April 19 Tinker Reveal

[Nightshade711]

It's kinda funny tbh.
"They build stuff and are resourceful, thus they can be tinkers" Is an argument i've heard.

Yeah, I built my own kitchen shelf, so I can now build nuclear reactors.

Agreed.
Tinkers should only be Gnomes/Mechagnomes and Goblins in my opinion. Gives them more room to play around with things like the mech. (Literally)

The only other race we see with actual mechs or viable tinkering is Lightforged Draenei… but if they had the warframe as their mech that would be far too big.
Whereas the smaller races can have it be the height of a Tauren/Draenei/Kul Tiran (if not slightly bigger) not have it be a major issue.
Dwarves MIGHT be able to handle the size thing too, but I’m not sure… but most of dwarf technology is just Gnomish, except for Dark Iron but all they have are golems.

This includes if the mech is either permanent vehicle/“form” or a cooldown ability.

(Though I guess in theory they could just have the Draenei’s be something like one of the vigilants and they’re just inside of it I guess? But I think that could be weird if not explained.)

[elaina]

Engineer: Ranged DPS. I don't want to spoil it, but you guys are going to LOVE it.

Fucking lawl.

I would like a new class but hope this ain't it

[Nightshade711]

But also no other race outside of the two gnomes/ goblins really have a technology theme to them.
I could spend a while stretching every race to fit in some weird way but if you think technology in WoW you’re either thinking about gnomes or goblins most of the time.

[Kiria]

Fucking lawl.

I would like a new class but hope this ain't it

Join the club :/

[ZazuuPriest]

They are going to introduce WOTLK Classic on the 19th not this half baked tinker idea.

BTW a tank class that revolves around shielding itself would be so broken it could never work

[Calfredd]

But also no other race outside of the two gnomes/ goblins really have a technology theme to them.
I could spend a while stretching every race to fit in some weird way but if you think technology in WoW you’re either thinking about gnomes or goblins most of the time.

You really want to kill the class, don't you?

[Mace]

I agree with most of it, except for Night Elves. Night Elves are too connected to nature for them to be tinkers. Same can be said for Regular Trolls.. but Zandalari trolls do have technological marvels and even sentinels of their own.

It is also worth noting that Void Elves could also get their tech from the Locus Hunters and the Void Ethereals.

Vulpera, they are scavengers and there was a whole World Quest where they are given a gadget to test out on wild life. It is also worth noting that they could also borrow stuff from the Sethraks to use for their own ends and also ancient Zandalari technology.

Just some thoughts on that.

Night Elves: Nature connection doesn't exclude engineering at all.. do you forget night elves had glaive throwers in warcraft 3 and employed living machines, not to mention they built the greatest civilization, remember the same night elves who built those thing are around today, and the ancient trees who like the elves remember everything except the trees store the memories biologically, like data on a computer (read Twilight of the Aspects), and none of them are in the long vigil phase restricting themselves to nature only - they would employ technology, you have to stop thinking of them only as druids, and remember you have Highborne, priests, and many others, also remember that the night elves you play are not -anti-technology nor anti magic either. The kaldorei empire I am sure was more technologically advanced than the gnomes, and those people are still around, and don't have those restrictions.

What I can say about night elves is that they won't be harming nature to create their tech although.. can we say that? they definitely hunt, and their druids definitely ask nature to give even life to destroy their enemies at need. And that's not counting the highborne employing the arcane or the priests calling on Elune - no to mention they never only relied on magic - making them more versatile. When i think current night elves, i think all the kaldorei empire ingenuity which can add to it great advancedment in living machines - afterall the arcane ancients were kinda like that modified, and they had these in additions to the constructs you see in Suramar.

I forgot the Worgen.

Void elves would likely be based on blood elf tech, just adapted with void. They could use ethereal, but I doubt blizzard would, I think this sis because Ethereals have always been a potential race theme, and the void elf Thalassian theme is already established, it's a void version of the blood/high elves. Just like the night elves is a nature version of the Nightborne, or rather than Nightborne is an arcane heavy skewed version of the more balanced night elves.

Vulpera : are scavengers, but tat actually makes and qualifies them as some of the best mechanics, best at putting together scrap technology, as foxes their intellect would quite high, and yes they are heavily involved with Zandalari and Sethrakk in terms of technology. they could be a surprise engineering crafty race, the thing with their race is that they are not established enough to build a civilization or anything like that, doesn't mean they aren't good with gadgets or tech - and I think this is where I would place them.

In the quests with Vulpera, you see them quite smart with ancient mechanisms, lock puzzles too, and that scavenging nature screams mechanic/engineer - but without establishment can't develop enough to the degree you can produce and build your tech. but you can figure out those of others.

As a race, gnomes and goblins are the most interested in technology and might be the ones with the highest aptitude towards it as their cultures, especially gnomes are geared heavily towards it, however they're young - Night elves (Nightborne included here), and Draenei (Lightforged too), and I would also think High elves (i.e. blood/void elves) too all reached a level more advanced than they with technology - even though these races have a greater aptitude to arcane magic (elves) and light (draenei) than they do technology.

in time, if they survive, it's very likely that gnomes would reach the highest level of technological advancement - we see this from the mechagnomes of Ulduar - titan technology is ahead of draenei and elven technologies, but those mecha gnomes aren't playable. The playable mecha gnomes however are quite advanced. Proving that the current gnomes declined when their king left, and the ones who left with him developed even further and faster than the gnomes in Gnomeragan.

[Nightshade711]

You really want to kill the class, don't you?

People that like the idea of tinkers probably wouldn’t care if they’re gnomes/Mechagnomes and goblins only.

None of the other races make sense or really come to mind when thinking “technology in Warcraft”
Except MAYBE LFDs but their main theme is the light.
(Example: Take away the mechs from LFDs and they still are able to stand on their own. Take away tech from Gnomes/Goblins and they lose most, if not all of their identity)

[Woggmer]

People that like the idea of tinkers probably wouldn’t care if they’re gnomes/Mechagnomes and goblins only.

None of the other races make sense or really come to mind when thinking “technology in Warcraft”

If people are upset that Tinkers on other races besides Gnomes/Mechagnomes and goblins doesn't make sense... Neither is Gnome Priests... which to this day still doesn't make any sense no matter how much people try to spin it and say "Oh they're just field medics so it totally works."

[Mace]

This is probably the biggest reach i've seen you done - and why are you linking the npc spell? :P

The druid spell is completely different. its basically just a dot. It doesnt drain and its not an aoe effect around the caster and it has a different name.

Unholy blight is closer but its not the same, its got a different name, it doesnt drain from the targets.

You are reaching way too far here. You know i am right about this

As i said - my brewmaster makes sense if you know what copium means.

"It's a fact that each expansion class comes from WC3"

No - its not.

" It's a fact that these three classes had WC3 abilities as its base."

Most classes in wow do

"It's a fact that the last two WC3 heroes with open abilities are Goblin and tech based."

Also no - i just gave you an example of one in the crypt lord

Hmm.. when i think of the brewmasters, I am tempted to add Pandaren to the list, i mean while they have no advanced or even decent civilziation, they are certainly intelligent enough for the job, it is the breweries that are industralised that to be honest would qualify them as potential tinkers, their approach would come from brew making really, but it is still something.

[Nightshade711]

If people are upset that Tinkers on other races besides Gnomes/Mechagnomes and goblins doesn't make sense... Neither is Gnome Priests... which to this day still doesn't make any sense no matter how much people try to spin it and say "Oh they're just field medics so it totally works."

Gnomes have always been seeing using holy abilities even back in classic (in Gnomeregan) and wotlk.
Given their connection to the two other light worshipping races for thousands of years it would make even less sense for there to not be some light worshipping Gnomes.

But being around Gnomes wouldn’t instantly give Humans and Dwarves naturally increased intellect.

[cordrann]

Okay, and? That's irrelevant stuff since I never said that WoW is exclusively a high fantasy game. I simply said that the game at its core is a high fantasy game, having that genre as its main theme.

The implication of this is that your original statement was entirely irrelevant. I guess I was just assuming you thought you were posting some kind of point and not just triviality.

[Netherspark]

This is somehow even worse than the Light's Judgement leak. Also why would Dark Iron Dwarves be able to be tinkers, but not regular dwarves. Same goes with the Orcs. And no Mecha-gnome tinker wtf?

Dark Iron Dwarves have always been more engineer-focussed than regular Dwarves - golems, mole machines etc.

[Eggroll]

Just give me night elf paladins already - and decent character models.

[cocomen2]

Not opposed to this, but I'm gonna need to see a source.

Why can't you just to trust him, bro. Random people on internet not known for talking shit or telling lies.


One of its abilities already got leaked, hi-goblin-tech

[Teriz]

This is probably the biggest reach i've seen you done - and why are you linking the npc spell? :P

Because that NPC just happens to also be a Crypt Lord.

The druid spell is completely different. its basically just a dot. It doesnt drain and its not an aoe effect around the caster and it has a different name.

It's a DoT that summons a swarm of insects to damage a target, just like the Crypt Lord ability. It even shares the same icon.

Unholy blight is closer but its not the same, its got a different name, it doesnt drain from the targets.

It has a different name because "Locust Swarm" doesn't really fit the DK, also Druids still had Insect Swarm.

You are reaching way too far here. You know i am right about this

Saying that an ability that summons insects that deals damage or inflicts disease came from a RTS ability that summoned insects and healed the caster is a huge reach? It's important to note that not even the Nerubian Crypt Lord NPC who had Locust Swarm did exactly what the RTS hero was doing.

"It's a fact that each expansion class comes from WC3"

No - its not.

DK, Brewmaster (Monk), DH = All from WC3.

" It's a fact that these three classes had WC3 abilities as its base."

Most classes in wow do

Yes, which should tell you that the next class will as well.

"It's a fact that the last two WC3 heroes with open abilities are Goblin and tech based."

Also no - i just gave you an example of one in the crypt lord

Only if you want to be obtuse and ignore the fact that the Crypt Lord ultimate is currently in the class lineup.

[Musta]

wild idea: no new class, fix the ones we already have, cause its horrible rn

[ClassicPeon]

SNIP

"Because that NPC just happens to also be a Crypt Lord."

Which is irrelevant because we are talking about classes

"It's a DoT that summons a swarm of insects to damage a target, just like the Crypt Lord ability. It even shares the same icon."
Also irrelevant. its not the same ability at all. Whatsoever.

"It has a different name because "Locust Swarm" doesn't really fit the DK, also Druids still had Insect Swarm."
Because its a different ability. Thank you

"DK, Brewmaster (Monk), DH = All from WC3."
This is such a sweeping statement that is has literally no impact on the conversation

"Yes, which should tell you that the next class will as well."
Nope. Thats not how it works

"Only if you want to be obtuse and ignore the fact that the Crypt Lord ultimate is currently in the class lineup."
If you can reach that far with locust swarm you can do it with every ability from every hero, as such your entire argument falls flat.

Its pretty basic. You can either argue that an ability has to be exactly like wc3 and then the crypt lord is not in wow - or you can argue that you can bend the abilities to fit into wow and then all wow classes including expansion classes are a mishmash of all the heroes in wc3.

You cant cherry pick :P

- - - Updated - - -

wild idea: no new class, fix the ones we already have, cause its horrible rn

Remaking all the current specs would most certainly make up for no new class. I agree.

Not remaking any specs and no new class = no buy however. Rotations is the most fundamental gameplay mechanic in wow and it cant be the same 4 years in a row.

[Musta]

"Because that NPC just happens to also be a Crypt Lord."

Which is irrelevant because we are talking about classes

"It's a DoT that summons a swarm of insects to damage a target, just like the Crypt Lord ability. It even shares the same icon."
Also irrelevant. its not the same ability at all. Whatsoever.

"It has a different name because "Locust Swarm" doesn't really fit the DK, also Druids still had Insect Swarm."
Because its a different ability. Thank you

"DK, Brewmaster (Monk), DH = All from WC3."
This is such a sweeping statement that is has literally no impact on the conversation

"Yes, which should tell you that the next class will as well."
Nope. Thats not how it works

"Only if you want to be obtuse and ignore the fact that the Crypt Lord ultimate is currently in the class lineup."
If you can reach that far with locust swarm you can do it with every ability from every hero, as such your entire argument falls flat.

Its pretty basic. You can either argue that an ability has to be exactly like wc3 and then the crypt lord is not in wow - or you can argue that you can bend the abilities to fit into wow and then all wow classes including expansion classes are a mishmash of all the heroes in wc3.

You cant cherry pick :P

- - - Updated - - -



Remaking all the current specs would most certainly make up for no new class. I agree.

Not remaking any specs and no new class = no buy however. Rotations is the most fundamental gameplay mechanic in wow and it cant be the same 4 years in a row.

I agree in part, it can be the same if the rotation and gameplay is GOOD, you just need to build on it.

[Teriz]

"Because that NPC just happens to also be a Crypt Lord."

Which is irrelevant because we are talking about classes

Actually its quite relevant, because it shows you the similarity of the ability between a Crypt lord and a non-crypt lord user.

"It's a DoT that summons a swarm of insects to damage a target, just like the Crypt Lord ability. It even shares the same icon."
Also irrelevant. its not the same ability at all. Whatsoever.

Uh, the WoW version of Locust Swarm is a DoT where the target is swarmed by a bunch of insects.

The WoW version of Insect Swarm is a DoT where the target is swarmed by a bunch of insects.

"It has a different name because "Locust Swarm" doesn't really fit the DK, also Druids still had Insect Swarm."
Because its a different ability. Thank you

See above. You're welcome.

"DK, Brewmaster (Monk), DH = All from WC3."
This is such a sweeping statement that is has literally no impact on the conversation

The impact on the conversation is that it's a fact.

"Yes, which should tell you that the next class will as well."
Nope. Thats not how it works

If every class in WoW has a foundation in WC3, why would the next class be any different?

"Only if you want to be obtuse and ignore the fact that the Crypt Lord ultimate is currently in the class lineup."
If you can reach that far with locust swarm you can do it with every ability from every hero, as such your entire argument falls flat.

Its pretty basic. You can either argue that an ability has to be exactly like wc3 and then the crypt lord is not in wow - or you can argue that you can bend the abilities to fit into wow and then all wow classes including expansion classes are a mishmash of all the heroes in wc3.

Which is a nonsensical argument. Obviously not every ability translated from WC3 is going to be 1:1 with the MMO version. However, if the ability has the same name and the same general function and flavor of the original WC3 ability, it's rather easy to see where it came from.

Unless you're being purposely obtuse.