[TV] She-Hulk: Attorney at Law (*SPOILERS*)

[Kathandira]

On the one hand, this is a pretty funny show. Bruce and Jen have great sibling chemistry (even if they are only cusins)

On the other hand, some lines just made my brain hurt.

Why, why in all hell and back, did it need that "I am better at controlling my anger, because my life as a successful attractive woman was haaaaard, because woman" -line.

Geezus christ... she is funny and charmingly blunt, but a line like that breaks the entire character... and only to get the mark of approval of some sexist feminists on the internets...

Plus of course the fact that she is a complete Mary Sue, being instantly perfect at everything that Bruce needed decades to learn and master. It is difficult to imagine that there is any real threat she could face in this series. The Hulk is nearly unbeatable, only ever loosing to literal gods and god-like aliens like Thanos and Thor and Jen is outclassing him literally effortlessly.

The funny thing is that this episode actually made me want to learn more about Hulk, not She-Hulk. The whole split-personality that he has and Jen doesn't must have a source. Possibly the story of the very first Hulk movie even before the Norton one is actually canon...

Interesting thought track.

With Hulk being in the "Smart Hulk" state, he appears to not be his old self. Yeah, he can control things better, but does that make him any more powerful? Perhaps...less powerful. He had to fight through internal issues to get this way, on both sides (Banner and Hulk). And since then, he just hasn't been the same.

Maybe this story will lead to answers on that.

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Female empowerment in an origin story about a woman getting Hulk powers? You don't say....

Ya know, all things considered, Marvel has been pretty lite on the Female empowerment track.

Yeah, we got the all female team up shot that people rolled their eyes at. But really, unless my memory is fuzzy, the majority of interactions with women in the MCU so far haven't been all that heavy handed with the female empowerment jazz.

I think there is enough room for this show to be the vehicle for that message. Just as Ms Marvel was the vehicle for middle eastern culture. And Falcon and the Winter Soldier was the vehicle for black culture.

If every woman in the MCU was pushing a Woman Power message, it would get old pretty quick, but gotta give credit where credit is due, Marvel is being tactful with it so far.

[Twdft]

I don't read any comics and know nothing about She-Hulk. Solid introduction episode, but nothing special, no idea what the story leads to.

But good lord do I love Tatiana Maslany since Orphan Black. I'm really happy for her to get a role in the MCU.

[Kathandira]

Female empowerment in an origin story about a woman getting Hulk powers? You don't say....

Ya know, all things considered, Marvel has been pretty lite on the Female empowerment track.

Yeah, we got the all female team up shot that people rolled their eyes at. But really, unless my memory is fuzzy, the majority of interactions with women in the MCU so far haven't been all that heavy handed with the female empowerment jazz.

I think there is enough room for this show to be the vehicle for that message. Just as Ms Marvel was the vehicle for middle eastern culture. And Falcon and the Winter Soldier was the vehicle for black culture.

If every woman in the MCU was pushing a Woman Power message, it would get old pretty quick, but gotta give credit where credit is due, Marvel is being tactful with it so far.

[Rocksteady 87]

Interesting thought track.

With Hulk being in the "Smart Hulk" state, he appears to not be his old self. Yeah, he can control things better, but does that make him any more powerful? Perhaps...less powerful. He had to fight through internal issues to get this way, on both sides (Banner and Hulk). And since then, he just hasn't been the same.

Maybe this story will lead to answers on that.

"Smart Hulk" is an abomination in which Bruce basically killed/completely suppressed his Hulk persona. He's always suffered from a type of multiple personality disorder, since not very long after his original appearance. What he's doing as Smart Hulk is not healthy, and it's going to have spectacular consequences once Hulk gets free/reasserts himself. Like World War Hulk level consequences (which, not surprisingly, is coming soon; and probably what the ship was about). Bruce is nowhere near as smart as he thinks he is. Or more correctly, he's only smart in the ways of science and technology. He's seriously fucking himself up with Smart Hulk (and worse, completely trying to suppress even Smart Hulk with that gadget he created).

Jennifer never had MPD, hence why she's in control. When her hulk form exerts itself, all it really does is make her more impassioned as opposed to giving an outlet for another personality. All she has to do is control her feelings more strongly than in her normal form, which is significantly easier than trying to suppress an entirely different personality.

[Kathandira]

"Smart Hulk" is an abomination in which Bruce basically killed/completely suppressed his Hulk persona. He's always suffered from a type of multiple personality disorder, since not very long after his original appearance. What he's doing as Smart Hulk is not healthy, and it's going to have spectacular consequences once Hulk gets free/reasserts himself. Like World War Hulk level consequences (which, not surprisingly, is coming soon; and probably what the ship was about). Bruce is nowhere near as smart as he thinks he is. Or more correctly, he's only smart in the ways of science and technology. He's seriously fucking himself up with Smart Hulk (and worse, completely trying to suppress even Smart Hulk with that gadget he created).

Jennifer never had MPD, hence why she's in control. When her hulk form exerts itself, all it really does is make her more impassioned as opposed to giving an outlet for another personality. All she has to do is control her feelings more strongly than in her normal form, which is significantly easier than trying to suppress an entirely different personality.

That was a lot of words to say: Yes.

lol I kid.

If this is the direction MCU is taking Hulk, I am 1,000% on board.

[Karlz0rz]

Female empowerment in an origin story about a woman getting Hulk powers? You don't say....

When Hulk got his powers, was it mentioned how he struggled with male issues, or was it just based on him being a human?
I get it, it's very in these days to score points with demographics.
And I honestly think it wasn't over the top, or done in a bad way in the show, just something to take note of.

[Kathandira]

When Hulk got his powers, was it mentioned how he struggled with male issues?

Nah, that was the Tony Stark/Iron Man story.

We had ours. Now with She Hulk, the women have thiers.

[ClassicPeon]

if we are going to go into assumptions now, that I'm going to say that its safe to assume that you have never actualy been close to a real woman, let alone lived with one, that you think photoshoped and airbrushed and heavily surgically enhanced women are the only beautiful ones and then turn around and complain about catfishing.

P.S. and yet "classically defined attractiveness" varies so much through the history and lately it changes every few years, so you equating your own preferences with "classical attractiveness" is hillarious.

The instant incel callback as soon as someone is met with any opposition.

"Oh no regular men like pretty women - i must call them incels!!"

Isnt this getting old by now? Personally i've been gagging about this from the start but i'm wondering when the mainstream people starts doing it aswell.

There is such a thing as a beauty standard.

Anyway back to topic - i'm gonna watch the first episode tonight. I have to say that the trailers really do not hype me up. I'm super tired of the female has to outdo male trope.

[paxen]

With Moon Knight going all in on trying to show DID as faithfully as possible, it would be cool if the MCU took that same approach to Hulk/Banner. Because even though it's first and foremost a reimagining of Jekyll and Hyde, if you want to dig into it it's easily remapped to DID. And, as stated above, if it *is* DID you want the alters to talk to each other and perhaps integrate, not suppress one of them. So Smart Hulk as shown can be a very bad idea.

If they did want to explore it you could have a team up of Moon Knight and the Hulk. I wonder how that would be.

[KainneAbsolute]

If the rumors about World War Hulk are true...this series confirms that Bruce is still struggling to control the Hulk (Smart Hulk needs to meditate, transformation control device, etc.). Banner said that he made peace with his two selves, but it doesn't seem to be the case.

He even said that people see him as a monster.

[ClassicPeon]

Nah, that was the Tony Stark/Iron Man story.

We had ours. Now with She Hulk, the women have thiers.

What male issues did he deal with exactly?


I also want to note that MS marvel, cap marvel and Wanda where all quite feministic powerpeople.

Also yeah Moon Knight. That whole show was a big dump on masculinity.

[Jotaux]

What male issues did he deal with exactly?


I also want to note that MS marvel, cap marvel and Wanda where all quite feministic powerpeople.

Also yeah Moon Knight. That whole show was a big dump on masculinity.

I didn't get the feminism vibe off of Ms Marvel and Wanda.

[Kathandira]

What male issues did he deal with exactly?


I also want to note that MS marvel, cap marvel and Wanda where all quite feministic powerpeople.

Also yeah Moon Knight. That whole show was a big dump on masculinity.

Toxic masculinity. Overly arrogant, and cared no one but himself, and could not let go of his career when he was needed elsewhere. Which evolved into him learning to love, care, and be selfless. Even gave up his company to help people in a better way.

He also had unresolved issues from his father, which the same behavior carried down to him until he learned better about his father and how much Howard loved him.

There is good reason he is the most beloved in the MCU. He had the greatest character evolution out of any other.

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I didn't get the feminism vibe off of Ms Marvel and Wanda.

Me either. i'm searching my memory for moments that pushed a feminist narrative in either show, and I'm coming up blank.

[SavoirFaire]

Man what kind of woke shit is this they have to make a female copy of the hulk? /s

Good first episode, origin/power adaptation is addressed and we’re past it quickly. Slight nit picky stuff as usual for being a comic fan for years and years. The more Byrne she hulk the better in my book.

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Me either. i'm searching my memory for moments that pushed a feminist narrative in either show, and I'm coming up blank.

That’s because you don’t define feminism as “has a female main character”.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

The instant incel callback as soon as someone is met with any opposition.

"Oh no regular men like pretty women - i must call them incels!!"

I mean, if you're going to reduce a womans value as a performer because she doesn't make your dick hard...than yeah...you get to be called an incel.

Sorry, not sorry.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

When Hulk got his powers, was it mentioned how he struggled with male issues, or was it just based on him being a human?
I get it, it's very in these days to score points with demographics.
And I honestly think it wasn't over the top, or done in a bad way in the show, just something to take note of.

Being unable/unwilling to seek help with mental issues and trauma and trying to just push them all down and ignore them until they explode in a way that can’t be ignored is absolutely a male issue and has been for a long time so ya banner has been struggling with male issues for a long time.

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Also yeah Moon Knight. That whole show was a big dump on masculinity.

In what way was moon knight dumping on Masculinity? him actually addressing his Trauma and DID?

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

In what way was moon knight dumping on Masculinity? him actually addressing his Trauma and DID?

"Something something Steven Grant Something Soyboy"

[Skulltaker]

What male issues did he deal with exactly?


I also want to note that MS marvel, cap marvel and Wanda where all quite feministic powerpeople.

Also yeah Moon Knight. That whole show was a big dump on masculinity.

What exactly would be male issues, by your standard?

Also, it took a dump on toxic masculinity.

T
Me either. i'm searching my memory for moments that pushed a feminist narrative in either show, and I'm coming up blank.

If anything you could argue that her desperate desire to become a mother no matter what is anti-feminist. It's obviously bs, but I wouldn't be surprised if people said that.

[Rocksteady 87]

I didn't get the feminism vibe off of Ms Marvel and Wanda.

They weren't in the kitchen, barefoot, and pregnant. Ergo, they were man-hating feminists showing the world that women are better than men.

Honestly, you have to learn to read into things the way insecure people like them read into things.

[Karlz0rz]

Being unable/unwilling to seek help with mental issues and trauma and trying to just push them all down and ignore them until they explode in a way that can’t be ignored is absolutely a male issue and has been for a long time so ya banner has been struggling with male issues for a long time.

Yes, that's true. But it still wasn't a point made in any way in the Hulk movie? It's not like he turned to the camera and said "As a male, it's very hard to deal with mental issues because of society".
However, they did exactly that in the first episode of She-Hulk, barring the actual staring into the camera part.
I just dislike on-the-nose political stuff, no matter what it is.

But like I said in the first post, it wasn't super over the top, and I think it worked ok in terms of her anger issues etc.
It was just something that I took notice off.