Last of Us [TV]

[bmjclark]

Re: My "I wonder if..." discussion regarding the storyline of TLOU2 and will they/won't they follow it. Time to use all block spoilers now because I wont' be able to discuss this without using names =D.

And let me be clear up front - I do think they will (like 90% sure), stick to the story of the game. However - here's why I wonder about the impact of that storyline on the show's reception:
(also - spoilers here for The Walking Dead as a comparison, so if you're not wanting that spoiled, skip it.)



TV viewers are not the same as video game players. And for this 'reaction' to the show plot I'm speaking of ONLY Tv viewers, with no knowledge about TLOU2 plot twist. Obviously, everyone who played or knows about the game's (TLOU2) plot is watching the show already accepting that's coming and are either ok with it or might choose to skip season 2 (or that episode), but they already know and are prepared.

So this is in speaking about viewers with no fore-knowledge:

When TWD hit the "Negan" opening episodes, and whacked Abraham AND then Glenn with that bat - the entire popularity of the show immediately sank and it began its slide into crap-plot years. Sure, some of that was already coming as the show grew long in the plot-tooth, but I can recall NO other tv show in the last 20 years (and only a few prior) that had such a negative viewer backlash to a tv writing decision (this particular character's death) that led to a mass-viewership drop off. People did NOT like the 'pointless' death of a favorite character. They did NOT like that his entire 'family' (esp. his pregnant wife) were watching it all. And they did NOT like the violence in which that death was shown on screen.

I think the more obvious comparison is Ned Stark in game of thrones tbh. The audience stayed through that and into future seasons despite the fact that Ned Stark very much felt like the main character of the show if you hadn't read the books. They even spent multiple episodes heavily featuring the character who had him killed and this character was actually just the worst. I think the show can get through killing Joel as long as they do it early in season 2. It gets harder and harder the longer he's viewed as the "main character". Glenn was a major character in the walking dead for almost 7 years when they killed him so of course the response was a little different. Not to mention the quality of the walking dead had been sliding for years before this happened

[Rocksteady 87]

Yeah this episode was a bit of a miss for me and those I watched it with (all of us having not played the game).

No problem with Ellie being gay but did we need an hour long episode to tell us that? Its a real momentum killer to otherwise just show us things we already knew.

It's fascinating to me how so many people try to talk about things like this, completely miss the point of it, and then think the entire episode completely revolved around some relatively unimportant aspect of it.

Hint: Her being gay was not the main point of the episode.

[Tech614]

I think the more obvious comparison is Ned Stark in game of thrones tbh. The audience stayed through that and into future seasons despite the fact that Ned Stark very much felt like the main character of the show if you hadn't read the books. They even spent multiple episodes heavily featuring the character who had him killed and this character was actually just the worst. I think the show can get through killing Joel as long as they do it early in season 2. It gets harder and harder the longer he's viewed as the "main character". Glenn was a major character in the walking dead for almost 7 years when they killed him so of course the response was a little different. Not to mention the quality of the walking dead had been sliding for years before this happened

It's going to happen in the season premier, very little plot before that to leave off as the main hook of the season, not like Pedro would only be cast for a single episode since there is still tons of flash backs and back story to tell with him. I'm more curious about what episode 2 will be cause they can take a few different paths there, jumping straight to Ellie in Seattle or making an episode with full Abby back story. How they pace TLOU2 in a show format will be a lot more interesting than TLOU1 which is a pretty linear progression

[Eapoe]

It's going to happen in the season premier, very little plot before that to leave off as the main hook of the season, not like Pedro would only be cast for a single episode since there is still tons of flash backs and back story to tell with him. I'm more curious about what episode 2 will be cause they can take a few different paths there, jumping straight to Ellie in Seattle or making an episode with full Abby back story. How they pace TLOU2 in a show format will be a lot more interesting than TLOU1 which is a pretty linear progression

I could see a couple different ways they could do the first episode. 1). Have it basically follow the game over the course of an hour and have it end with Ellie getting knocked out after Abby kills Joel. (2). Have the episode be roughly 2 hours and give a focus on Abby’s backstory with her father and friends. Make her a sympathetic character from the start instead of being seen to be a villain from the start. Do what the game failed at (my opinion) and make us sympathize with her from the start. Give some screen time to Abby and her father showing the contrast between Joel and Ellie, and then finding her father after Joel leaves, and then go from there.
I know it will be difficult from a writer’s standpoint, as well as people who have played the games knowing what’s coming, but for people who haven’t played the games this could be a great way to continue the story while only changing the order of how things are revealed in the game

[Tech614]

I could see a couple different ways they could do the first episode. 1). Have it basically follow the game over the course of an hour and have it end with Ellie getting knocked out after Abby kills Joel. (2). Have the episode be roughly 2 hours and give a focus on Abby’s backstory with her father and friends. Make her a sympathetic character from the start instead of being seen to be a villain from the start. Do what the game failed at (my opinion) and make us sympathize with her from the start. Give some screen time to Abby and her father showing the contrast between Joel and Ellie, and then finding her father after Joel leaves, and then go from there.
I know it will be difficult from a writer’s standpoint, as well as people who have played the games knowing what’s coming, but for people who haven’t played the games this could be a great way to continue the story while only changing the order of how things are revealed in the game

I was also thinking they could do an Abby episode in the premier but I don't think it leaves a hook that a premier needs, unless they introduce her in the season finale of 1 when her dad dies but I don't think they will. It would be like left behind being the pilot episode if they jump straight into Abby back story, got to introduce her to the main time line first which only ends in one way.

I don't think the overall goal is to make people sympathize with Abby either, people seem to think that is part of TLOU2 but it's not. It's more so just telling you there are no good guys and every plot kill has consequences that fucked over others. By the end of TLOU2 you aren't supposed to sympathize with anyone outside of maybe Lev. By that point every major character has blood on their hands and has done terrible shit and if their time comes it comes. Which is why it's quite powerful for Ellie to finally realize how pointless it was even after Tommy guilt tripped her into going back after Abby.

[DarkAmbient]

I thought it was great, they covered an entire DLC in one episode.

To be fair it does only take about an hour and a half to complete.

[Fabinas]

What are you talking about? Do you think everyone lies to manipulate people? That's your claim about Joel.

Yes, parents lie to their kids for a multitude of reasons, but they don't all lie to manipulate their children. My parents never did. I never lied to any of my partners or friends to manipulate them.

I lol'ed.

You made up for the lack of lies in your life with many here. One of them is the above.

[Darththeo]

I lol'ed.

You made up for the lack of lies in your life with many here. One of them is the above.

I don't lie here, kid.

But, you lie about being here to be for a debate, but constantly debate. So, it isn't surprising you think everyone else lies like you do.

[molliewoof]

Then yes, that parent is expressing abusive behavior.

What about things like the tooth fairy / father Christmas?

[Mister K]

HBO production design and flex is goddamn unmatched anywhere outside of James Cameron.

Terrific script, acting and unmatched production design.

Peaky Blinders. Production Design and overall Cinematography is some of the best on TV. Another would be "The Crown".

[Fencers]

Peaky Blinders. Production Design and overall Cinematography is some of the best on TV. Another would be "The Crown".

I have seen those shows- they are very good, especially the Crown. They didn't build a set like that mall though. TLOU is spending like 7 million an episode with one of the most experienced and lauded production suites in the business. This is about as far as you can go without being a film.

[Relapses]

I have seen those shows- they are very good, especially the Crown. They didn't build a set like that mall though. TLOU is spending like 7 million an episode with one of the most experienced and lauded production suites in the business. This is about as far as you can go without being a film.

According to the BTS, they didn't actually build a whole mall. The scene where Ellie sees the mall light up is entirely special effects.

[Tech614]

I have seen those shows- they are very good, especially the Crown. They didn't build a set like that mall though. TLOU is spending like 7 million an episode with one of the most experienced and lauded production suites in the business. This is about as far as you can go without being a film.

They aren't that great at set building seeing as they had to change Pittsburgh to Kansas City because the city they filmed in looked nothing like Pittsburgh. Logically there is 0 reason to ever go through Kansas City between Boston and Wyoming(even if you take the long route to try to avoid chicago area which I assume would be a shit show, you would be on US-36 which passed by like 30-40 mins North of KC no so fucking reason to enter a death trap city center) so Pittsburgh was the logical choice also, they just chose it because the boring Calgary filming location looks just as bland and boring as middle america cities like Kansas City. If they where investing in scene building then recreating Pitts wouldn't be an issue.

Let's not confuse cgi and special effects with actual set building now.

[Fabinas]

I don't lie here, kid.

But, you lie about being here to be for a debate, but constantly debate. So, it isn't surprising you think everyone else lies like you do.

What better proof of my post about you. When you think you're in my head and you know what i do better than me, yeah...

Keep 'em piling up.

[Fencers]

According to the BTS, they didn't actually build a whole mall. The scene where Ellie sees the mall light up is entirely special effects.

I am aware.

[Relapses]

Jesus fucking Christ. This show doesn't miss. That was... visceral. I felt that shit in my bones. They didn't shy away from the violence as with previous episodes which was a nice change in pace. Excellent episode. I can't wait to see how they wrap it all up. Looks like we'll be getting a scene with Ellie's mom (played by Ellie's VG voice actor, Ashley Johnson) getting bit during pregnancy so they're at least playing up the context for her immunity, something I feel like the game kind of glossed over.

[Kallisto]

Great episode, did what it needed to do for this part of the game. Shame though about Some of the fans bitching and crying because Joel didn't superman through an entire village and infected because they don't seem to realise that a lot of the gameplay doesn't translate well to TV/Film. Like being almost dead and then taking out an entire settlement.

[PACOX]

8 - 0

it don't miss!

Eight and oh!

[Polyxo]

Well that guy's character arc escalated quickly.

[DarkAmbient]

Good episode, but another one where a key moment was done better in the game, specifically Joel and Ellie's reunion. In the game, Ellie's line "He tried to... Joel..." and the way it was delivered so well by Ashely Johnson made it feel much more emotional to me. Show David was much better though, that actor was very good. Also Ramsey's acting as she went to town on David's face with the cleaver felt very raw and real. The episode felt a bit rushed, but I'm not sure if that's because I'm just remembering how long and intense that entire part of the game was, compared to the show having to remove a lot of unnecessary combat.