The inevitable merger of Battle.net and Gamepass

[Tech614]

I can't see them removing the WoW sub if/when WoW comes onto the game pass, it's just too much of a money maker.

At best they will give the xpacs out for free or give a discount on the sub. There is no way the entire game of WoW is being included in gamepass. Even if WoW was just 2 million subs all on 6 months subs that would still be over 70 million in revenue per month. That would be a hell of a revenue loss to roll into gamepass.

[KSM899]

I don't think this is going to happen ..

I think Blizz will continue as it is .. as long it's making profit, and last I checked it's making billions ..

[Kallisto]

How does Microsoft handle Elder Scrolls MMO and other MMOs on Game Pass?

In many areas of the world there is no ESO on game pass. At least on PC

[Sentynel]

So I have been thinking about this a lot and it is a certainty that it will happen. I am wondering how long they will wait and how they will go about it.

My best personal guess is that they move the WoW sub into Gamepass Ultimate when it happens and then phase out the battle.net app and then make some kind of season pass you can get for cosmetic rewards.

Why would they phase out battle.net? There's absolutely no reason to do so.

[Gaidax]

Battle.net will be as it is now. Maybe WoW sub will go on game pass, but they won't be removing Battle.net. They never do these things.

[Smashfist]

They aren't rermoving a money maker.

I wouldn't be so sure. I don't sub to WoW more than once every 4-5 months because a) I have less time these days to play/when I do I'm catching up on the pile of shame and b) the sub got price jacked.

I don't sub to Game Pass as I don't see the value in it.

Roll the two together, I'm in. Bam, they just got someone to subscribe who currently doesn't pay for either service ongoing. Lots of people are on the fence.

[XDurionX]

This may happen, but it's far from certain, meaning probably less money for MS.

[cparle87]

I don't mind getting a 2 in 1 deal. WoW's subscription is way too high anyway considering how server costs have dropped since 2005, even if you factor in inflation. WoW basically finances most other Blizzard games and of course the never released games, too.
So if the financialy structure changes under Microsoft, then I'm all for it.

Server costs have gone down, but that's really the only thing. Every kind of living expensive (water, electricity, rent/property tax depending), salaries, taxes, and inflation have all gone up. Don't forget Blizzard HQ is right outside Los Angeles, an extremely expensive area. Adjusting for inflation the fact the price hasn't gone up in 18 years means you're paying less for WoW now relatively than you were in 2004.

Very dishonest to try to imply that server costs are the only thing our sub pays for and therefore we're overpaying since server costs have gone down.

[FuxieDK]

So I have been thinking about this a lot and it is a certainty that it will happen. I am wondering how long they will wait and how they will go about it.

My best personal guess is that they move the WoW sub into Gamepass Ultimate when it happens and then phase out the battle.net app and then make some kind of season pass you can get for cosmetic rewards.

I'm pretty sure, US government will file an anti-trust case and/or EU will file for misuse of monopoly, if they do any of that.

[Gaidax]

This may happen, but it's far from certain, meaning probably less money for MS.

You don't see the big picture here, MS does not need WoW money - what they want is more people joining their gaming ecosystem. That's what they bought ActiBlizz for, not some silly monthly subs.

WoW sub $$ is a small price to pay for adding millions of people to Game Pass and having a chunk of them explore it. It's much more $$ in the long run.

[LordVargK]

Server costs have gone down, but that's really the only thing. Every kind of living expensive (water, electricity, rent/property tax depending), salaries, taxes, and inflation have all gone up. Don't forget Blizzard HQ is right outside Los Angeles, an extremely expensive area. Adjusting for inflation the fact the price hasn't gone up in 18 years means you're paying less for WoW now relatively than you were in 2004.

Very dishonest to try to imply that server costs are the only thing our sub pays for and therefore we're overpaying since server costs have gone down.

Blizzard automated most of the customer service, gave up their EU HQ. They own their LA HQ.
Still, even if it were not so, WoW is generating waaaay more money than it costs and it IS many times more expensive than most other MMORPGs.
I'm not saying were overpaying, but I think it could be economically feasable for Microsoft to combine the game Pass with WoW's sub cost without losing money.

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I'm pretty sure, US government will file an anti-trust case and/or EU will file for misuse of monopoly, if they do any of that.

What monopoly? And why misuse? What's the problem with combining two services in one?

[XDurionX]

You don't see the big picture here, MS does not need WoW money - what they want is more people joining their gaming ecosystem. That's what they bought ActiBlizz for, not some silly monthly subs.

WoW sub $$ is a small price to pay for adding millions of people to Game Pass and having a chunk of them explore it. It's much more $$ in the long run.

Just because they don't need the money doesn't mean they will forfeit it. The question is not whether more people will PLAY WoW, the question is will more people PAY for WoW.

[Smashfist]

Just because they don't need the money doesn't mean they will forfeit it. The question is not whether more people will PLAY WoW, the question is will more people PAY for WoW.

For Microsoft the purchase is not about WoW. They are desperate to add subscribing users to their online Game Pass ecosystem. Fragmenting it with multiple subscriptions and making it harder to get a buy-in is not how they achieve that.

[Makabreska]

My best personal guess is that they move the WoW sub into Gamepass Ultimate when it happens and then phase out the battle.net app and then make some kind of season pass you can get for cosmetic rewards.

Why phase it out? Game Pass already makes you install clients like Origin. Why remove B.net, the thing that everybody got used to?

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For Microsoft the purchase is not about WoW. They are desperate to add subscribing users to their online Game Pass ecosystem. Fragmenting it with multiple subscriptions and making it harder to get a buy-in is not how they achieve that.

I don't think "desperate" is a good word. They are in the leading position in amassing studios and games under one roof, Game Pass is a vastly superior offer on the market. It makes companies like Sony play the catch-up.

[cparle87]

Blizzard automated most of the customer service, gave up their EU HQ. They own their LA HQ.
Still, even if it were not so, WoW is generating waaaay more money than it costs and it IS many times more expensive than most other MMORPGs.
I'm not saying were overpaying, but I think it could be economically feasable for Microsoft to combine the game Pass with WoW's sub cost without losing money.

"WoW's subscription is way too high anyway"
"I'm not saying we're overpaying"

Which is it? And keep in mind prices have never gone up, have actually gone down with the addition of 3- and 6-month bundles, and, of course, inflation. Your sub is cheaper than it's even been.

One other side thing that came to mind as I'm writing this is it seems Blizzard actually allots a budget to each individual team within the WoW team. Art team, quest team, raid team, etc. I remember it from their LFR blue post about how raiding in vanilla and BC actually lost them money cause the audience wasn't worth the money it took to make the raids.

So yeah, WoW makes more than it costs, even if it costs more than other MMOs to produce, I agree. But those costs might not be divvied up the way we think they are.

[LordVargK]

"WoW's subscription is way too high anyway"
"I'm not saying we're overpaying"

Which is it? And keep in mind prices have never gone up, have actually gone down with the addition of 3- and 6-month bundles, and, of course, inflation. Your sub is cheaper than it's even been.

Both? WoW's subscription is too high if the only justification for collecting a sub at all is to cover running costs. And there needs to be justification considering it's nearly the only subscription based game on the market anymore. But if you are considering content and access to your account many people invested literally years into, then you're not overpaying, since you still get what you've paid for 10 years ago. The amount of ingame content and your collectables do not diminish.

One other side thing that came to mind as I'm writing this is it seems Blizzard actually allots a budget to each individual team within the WoW team. Art team, quest team, raid team, etc. I remember it from their LFR blue post about how raiding in vanilla and BC actually lost them money cause the audience wasn't worth the money it took to make the raids.

So yeah, WoW makes more than it costs, even if it costs more than other MMOs to produce, I agree. But those costs might not be divvied up the way we think they are.

How exactly the money is spend on WoW is not all that important, it's the overall sum that interesting. I'm pretty sure Microsoft sees it also that way. I can't imagine that they micromanage how costs are distributed to keep one game running. Sure, some financial officer will do the calculations. But that officer will sit at Blizzard, not at Microsoft. Microsoft will probably just pay and demand a game once in a while to add to their XBox environment. As long as Blizzard delivers and doesn't cause any scandals, Microsoft won't care how exactly the money is spend.

[Unlimited Power]

I haven't checked whether there's any discrepancy in price between Gamepass and WoW, but as long as Blizzard/Microsoft keeps the 6 month sub option available for a discount/free mount promotions etc, I'd be more than happy to have them merge.

There's a lot of games on Gamepass that I'd like to try but can't justify buying because I spend a great deal of time playing WoW anyway. With a merger of the subs I wouldn't have to worry about that.

[crusadernero]

I would not be surprised if wow moves over to game pass, and as such the game becomes "free". You gotta pay for gamepass ofc, but not for wow.

Then, in wow you have the option to also sub that gives you certain benefits. What kind of benefits? Only your imagination stops you.

[cparle87]

Both? WoW's subscription is too high if the only justification for collecting a sub at all is to cover running costs. And there needs to be justification considering it's nearly the only subscription based game on the market anymore. But if you are considering content and access to your account many people invested literally years into, then you're not overpaying, since you still get what you've paid for 10 years ago. The amount of ingame content and your collectables do not diminish.




How exactly the money is spend on WoW is not all that important, it's the overall sum that interesting. I'm pretty sure Microsoft sees it also that way. I can't imagine that they micromanage how costs are distributed to keep one game running. Sure, some financial officer will do the calculations. But that officer will sit at Blizzard, not at Microsoft. Microsoft will probably just pay and demand a game once in a while to add to their XBox environment. As long as Blizzard delivers and doesn't cause any scandals, Microsoft won't care how exactly the money is spend.

If. That's the operative word. We don't know what the sub money is allocated for. And I disagree with the premise on principle that "none of our competitors do it therefore it's unacceptable for us to do it." Feels too closed minded to me. You are right about the rest.

Gotta disagree there. Everything has a cost/profit ratio. Things like pet battles gets constant updates if only in the form of new tamers and pets, because it's very cheap to do. Stuff like making dungeons and raids are a lot more cost intensive. There's the art team, the quest team, the boss team, the loot team, etc etc who all need to work on an instance. From the very beginning dungeons and raids were a net loss. You did a dungeon once while levelling up if you did it at all. Max level ones and raids got more use but still were a loss. That's why in BC we got heroic dungeons to extend replayable and recycled art assets in the forms of the 4 dungeons to one complex system. Wrath had an entire recycled raid with Naxx and practically every art asset got re-used. The complex thing got re-used in Coldarra, and then the ICC 5-mans. Cata was by far the most recycled xpac dungeon-wise as you could see the shoestring budget the instance teams had to work with after 4 xpacs of getting their budgets cut. First tier everything but Twilight Citadel was a complex, half of the second tier was cut, and last tier was entirely cut.

Then came LFR, and we saw firsthand the number, size, and quality (from an art standpoint) went way, way up. We got challenge modes, then mythic dungeons, then keystones to keep this rolling. The dungeon teams had to keep proving they deserved their budget.

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I would not be surprised if wow moves over to game pass, and as such the game becomes "free". You gotta pay for gamepass ofc, but not for wow.

Then, in wow you have the option to also sub that gives you certain benefits. What kind of benefits? Only your imagination stops you.

They'll probably keep going with the "buy your pass in 6 month chunks get goodies" thing. Or maybe seasonal pets and transmog sets on the store.

[thunderdragon2]

There's no benefit to keeping them separate once the acquisition is complete. Especially since every single game that's on battle net PC is gonna be available on game pass there's no point in having in 2 places. Microsoft also has the most advanced server network system on the planet, even better than Google's.

It does potentially make game pass better though if they have to rework it to incorporate wow into its interface.

im fine with it as long as 2 conditions are met

1) i dont have to pay more for wow then i already am
2) once the acquisition is complete can use still use my wow long in details for wow i dont have a xbox so i have no need for a gamespass or even just let us use either to long in if they merge the 2.

as long as those 2 criteria are met i dont mind what they do