The apparent formula for new classes in WoW

[Teriz]

They specifically said green and bronze were the healing spec while red and blue is dps. Alexstrasza is a red dragon and has red dragon abilities. The red dragonflight can heal and its leader is called the lifebinder and yet they chose to focus on the destruction aspect of red dragons. If the class was based on her it would exclusively have red dragon abilities since she can't use the powers of the other flights since they were given the powers of different Titans/different aspects of their powers. Both Alexstrasza and Ysera were given parts of the powers of Eonar but Ysera was specifically given it over nature while Alexstrasza life.

Uh no. Again, the playable version of Alexstraza from HotS has spells that are appearing in both the DPS and the Healing spec of the Evoker class.

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Now please provide any evidence within hots that abundance is a green spell. The games are not linked, they do not have the same mechanics..

There are no specs in HotS.

Also typically HotS abilities are mechanically close to their eventual WoW incarnation.

[Ielenia]

Since HotS.

Yeah, no. You're wrong. You're objectively wrong, here. She's casting red dragonflight spells. Because the Red dragonflight is the one responsible for life itself. Her flames heal. She is not casting "green dragonflight spells".

Again, Evokers being able to do more stuff doesn’t alter the point. It’s no different than DKs pulling from Lichs, Necromancers, Banshees, and other units, but still being based on the WC3 DK hero unit.

Not the same thing. The aesthetic of the class is still based on solely the death knight from Warcraft 3, and is named "death knight". The aesthetics of the new class in Dragonflight is not based solely on Alesxtrasza or the red dragonflight, and is not called "red dragon".

[Teriz]

Yeah, no. You're wrong. You're objectively wrong, here. She's casting red dragonflight spells. Because the Red dragonflight is the one responsible for life itself. Her flames heal. She is not casting "green dragonflight spells".

Again, her abilities are showing up in both the red and green-based spec of the Evoker class.

[8bithamster]

Again, her abilities are showing up in both the red and green-based spec of the Evoker class.

That doesn't mean... that her spells are green... Sometimes mechanics/gameplay > lore.

I know that must be a hard concept for you to grasp.

[Teriz]

That doesn't mean... that (some of) her spells are green...

Uh, that’s exactly what it means.

[qwerty123456]

Uh no. Again, the playable version of Alexstraza from HotS has spells that are appearing in both the DPS and the Healing spec of the Evoker class.

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There are no specs in HotS.

Also typically HotS abilities are mechanically close to their eventual WoW incarnation.

Hots isn't canon. The lore is the dragon flights are different and were given different powerups.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Alexstrasza

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Evoker?so=search


Devastation and Preservation. Using the quick and explosive power of the red dragonflight, and the focused and overwhelming magic of the blue dragonflight, the Devastation evoker can shoot at enemies from a distance using their long-range spells. Preservation serves as a healing specialization. Using the abilities of the bronze dragonflight, they can manipulate time to help heal wounds faster, aided by the nurturing power of the green dragonflight.


All the lore states you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.

[Teriz]

Hots isn't canon. The lore is the dragon flights are different and were given different powerups.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Alexstrasza

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Evoker?so=search


Devastation and Preservation. Using the quick and explosive power of the red dragonflight, and the focused and overwhelming magic of the blue dragonflight, the Devastation evoker can shoot at enemies from a distance using their long-range spells. Preservation serves as a healing specialization. Using the abilities of the bronze dragonflight, they can manipulate time to help heal wounds faster, aided by the nurturing power of the green dragonflight.


All the lore states you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.

And I said the playable version of Alexstraza, not the lore-based version of Alexstraza. The Evoker is based on the playable version of the character, and said character’s abilities are in both the red and green spec of the class.

The lore-based version is completely irrelevant to this conversation.

[8bithamster]

Uh, that’s exactly what it means.

It doesn't.. I literally explained why, but you didn't bother to read, as usual!

[cocomen2]

I hope Teriz understands that Alexstrasza was not made in cave to be perfect soldier like Drekthyrs, and she don't has their combo powers, but then i roll eyes after each of his words, and now i look like this.

[Ielenia]

Again, her abilities are showing up in both the red and green-based spec of the Evoker class.

No, Alexstrasza's (i.e. the Red Dragonflight's) abilities are DPS abilities, not healing abilities. Did you not watch the deep-dive?

Not to mention, as far as I can tell, none of the HotS abilities exist in the Evoker, at least as far as it has been revealed.

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Uh, that’s exactly what it means.

It doesn't. HotS made her spells green because green is a color that one by default associates with good things, such as healing and buffs, in a game, while red, which is the color of Alexstrasza's fire, is by default associated with bad things, such as being damaged and debuffed.

So one can easily understand that Alexstrasza's healing spells are green in HotS because of that simple reason.

[Mecheon]

And I said the playable version of Alexstraza, not the lore-based version of Alexstraza. The Evoker is based on the playable version of the character, and said character’s abilities are in both the red and green spec of the class.

Alextrasza and the Evoker just take from long set out ideas of 'This is what dragons do'. They've been ingame long enough they've been given a specific powerset we've come to expect from them

We've seen it before in the Malygos fight, or, really, any dragon fight ingame. They're just abilities themed around "This is what Dragon do". Same way Demon Hunters have ideas of "This is what Demon Hunters do" and aren't just repeating the hero abilities from WC3.

I'd personally argue the Malygos fight and those vehicle mechanics put more towards the Evoker's design than Alextrasza did.

[qwerty123456]

And I said the playable version of Alexstraza, not the lore-based version of Alexstraza. The Evoker is based on the playable version of the character, and said character’s abilities are in both the red and green spec of the class.

The lore-based version is completely irrelevant to this conversation.

Ok then show me in WoW where Alexstrasza uses green dragon abilities. Also show me where it states in game that any of the Evoker heal spec skills are red dragon skills. Can't do either of those things?

[Teriz]

Alextrasza and the Evoker just take from long set out ideas of 'This is what dragons do'. They've been ingame long enough they've been given a specific powerset we've come to expect from them

In some cases like Wing Buffet, and Deep Breath yes. However, other abilities like Abundance or Blessing of the Bronze are entirely based around HotS mechanics, and we've never seen WoW dragons utilize them before they showed up in the MOBA.

We've seen it before in the Malygos fight, or, really, any dragon fight ingame. They're just abilities themed around "This is what Dragon do". Same way Demon Hunters have ideas of "This is what Demon Hunters do" and aren't just repeating the hero abilities from WC3.

The Demon Hunter originated in WC3, so the WoW incarnation was largely based on that general concept. The eventual class in turn was a mix of WC3, HotS, and WoW concepts.

I'd personally argue the Malygos fight and those vehicle mechanics put more towards the Evoker's design than Alextrasza did.

I disagree, because the Dracthyr aren't going to be using vehicle mechanics, they're going to be using class mechanics. The HotS abilities are more aligned with such mechanics, and we got to actually play with those mechanics in HotS. Given that out of the 10 Dracthyr Evoker abilities shown, almost half are coming from HotS, that should tell you how heavily HotS is playing into the general design of the class.

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Ok then show me in WoW where Alexstrasza uses green dragon abilities.

We couldn't play Alexstraza in WoW.

Also show me where it states in game that any of the Evoker heal spec skills are red dragon skills. Can't do either of those things?

And once again, it's an Alexstraza HotS ability that is being used for a healing spell in the green/bronze spec. This isn't hard.

[Ielenia]

Ok then show me in WoW where Alexstrasza uses green dragon abilities. Also show me where it states in game that any of the Evoker heal spec skills are red dragon skills. Can't do either of those things?

He can't because Blizzard already stated that the red dragonflight essence is part of the dps spec, not the healer spec. So there's no "healer Alexstrasza from HotS" in the evoker class.

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We couldn't play Alexstraza in WoW.

They didn't say "play as Alexstrasza". They asked you to show instances of Alexstrasza casting magic from the green dragonflight.

And once again, it's an Alexstraza HotS ability that is being used for a healing spell in the green/bronze spec. This isn't hard.

It is hard for you, apparently. Because those are not "Alexstrasza HotS abilities". Those are abilities themed after the green dragonflight, and if memory serves, Alexstrasza belongs to the red dragonflight.

[Teriz]

No, Alexstrasza's (i.e. the Red Dragonflight's) abilities are DPS abilities, not healing abilities. Did you not watch the deep-dive?

Which is why the likely scenario is that the damage-based Alexstraza spells are going to the Devastation spec, and the healing restoration spells are going to the Preservation spec.

Not to mention, as far as I can tell, none of the HotS abilities exist in the Evoker, at least as far as it has been revealed.

Ion mentioned Flame Buffet, Holinka mentioned Blessing of Bronze, Wing Buffet is a racial, and we've seen a gif of Abundance;



All from HotS.

It doesn't. HotS made her spells green because green is a color that one by default associates with good things, such as healing and buffs, in a game, while red, which is the color of Alexstrasza's fire, is by default associated with bad things, such as being damaged and rebuffed.

Which doesn't change the fact that we have an Alexstraza HotS spell in the healing (Green/Bronze) spec.

[qwerty123456]

In some cases like Wing Buffet, and Deep Breath yes. However, other abilities like Abundance or Blessing of the Bronze are entirely based around HotS mechanics, and we've never seen WoW dragons utilize them before they showed up in the MOBA.



The Demon Hunter originated in WC3, so the WoW incarnation was largely based on that general concept. The eventual class in turn was a mix of WC3, HotS, and WoW concepts.



I disagree, because the Dracthyr aren't going to be using vehicle mechanics, they're going to be using class mechanics. The HotS abilities are more aligned with such mechanics, and we got to actually play with those mechanics in HotS. Given that out of the 10 Dracthyr Evoker abilities shown, almost half are coming from HotS, that should tell you how heavily HotS is playing into the general design of the class.

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We couldn't play Alexstraza in WoW.




And once again, it's an Alexstraza HotS ability that is being used for a healing spell in the green/bronze spec. This isn't hard.

Alexstrasza is in wow. And again Hots isn't canon and both in the Lore and in WoW Alexstrasza does not use green/bronze magic.

[Teriz]

Alexstrasza is in wow. And again Hots isn't canon and both in the Lore and in WoW Alexstrasza does not use green/bronze magic.

HotS abilities and mechanics are in WoW too.

Again, HotS abilities have been placed in WoW classes since Legion, and the draconic abilities from HotS are going to be placed in the new Evoker class. HotS not being canon is completely irrelevant to the fact that Blizzard consistently pulls abilities and mechanics from HotS and brings them into WoW.

[qwerty123456]

HotS abilities and mechanics are in WoW too.

Again, HotS abilities have been placed in WoW classes since Legion, and the draconic abilities from HotS are going to be placed in the new Evoker class. HotS not being canon is completely irrelevant to the fact that Blizzard consistently pulls abilities and mechanics from HotS and brings them into WoW.

Show me Alexstrasza using Hots abilites in wow. You can't. Some of the draconic abilities in HotS will be in wow. That doesn't mean that Alexstrasza uses green dragon magic. Just because Blizzard uses a mechanic or skill name from Hots doesn't mean that its suddenly canon she is a green dragon. Look at Stukov. He is completely different in Hots compared to starcraft.

[Ielenia]

Which is why the likely scenario is that the damage-based Alexstraza spells are going to the Devastation spec, and the healing restoration spells are going to the Preservation spec.

False. You're literally going against what Blizzard said. They said, explicitly and in no uncertain terms that the blue and red dragonflight essences are part of the damage spec, whereas bronze and green dragonflight essences are belong to the healing spec.

There is no red dragonflight essence in the healing spec. You're trying to push a narrative by ignoring what Blizzard has stated about the class' concept and design. Not surprising considering you're also ignoring theat dracthyr are not dragons, but hybrids.

Ion mentioned Flame Buffet, Holinka mentioned Blessing of Bronze, Wing Buffet is a racial, and we've seen a gif of Abundance;

https://media.giphy.com/media/v6yVmV...r9sR/giphy.gif

All from HotS.

No. No, we haven't. That ability is still unnamed, and besides its graphics don't match the ability from HotS, which forms a runic 'S' on the floor that then bursts, whereas the unnamed evoker ability creates a flower that blooms just like the green dragonflight (and druid) abilities behave.

Which doesn't change the fact that we have an Alexstraza HotS spell in the healing (Green/Bronze) spec.

The only fact here is that you're wrong. It's not the same ability. You're literally only equating the two because both are green and both heal. Their graphics and dragonflight essence are not the same.

[Teriz]

Show me Alexstrasza using Hots abilites in wow. You can't.

Like I said, not relevant.

Some of the draconic abilities in HotS will be in wow. That doesn't mean that Alexstrasza uses green dragon magic. Just because Blizzard uses a mechanic or skill name from Hots doesn't mean that its suddenly canon she is a green dragon. Look at Stukov. He is completely different in Hots compared to starcraft.

Where did I say it was canon?

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False. You're literally going against what Blizzard said. They said, explicitly and in no uncertain terms that the blue and red dragonflight essences are part of the damage spec, whereas bronze and green dragonflight essences are belong to the healing spec.

Uh, splitting Alexstraza’s HotS abilities doesn’t go against that design plan.

There is no red dragonflight essence in the healing spec.

I never said there was. I simply said you’re going to have Alexstraza HotS abilities in the healing spec.

You're trying to push a narrative by ignoring what Blizzard has stated about the class' concept and design.

Like I said, splitting Alexstraza’s HotS abilities doesn’t go against that design goal.

Not surprising considering you're also ignoring theat dracthyr are not dragons, but hybrids.

Only according to you.