speech), there are some bad elements within the Council. Like Geya'rah, who openly supported Suevanas until the very end.

The problem with this Council is that at least one of its Council members, Geya'rah, clearly, openly, and explicitly stated that she would see the Alliance and their cities burn, because she's so stupid that she thinks Lightforged = Lightbound.

The Alliance embraces the draenei and their Lightforged kin.

That alone is reason to crush their cities to dust.

So Geya'rah has clearly stated that she wants to see Stormwind, Ironforge, Shadowforge City, Boralus, Stromgarde, Mechagon, etc. etc. etc. "CRUSHED TO DUST", with all the massive and catastrophic civilian casualties these atrocities would lead to.

So long as this individual is in the Horde Council, war can begin again and the Horde can once again fall into the bloody legacy of Blackhand.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Will be nice when my copy of the book arrives I’m sure it will be all kinds of a shit show.

But I’d assume the hordes council policy on attacking night elfs is the same as thrall’s being.

[geco]

I've said this before and I'll say it again.

If there will ever be a renewed faction war, it's very likely that the Horde will start it once again.

essentially because of what the spoilers say at the beginning. But the current lore is so incore that no one realizes it yet.

[Varodoc]

essentially because of what the spoilers say at the beginning. But the current lore is so incore that no one realizes it yet.

It is hardly surprising to me if the Horde is once again starting tensions with the Kaldorei.

The Horde just recently committed genocide against them after all, and no amount of "oh but nyooo I was controlled by Thanos... nyooo I didnd't do it on purpose, it wasn't me, it was Evilvanas doing it!!! I'm good now, i have soul back!!!!! plz forgive me xoxoxoxo" is ever going to change that.

This is all in character for the Horde. The Council is clearly an improvement but, as with any improvements, it doesn't just erase the bad/rotting that is still inside the faction.

I just hope that Turalyon/the Alliance will prepare better compared to the abysmal job Anduin did, so that we can avoid another burnt Alliance kingdom (reminder that Teldrassil was an entire kingdom).

[Sondrelk]

BfA ruined the Horde forever. Any attempt at making the Horde seem trustworthy is a massive uphill struggle simply by the fact that they banded behind a genocidal leader that led them on a brutal warpath not once, not twice, but three times.
The fact that the Horde gets to keep existing at all is a stretch. Barring questions on why the Alliance should allow that, why should the Horde? Their armies should be split between those that are okay with such attacks and those who by right should want to distance themselves from them by all costs.

Why are the Tauren okay with still being Horde? Are they really so attached to the grand ideal that they are willing to brush the genocide under the carpet? What about Belves, or the Nightborne? They have little to no reason to stick with the Horde to begin with. Now that the war between the Alliance and Hirde is over they have even less reason. Why don't they just leave the Horde at least officially so they can duck out of any future conflict?


And has been said before, it really is just amazing the writing that keeps talking about Teldrassil like it happened entirely out of anyone control.
It was the Horde that did it. Horde catapults manned by Horde soldiers aided by Horde mages. The tree didn't light itself on fire, the Horde army marched to Teldrassil and burned it down. It might have been because of direct orders they didn't want to disobey, but they still did it.

[Aresk]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...nts/1147065/42

According to the Spoilers and summaries of the new pound the current Horde is still invading the Kaldorei lands and not only that, Rezzar wonders why the Kaldorei keep fighting while they are invading them.

I'm not sure what pound you're referring to, but I saw nothing in the thread suggesting that the Horde is invading. Furthermore, the thread is discussing details from pre-Shadowlands, which are no longer applicable given the Alliance and the Horde have committed their forces to fighting the Scourge.

[Dellis0991]

So the devs just going quad stack the misery on the Night elves I guess, yeesh.

[Sondrelk]

I'm not sure what pound you're referring to, but I saw nothing in the thread suggesting that the Horde is invading. Furthermore, the thread is discussing details from pre-Shadowlands, which are no longer applicable given the Alliance and the Horde have committed their forces to fighting the Scourge.

The book details how the Horde decided to seemingly keep the areas they took in Ashenvale at the start of BfA.
So not exactly invading, but at least refusing to give up land they took during the war they are now ostensibly trying to distance themselves from.

[geco]

I'm not sure what pound you're referring to, but I saw nothing in the thread suggesting that the Horde is invading. Furthermore, the thread is discussing details from pre-Shadowlands, which are no longer applicable given the Alliance and the Horde have committed their forces to fighting the Scourge.

The book is called Exploring Kalimdor.

And if you read correctly they talk about things that happen after the burning of Teldrazzil.

It is hardly surprising to me if the Horde is once again starting tensions with the Kaldorei.

I repeat it just in case, maybe the problem is that I don't know English so well.

But right now while Thrall is trying to get Sylvanas's head to negotiate with Tyrande. The Horde is attacking Ashenvale.

While Elune tells that "renew" lie the horde is cutting down the trees of Ashenvale and starting the war again.

The book details how the Horde decided to seemingly keep the areas they took in Ashenvale at the start of BfA.
So not exactly invading, but at least refusing to give up land they took during the war they are now ostensibly trying to distance themselves from.

They are openly initiating a conflict.

So the devs just going quad stack the misery on the Night elves I guess, yeesh.

And make it clear that the Horde is evil and stupid. Without remedy.

[Varodoc]

I'm not sure what pound you're referring to, but I saw nothing in the thread suggesting that the Horde is invading. Furthermore, the thread is discussing details from pre-Shadowlands, which are no longer applicable given the Alliance and the Horde have committed their forces to fighting the Scourge.

Stardust Spire still stands, and Huntress Jalin and her Sentinels destroyed every single siege weapon the Horde tries to bring through Stonetalon.

My question to you is: Why is the Horde deploying war machines in Ashenvale, despite having signed an """"armistice""" with the Alliance?

Either, FOR SOME UNKNOWN REASON, the Kaldorei DIDN'T demand that the Horde give up their holdings in Ashenvale (like they did at the end of MoP). Or the Horde is preparing for a future conflict, deploying their siege machines strategically in Ashenvale, along the borders with Kaldorei/Alliance territory.

[Aresk]

The book details how the Horde decided to seemingly keep the areas they took in Ashenvale at the start of BfA.
So not exactly invading, but at least refusing to give up land they took during the war they are now ostensibly trying to distance themselves from.

Ah, thanks for the clarification. Yeah, the only thing mentioned for Ashenvale is that summary is that the Alliance is still attacking the Horde there. Nothing about the Horde taking new land, which seems to go contrary to the thread's main post.

The book is called Exploring Kalimdor.

And if you read correctly they talk about things that happen after the burning of Teldrazzil.

Yes, the book takes place after BfA and before Shadowlands. There's nothing mentioning the Horde attacking Alliance presently that I saw. What specifically makes you think the Horde is currently invading kal'dorei lands?

- - - Updated - - -

My question to you is: Why is the Horde deploying war machines in Ashenvale, despite having signed an """"armistice""" with the Alliance?

Either, FOR SOME UNKNOWN REASON, the Kaldorei DIDN'T demand that the Horde give up their holdings in Ashenvale (like they did at the end of MoP). Or the Horde is preparing for a future conflict, deploying their siege machines strategically in Ashenvale, along the borders with Kaldorei/Alliance territory.

The kal'dorei can demand whatever they want; that doesn't mean the Horde is compelled to comply with the demand. Given that Tyrande never signed the armistice and the night elves are actively attacking Horde holdings, it makes sense to reinforce Horde positions.

[Varodoc]

The kal'dorei can demand whatever they want; that doesn't mean the Horde is compelled to comply with the demand. Given that Tyrande never signed the armistice and the night elves are actively attacking Horde holdings, it makes sense to reinforce Horde positions.

Then the Op is right.

1) Horde marches on Ashenvale, slaughtering the defenders and laying waste to the land

2) They literally destroy the kingdom of the Night elves

3) They continue occupying the land of the Night elves which they invaded and stole from its rightful inhabitants

4) Even AFTER the armistice (signed by the Alliance, of which the Kaldorei are a part of), they stubbornly cling to their holdings in Ashenvale and bring in siege weapons for war

The Horde hasn't learned anything it would seem and will no doubt escalate tensions once again.

The Horde is compelled to comply to whatever the Kaldorei demand after everything they put them through in the Fourth War, or did you forget what they did to Teldrassil?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

My question to you is: Why is the Horde deploying war machines in Ashenvale, despite having signed an """"armistice""" with the Alliance?

Either, FOR SOME UNKNOWN REASON, the Kaldorei DIDN'T demand that the Horde give up their holdings in Ashenvale (like they did at the end of MoP). Or the Horde is preparing for a future conflict, deploying their siege machines strategically in Ashenvale, along the borders with Kaldorei/Alliance territory.

The night elf's never act ally signed the armistice so if blizzard wants to get really stupid they could say that it's fair game because of that and that no one else in the alliance ever mentioned ashnenvale.

[MikeBogina]

maybe I'm missing something here but what i see in the summary of horde vs alliance

Ashenvale
Splintertree Post and the Warsong Lumber Camp are still being attacked by the Night Elves.
Azshara
Talrendis Point is still held by the Night Elves and are attacking Valormok, with Zekhan worried the Night Elves will take control one day.
Darkshore
The Army of the Black Moon has moved on from Darkshore to focus their wrath elsewhere (likely Ashenvale and Azshara).

[Super Dickmann]

Hey, they're fair game, they didn't sign the armistice.

All memes aside, Memeboi being pro-peace considering he's Sadfang's main acolyte checks out. That the Army of the Black Moon is still around is good as is that it's pointed out that the Night Elves don't abide by the treaty.

[Aresk]

Then the Op is right.

1) Horde marches on Ashenvale, slaughtering the defenders and laying waste to the land

2) They literally destroy the kingdom of the Night elves

3) They continue occupying the land of the Night elves which they invaded and stole from its rightful inhabitants

4) Even AFTER the armistice (signed by the Alliance, of which the Kaldorei are a part of), they stubbornly cling to their holdings in Ashenvale and bring in siege weapons for war

The Horde hasn't learned anything it would seem and will no doubt escalate tensions once again.

The Horde is compelled to comply to whatever the Kaldorei demand after everything they put them through in the Fourth War, or did you forget what they did to Teldrassil?

The only mention of hostilities is night elves' attacking Horde settlements. The night elves--who do not have a kingdom to begin with--refused the post-BfA peace and continue to seek further bloodshed. The land was given to the Horde during the end of the Alliance-Horde war in MoP, and according to that agreement, the Horde are the rightful inhabitants. The armistice, which the night elves refused to sign, has no bearing in continuing to defend Horde holdings.

One can argue that the Horde should return all of the Ashenvale territory to the night elves, but that was not a point mentioned in the armistice (which again, the night elves didn't sign), and Horde aren't actively attacking. The Alliance appear to be the aggressors by all the points mentioned in that thread, so I don't see why the current Horde Council should be accused of setting the Horde up for further invasion.

[DatToffer]

Ha. So that world revamps is definitely not happening, since nothing is changing at all.

[Varodoc]

The only mention of hostilities is night elves' attacking Horde settlements. The night elves--who do not have a kingdom to begin with--refused the post-BfA peace and continue to seek further bloodshed. The land was given to the Horde during the end of the Alliance-Horde war in MoP, and according to that agreement, the Horde are the rightful inhabitants. The armistice, which the night elves refused to sign, has no bearing in continuing to defend Horde holdings.

One can argue that the Horde should return all of the Ashenvale territory to the night elves, but that was not a point mentioned in the armistice (which again, the night elves didn't sign), and Horde aren't actively attacking. The Alliance appear to be the aggressors by all the points mentioned in that thread, so I don't see why the current Horde Council should be accused of setting the Horde up for further invasion.

Horde settlements on stolen Kaldorei soil.

You missed this part, in your attempt to make Horde invaders look like the victims.

How dare the Kaldorei try to kick the Horde out of their rightful land, which was stolen from them in the War of Thorns!

[DatToffer]

How dare the Kaldorei try to kick the Horde out of their rightful land, which was stolen from them in the War of Thorns!

Stolen since vanilla, even War3 you mean ? Because some of these posts have been around since the start of the game xD