Troll History

[Pendraeg]

Okay, so I'm pretty familiar, in broad strokes at least, with the lore of most of the races.
Dwarves and Gnomes are degenerated Earthen of the Titans via the curse of flesh from the Old Gods, as are troggs and kobolds.
Humans are degenerate Vrykul, which are also degenerate Titan constructs.
Dragons, Giants, Mogu, and the Tolvir are also direct Titan constructs, some more hit by Curse of Flesh than others.
Orcs are degenerate Ogres, which are degenerate Orgon, which are degenerate Gronn which were created by a Titan.
Draenei were part of the Eredar, which are so old and alien, we don't know their history prior to their escape from Argus.
Pandarians and Tauren (from the Yaungol) are products of the Ancients.
Goblins are products of the Ancients indirectly, sharing that ancestor with Pygmies, and then modified by the Mimiron.
Worgen are cursed humans.
Forsaken are cursed humans (maybe elves).
All the elves were night elves at one point, which were Dark Trolls.
Where did Trolls come from? They weren't products of the Ancients like some of the more "Animalistic" races (Tauren, Pandaren, Sethrak, Pygmies, Wolvar, Murlocs, Grell, Gnolls, Furbolgs, Quillboars, Harpies, etc. etc.).
Are they direct products of the Old Gods? Like the Mantids, Aqir, Silithid, etc.?
I don't think we know, do we?

[Iain]

Correct in that we don't know. There was nothing before trolls as far as we know. The Zandalar trolls just existed as a primitive species and found the Loa and build their civilization accordingly.

I like it that way. I like that not every single race is an artefact of something else. For Blizzard to insert some kind of creation of the trolls would be a mistake. But they certainly could do some timetravel stuff and let us visit a place where the Trolls are just primitive cavemen worshipping their ancient gods.

In fact, the ancient troll empires have enough potential content for their own Expansion. It's just one vast continent of zones connected together, which would already be thematically refreshing compared to the isolated zones of the Shadowlands.

[Aresk]

Okay, so I'm pretty familiar, in broad strokes at least, with the lore of most of the races.
Dwarves and Gnomes are degenerated Earthen of the Titans via the curse of flesh from the Old Gods, as are troggs and kobolds.
Humans are degenerate Vrykul, which are also degenerate Titan constructs.
Dragons, Giants, Mogu, and the Tolvir are also direct Titan constructs, some more hit by Curse of Flesh than others.
Orcs are degenerate Ogres, which are degenerate Orgon, which are degenerate Gronn which were created by a Titan.
Draenei were part of the Eredar, which are so old and alien, we don't know their history prior to their escape from Argus.
Pandarians and Tauren (from the Yaungol) are products of the Ancients.
Goblins are products of the Ancients indirectly, sharing that ancestor with Pygmies, and then modified by the Mimiron.
Worgen are cursed humans.
Forsaken are cursed humans (maybe elves).
All the elves were night elves at one point, which were Dark Trolls.
Where did Trolls come from? They weren't products of the Ancients like some of the more "Animalistic" races (Tauren, Pandaren, Sethrak, Pygmies, Wolvar, Murlocs, Grell, Gnolls, Furbolgs, Quillboars, Harpies, etc. etc.).
Are they direct products of the Old Gods? Like the Mantids, Aqir, Silithid, etc.?
I don't think we know, do we?

They came from the "cycles" of life influenced by the Well of Eternity, per Chronicle, but we also know that Bwonsamdi himself came from a proto-troll that worshipped Mueh'zala, who as a loa is also a wild god, so take from that what you will.

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Correct in that we don't know. There was nothing before trolls as far as we know. The Zandalar trolls just existed as a primitive species and found the Loa and build their civilization accordingly.

There has been some lore evidence to suggest murlocs predate trolls. Not to mention elementals, titan constructs, and the a'qir all predate them. Unless you're talking about ancestors specifically, in which case we do know there were proto-trolls.

[Pendraeg]

I like it that way. I like that not every single race is an artefact of something else. For Blizzard to insert some kind of creation of the trolls would be a mistake.

I don't know that I agree with you. I mean, I think it's totally fine for the trolls to have always been trolls like we still have some Yaungol as well as Tauren, but, given the creation of life on Azeroth, there had to be an origin somewhere, whether it be Old God, Titan, or Ancient, or even something totally different like Shadowlands First Ones a la the Nethrezim. I know there was some hinting at them being decended from Mogu in MoP, but it wasn't very fleshed out (no pun intended).

Edit: and I should probably change the verbiage I used, calling them "Ancients". Those are only the Night Elf spiritual leaders, the "class" is technically "Wild Gods" includes the some of the Loa (minus dead souls in various forms) and the August Celestials from Pandaria, which were all traced back to the Titans via the Keeper Freya (which is a little weird, but currently canon).

[Golden Yak]

Where did Trolls come from?

Earlier lore, long before Chronicle established some stuff, stated that the oldest races on Azeroth, before the coming of the Titans, were the tauren, the faceless ones, and the trolls.

Current lore though seems to suggest that the Well of Eternity accelerated the cycles of natural evolution in lifeforms on Azeroth, so it's possible the trolls simply evolved from some primitive animal species that had its evolution enhanced by the Well.

[Iain]

so it's possible the trolls simply evolved from some primitive animal species that had its evolution enhanced by the Well.

Maybe that beserker sub-species are what came before the trolls.

[Skytotem]

All information points to trolls having evolved on their own

[Felrane]

Likely came from raptors.

[Maljinwo]

It's never confirmed what the Trolls were before being trolls.
Only that the Well of Eternity influenced them

[Korsha]

Prior to Zereth Mortis and the prototype creatures there, it was hinted or directly established in chronicles that non-titan lifeforms evolved from elementals. Azeroth is strong with all the primal elemental forces, specially the spirit of life, which possibly made various elementals degenerate into creatures of flesh and blood.
Some lineages I personally have theorized are goblins evolving from water spirits (mainly because of gilblins existing), trolls from earth spirits, hinted at by a tendency to grow rocklike scales and protrusions, and dragons evolving from all elements, which is why they are so varied in colors and natures. That last one I'm most confident in, as dragons have many different breath attacks, and we've seen dragon-like creatures in all the elemental planes (Firebirds, rock drakes).

But again, with Zereth Mortis showing us early robot design of creatures who may have been seeded and evolved throughout the cosmos, who really knows anymore? Maybe everything is First One creations now

[enigma77]

pretty sure trolls evolved from some dinosaur species

[Netherspark]

I live to think they evolved from Grell.

[Caerule]

It's a tricky one. I'd love the answer myself. All we know, from the Vol'jin book, is that before they were Trolls, they were something else. Before they struck their bargain with the Wild Gods that made them Trolls.

My three suspects are:

Grell. Themselves possibly Flame Imps that escaped banishment, as some elementals did, to become things of nature. Grell have Troll-like faces, and enough culture to them to have metal blades and jewelry. So they are smart enough to perhaps have struck a bargain with the Loa.

Drogbar. Their origin isn't known, but they may be creatures descendent from elementals as well. They've got Troll-like ears and are at one point referred to as Stone Trolls.

Spriggans. Troll-like faces. They seemingly arose from nature. They also follow Mueh'zala in Ardenweald.

None of the three fits perfectly. And I think any of the three could work, as among the first creatures to rise up from nature, tie themselves to the Wild Gods, and create the first civilization. I've got no clue which one is the most likely. But of the three, I probably like the Grell option from personal preference.

[LemonDemonGirl]

It's a tricky one. I'd love the answer myself. All we know, from the Vol'jin book, is that before they were Trolls, they were something else. Before they struck their bargain with the Wild Gods that made them Trolls.

My three suspects are:

Grell. Themselves possibly Flame Imps that escaped banishment, as some elementals did, to become things of nature. Grell have Troll-like faces, and enough culture to them to have metal blades and jewelry. So they are smart enough to perhaps have struck a bargain with the Loa.

Drogbar. Their origin isn't known, but they may be creatures descendent from elementals as well. They've got Troll-like ears and are at one point referred to as Stone Trolls.

Spriggans. Troll-like faces. They seemingly arose from nature. They also follow Mueh'zala in Ardenweald.

None of the three fits perfectly. And I think any of the three could work, as among the first creatures to rise up from nature, tie themselves to the Wild Gods, and create the first civilization. I've got no clue which one is the most likely. But of the three, I probably like the Grell option from personal preference.

Grell are also pretty close in appearance to the generic Norse Troll, so I'd think that'd be rather fitting, if it IS indeed true.

[cparle87]

They came from the "cycles" of life influenced by the Well of Eternity, per Chronicle, but we also know that Bwonsamdi himself came from a proto-troll that worshipped Mueh'zala, who as a loa is also a wild god, so take from that what you will.

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There has been some lore evidence to suggest murlocs predate trolls. Not to mention elementals, titan constructs, and the a'qir all predate them. Unless you're talking about ancestors specifically, in which case we do know there were proto-trolls.

Trolls were the first native to Azeroth natural beings to achieve sapience and achieve civilization. Constructs and aqir aren't native, and all worlds come with elementals.

[Aresk]

Trolls were the first native to Azeroth natural beings to achieve sapience and achieve civilization. Constructs and aqir aren't native, and all worlds come with elementals.

Elementals aren't natural? And if the constructs aren't native to the world they literally were shaped from, where are they native? That still doesn't account for the other races that stemmed from the Ancients and are said to predate trolls (e.g. murlocs/gorlocs), unless they also don't count for some reason.

[cparle87]

Elementals aren't natural? And if the constructs aren't native to the world they literally were shaped from, where are they native? That still doesn't account for the other races that stemmed from the Ancients and are said to predate trolls (e.g. murlocs/gorlocs), unless they also don't count for some reason.

By natural I meant flesh and blood beings that weren't shaped by other forces. Also murlocs/gorlocs never had a civilization tmk.

[Skytotem]

Trolls must have come from ''loserville'' originally cuz they have only been catching L's since the the beginning of, well, everything.

Eh, they did pretty well for the first few hundred thousand years, it's only the last 10k years that things really went south for them.

Heck the Drakkari were doing pretty well right up until the scourge hit em.

[cparle87]

Eh, they did pretty well for the first few hundred thousand years, it's only the last 10k years that things really went south for them.

Heck the Drakkari were doing pretty well right up until the scourge hit em.

According to official lore the first troll empire, the Empire of Zul, was only founded 16k years ago. And we know it had lots of problems, for instance the blood plague mentioned in King's Rest and the attack of Mythrax. Then 13.5k years ago they had most of their territory conquered by the Kaldorei Empire. So yeah, a relatively not terrible 2.5k years.

[Aresk]

what, back when there was literally nobody else besides trolls on the planet?

There was never a time when trolls were alone. The titan keepers predate them, as do the entities that became dwarves, troggs, vrykul, humans, tol'vir, gnomes, etc., with the Mogu bearing particular note given their interactions with the trolls. Murlocs predate them. The aqir predate them, and the nerubian, mantid, and qiraji empires arose around the same time as the troll empires. There was never a time where it was only trolls.