SCOTUS removes Roe V Wade

[s_bushido]

[...] so his reasoning lacks consistency.

That's why it's almost entirely pointless to argue with the "abortion is murder!!!" crowd. At least the ones who pop up around here.

[Varx]

Holy crap, living rent free in some people's heads here.

The thread usually dies after a day of me coming in here to splash some red paint.

Anyway I simplified it last night.

Hypothetically, if we had the best imaginable adoption, welfare, parent resource, sex ed, free contraceptive systems.

Would any of you flip? Or is "muh autonomy" that important, cuz again, if a man could get pregnant I'd feel exactly the same. Just like how many conservative women also feel.

Also, in regards to rape. This is why it's an extreme but I wouldn't be behind a woman who got raped and decides to get an abortion 6 months after. It has to be reasonable.

Round 2, FIGHT

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Yeah that last sentence is hard to understand, LMAO!

Really reaching to Andromeda here aren't you? "Haha he said "you're " instead of "your"". That's all you got? Shame on you, there so much more you could attempt to get me on, like pages and pages and you fixate in a small grammatical error.

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That's why it's almost entirely pointless to argue with the "abortion is murder!!!" crowd. At least the ones who pop up around here.

Laws ain't perfect. Human life ain't perfect. But saying that blanket abortion is okay because rape abortion is okay is insane. Exception doesn't make the rule.

[shimerra]

Would any of you flip? Or is "muh autonomy" that important, cuz again, if a man could get pregnant I'd feel exactly the same. Just like how many conservative women also feel.

[/SIZE][/COLOR]



Really reaching to Andromeda here aren't you? "Haha he said "you're " instead of "you're"". That's all you got? Shame on you, there so much more you could attempt to get me on.

Very easy for you to say you'd feel the same when you'll never have to know that for real. Luckily we have plenty of examples of the women you're referring to being massive hypocrites and believing their abortion was justified or how it's not the same as everyone else who wanted an abortion because they're whores who can't not have sex.

The overwhelming majority of all women disagree with you're need to control their bodies. And funny enough we have a lot of examples of these staunch pro-life conservative women who felt rabidly pro-life. Until they needed an abortion. Until having a children messed up their plans or life. Until they had a little oopsy. No exceptions for life of the mother until their life was threatened and they realized the medical term for the procedure that would not unnecessarily risk their life and sometimes ability to have future children was an abortion. We have plenty of examples both pre Roe vs Wade and since it's been overruled.



Just like we can't force you to give a kidney to a family member you hate or person you don't know you have zero right to force a women to give birth. I know authoritarians like yourself have a hard time understanding this but bodily autonomy is important. And let's be honest here conservatives like you will never, ever, ever agree to provide any of what you wanted in your hypothetical. Because that would be socialism. So let's simplify even more and deal with the current reality which is republicans don't even want to give children free lunches at school we force them to go to because it would make them entitled.


It's quite simple. Now quit drawing on the wall with crayons and calling it splashing a bit of red paint in this thread. We got you a nice piece of paper to use after all.

[Endus]

Hypothetically, if we had the best imaginable adoption, welfare, parent resource, sex ed, free contraceptive systems.

Would any of you flip? Or is "muh autonomy" that important, cuz again, if a man could get pregnant I'd feel exactly the same. Just like how many conservative women also feel.

Yes, bodily autonomy is that important.

Or are you in favor of forced organ harvesting?

Also, in regards to rape. This is why it's an extreme but I wouldn't be behind a woman who got raped and decides to get an abortion 6 months after. It has to be reasonable.

If you think rape's an exception, you don't actually believe the fetus is a human being in any case, and once we know you're lying about base principles like that, we have no reason to take anything you say seriously.

You've been lying to our faces this whole time.

Laws ain't perfect. Human life ain't perfect. But saying that blanket abortion is okay because rape abortion is okay is insane. Exception doesn't make the rule.

Your only argument against abortion rights is your hatred of women. You've given literally nothing else, other than lies you've admitted you don't even believe, when push comes to shove.

[Fugus]

@Pannonian

I will be completely serious here. I know I am coming off as a dick when I call you guys out for this, not trying to be smug or anything like that, it just comes off that way because I am calling you guys out for doing something stupid over and over again.

I might get called a troll for what I am doing, but if you notice, I don't jump into threads just to be contrarian. I am getting accused for the simple act of repeatedly calling you guys out for the same actions you never seem to learn from.

You guys act like mini-Sheldon Cooper's on here. You guys can be highly intelligent and lay out some every accurate and concise information and responses, but you HAVE to be right, even if the other person doesn't care if you are or aren't and just want to respond. The moment they come in and say something incorrect, even if they are lying to do it and you know they are lying, you turn into the pigeons from Finding Nemo.

And yes, I gave him a complement to hopefully draw attention to you to the fact that he is legitimately kicking your asses on here. You might be destroying his comments with facts but that isn't the game he is playing, if he was, you would be destroying him but he doesn't care about that, that is not his game. In his game, you are losing and losing badly.

And no, If you actually look at my post history, I don't agree with him or any of the stuff he has been saying. Just after a decade on here to watch you guys go full retard every time they post, it's like you guys can learn all the book smarts in the world but can't even figure out when someone on the thread is just fucking with you.

Even he admitted on a response to me that if you guys stopped responding to me he would probably get bored and move on, but you guys never will so him and others can always come here to do what he is doing and living rent free in your head because you HAD to respond.

I mean just look at the last ~10 or so pages and look at all the crap you helped him to spread by giving him air knowing what he was doing.

You and the others are bigger trolls here than I am, you helped spread page after page of crap that would have been a single post or maybe 2 that rolled off ignored and forgotten if you had just ignored it. All I did was post maybe 5 times here calling you out for it. But that's on you.

I might sound like a mean, sanctimonious dick by saying this, but all I am doing is legitimately call you out for your own actions while you pretend that isn't what happened. I am not trying to be mean or any of that crap and if you check my post history, I only ever call you guys out for this stuff and get labeled a troll just because I call you out and tend to stay on topic and civil otherwise.

Edit: God I seem to make a ton of spelling/grammar errors when I do long posts.....

[Varx]

Yes, bodily autonomy is that important.

Or are you in favor of forced organ harvesting?



If you think rape's an exception, you don't actually believe the fetus is a human being in any case, and once we know you're lying about base principles like that, we have no reason to take anything you say seriously.

You've been lying to our faces this whole time.



Your only argument against abortion rights is your hatred of women. You've given literally nothing else, other than lies you've admitted you don't even believe, when push comes to shove.

Except pregnancy isnt just dealing with one body.

And stop with that weak organ donation argument. I already explained why it's senseless, whether u agree or not is up to u.

What part of rape is an EXTREME do you not get?

Murder is bad plain and simple but you can bet if someone comes Into my home that I'ma make a rug out of them.

You can keep screeching I hate women, man you do you. But it is what it is, and rvw is only the beginning, mark my words.

[SoulForge]

Except pregnancy is. It just dealing with one body.

And stop with that weak organ donation argument. I already explained why it's senseless, whether u agree or not is up to u.

What part of rape is an EXTREME do you not get?

Murder is bad plain and simple but you can bet if someone comes Into my home that I'ma make a rug out of them.

You can keep screeching I hate women, man you do you. But it is what it is, and rvw is only the beginning, mark my words.

Only the beginning eh? What else you gonna do?

[Yetanothernewbie]

Only the beginning eh? What else you gonna do?

Probably go after those gays and coloreds next I bet. Wonder what his single hispanic mother of 8 would think.

[SoulForge]

Probably go after those gays and coloreds next I bet. Wonder what his single hispanic mother of 8 would think.

Put slavery back after that. Love going backwards as a country.

[Varx]

Only the beginning eh? What else you gonna do?

Me nothing. SCOTUS, blanket abolish. Minus exceptions

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Probably go after those gays and coloreds next I bet. Wonder what his single hispanic mother of 8 would think.

Actually I'm pro gay rights. And I'm Hispanic dude ... Lmao u even said it.

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Put slavery back after that. Love going backwards as a country.

Yeah saving babies is going backwards ...

[SoulForge]

Me nothing. SCOTUS, blanket abolish. Minus exceptions

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Actually I'm pro gay rights. And I'm Hispanic dude ... Lmao u even said it.

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Yeah saving babies is going backwards ...

Save your own. Its none of your damn business the medical decisions of other people.

[Varx]

Save your own. Its none of your damn business the medical decisions of other people.

Neither is cold blooded homicide and that's illigal.

Anyone can do w/e they want to themselves medically. I don't give a fuck.

But when you're pregnant it's not just you anymore. And people need to own up to their shit.

You might see it as misogyny but it ain't my fault nature deemed it that only females get pregnant. It is what it is.

Heh, honestly if anyone is misogynistic, it's liberal women themselves. They spit in the face of the greatest superpower in the planet, their ability to produce offspring.

[Endus]

Except pregnancy isnt just dealing with one body.

That's an outrageously dishonest argument. First, the fetus isn't a person, and all your arguments otherwise mean nothing. Second, even if it were, nobody's infringing on the fetus' bodily autonomy.

And stop with that weak organ donation argument. I already explained why it's senseless, whether u agree or not is up to u.

That's the inevitable consequence of your argument. If right to life of Person A can be construed to supercede the right to bodily autonomy of Person B, that's what justifies forcing organ donations. If that upsets you, engage in some self-reflection because it's your argument.

What part of rape is an EXTREME do you not get?

In short words so we're clear. I get what you're saying. It's just unreasonable and demonstrates that you're lying to us when you say you think the fetus is a person. Because you're okay, apparently, with killing a child of rape, by your own argument. So now we have to decide; do you think you could freely kill a 12 year old because they're the product of rape? Or were you just lying the whole time you claimed you considered the fetus to be a human being, a person? It's one of the two. Feel free to pick.

It's not that we don't understand you. We do. That's how we know you're lying.

Murder is bad plain and simple but you can bet if someone comes Into my home that I'ma make a rug out of them.

And? Ignoring the castle doctrine nonsense, killing in self defense is not "murder". And pretty much nobody argues that killing is always "wrong". The base principle is not violated by the existence of self defense considerations.

You can keep screeching I hate women, man you do you. But it is what it is, and rvw is only the beginning, mark my words.

There's really no other explanation. You don't believe in fetal personhood, and even if you did that's not even an argument against abortion rights, so what else is there?

[SoulForge]

Neither is cold blooded homicide and that's illigal.

Anyone can do w/e they want to themselves medically. I don't give a fuck.

But when you're pregnant it's not just you anymore. And people need to own up to their shit.

You might see it as misogyny but it ain't my fault nature deemed it that only females get pregnant. It is what it is.

What I find most interesting about conservatives is they think they can force their views one everyone. Its a really simple concept. Don't get an abortion if you don't want one.

[Endus]

Heh, honestly if anyone is misogynistic, it's liberal women themselves. They spit in the face of the greatest superpower in the planet, their ability to produce offspring.

That's fucking ridiculous, and demonstrates that, again, your position is entirely religious in origin, despite your false claims otherwise.

Potatoes can produce offspring. Goldfish produce offspring. It's so completely unspectacular a "superpower" that nearly all multicellular life on the planet is capable of it, and I'm only including "multicellular" because single-celled organisms generally replicate via mitosis, and the question of which is the "offspring" and which the "parent" is nonsensical. But the moment we developed sexual reproduction, life's been producing offspring. It's so categorically baseline to living things that it's less of a "superpower" than taste, or smell, or vision, or even just basic touch.

The only reason to see it as particularly special is religion. So once again; you've been lying to us.

[Varx]

That's an outrageously dishonest argument. First, the fetus isn't a person, and all your arguments otherwise mean nothing. Second, even if it were, nobody's infringing on the fetus' bodily autonomy.



That's the inevitable consequence of your argument. If right to life of Person A can be construed to supercede the right to bodily autonomy of Person B, that's what justifies forcing organ donations. If that upsets you, engage in some self-reflection because it's your argument.



In short words so we're clear. I get what you're saying. It's just unreasonable and demonstrates that you're lying to us when you say you think the fetus is a person. Because you're okay, apparently, with killing a child of rape, by your own argument. So now we have to decide; do you think you could freely kill a 12 year old because they're the product of rape? Or were you just lying the whole time you claimed you considered the fetus to be a human being, a person? It's one of the two. Feel free to pick.

It's not that we don't understand you. We do. That's how we know you're lying.



And? Ignoring the castle doctrine nonsense, killing in self defense is not "murder". And pretty much nobody argues that killing is always "wrong". The base principle is not violated by the existence of self defense considerations.



There's really no other explanation. You don't believe in fetal personhood, and even if you did that's not even an argument against abortion rights, so what else is there?

A fetus is a person and second I'm pretty sure killing them is infringement on their autonomy, wtf lmao.


I dunno how else I can say it. An exception an extreme is what it is. Saying that all women can get an abortion because a rape victim did is like saying anyone can kill anyone because those who do it in self.defense can.

I do believe in fetal person hood which is why I'm making these arguments to begin with and it's the only and only argument against abortion, take it or leave it.

I'm not going to agree with you and you're not with me so why do u keep responding to me.

If you're worried I might feel lonely, don't. I got plenty others in the thread.

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What I find most interesting about conservatives is they think they can force their views one everyone. Its a really simple concept. Don't get an abortion if you don't want one.

And liberals don't lol?

And I got an even more simpler concept. The lives of babies matter, not a woman's master degree in gender studies.

[SoulForge]

And liberals don't lol?

And I got an even more simpler concept. The lives of babies matter, not a woman's master degree in gender studies.

No liberals don't. They force nothing on anyone.

Same sex marriage? Don't get married to the same sex if you don't like it.

Abortion? Don't get one if you don't like it.

All of these are choices. Conservatives take away choice. They always have.

[BeepBoo]

A fetus is a person and second I'm pretty sure killing them is infringement on their autonomy, wtf lmao.

Say a person is starving to death and no one is giving them food. Is the entirety of humanity infringing on their autonomy?

Why is the fetus's autonomy more important than the mother's autonomy in this case?

No liberals don't. They force nothing on anyone.

Let's not go that far. Liberals also are the first to mandate people HAVE to be nice and care for each other post-womb.

[Varx]

That's fucking ridiculous, and demonstrates that, again, your position is entirely religious in origin, despite your false claims otherwise.

Potatoes can produce offspring. Goldfish produce offspring. It's so completely unspectacular a "superpower" that nearly all multicellular life on the planet is capable of it, and I'm only including "multicellular" because single-celled organisms generally replicate via mitosis, and the question of which is the "offspring" and which the "parent" is nonsensical. But the moment we developed sexual reproduction, life's been producing offspring. It's so categorically baseline to living things that it's less of a "superpower" than taste, or smell, or vision, or even just basic touch.

The only reason to see it as particularly special is religion. So once again; you've been lying to us.

Nope, I'm the farthest thing from religious. Believe it or not. I know it's hard to comprehend. But I'm just fueled by pure societal morality and you don't need a silly book for that.

And yeah producing offspring is the most common thing on the planet yet the most powerful. You see life anywhere else in our solar system?

Nothing else matters in life. Not you're still degree, not you're career. None of that shit matters when you're 90 and dying alone, pathetically in a small bed.

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Say a person is starving to death and no one is giving them food. Is the entirety of humanity infringing on their autonomy?

Why is the fetus's autonomy more important than the mother's autonomy in this case?

Lol what????!


Did someone force starvation on them????

The fetus is not more important, they're equal. The mother can easily send them for adoption as they wish.

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No liberals don't. They force nothing on anyone.

Same sex marriage? Don't get married to the same sex if you don't like it.

Abortion? Don't get one if you don't like it.

All of these are choices. Conservatives take away choice. They always have.

Oh yeah? What about speech?

Trying to force people to change language to appease some minority demographics.


Gtfo...

[Endus]

A fetus is a person and second I'm pretty sure killing them is infringement on their autonomy, wtf lmao.

You're wrong, by definition. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/1/8

Also, you're confusing bodily autonomy and right to life, intentionally.

I dunno how else I can say it. An exception an extreme is what it is. Saying that all women can get an abortion because a rape victim did is like saying anyone can kill anyone because those who do it in self.defense can.

Nope. The self defense laws don't create an exception to any supposed "no killing" law. Only certain types of killing are unlawful, and self defense is one of the cases that isn't.

Once you've acknowledged that rape victims should be able to abort, you need to make a case for others, on some principle other than the generics you've already admitted can't be true by allowing for rape victims to abort.

I do believe in fetal person hood which is why I'm making these arguments to begin with and it's the only and only argument against abortion, take it or leave it.

Like, first, it's objectively false, and second, by allowing exceptions for rape victims, you've admitted you don't even believe it. This is why we can't take you seriously.

I'm not going to agree with you and you're not with me so why do u keep responding to me.

Where'd you ever get the idea I'm trying to convince you? You don't matter. I'm making sure nobody else thinks you have anything meaningful to say and doesn't get misled by the nonsense you're trying to push.