Has the ret rework improved the spec at all?

[Fargus]

I've been meaning to come back to my Paladin but I've been hearing conflicting thoughts about current rework.

Can anyone provide some cliffnotes? Those who have tried it on the PTR, how does the spec feel? Is the damage there? Or has Bizzard reneged on its promises and delivered a sub-par product? Should I stick to my Arms Warrior still?

[Jester Joe]

If you want to read deep into it
https://www.wowhead.com/news/first-i...7-guide-331541

and the updated
https://www.wowhead.com/news/revisit...-10-0-7-331671

I personally haven't heard anything really negative yet about it, I fooled around with it a bit on the PTR and honestly it's just so nice to be able to Divine Steed without a care about GCD. Extra range on abilities is great too.

[Fargus]

If you want to read deep into it
https://www.wowhead.com/news/first-i...7-guide-331541

and the updated
https://www.wowhead.com/news/revisit...-10-0-7-331671

I personally haven't heard anything really negative yet about it, I fooled around with it a bit on the PTR and honestly it's just so nice to be able to Divine Steed without a care about GCD. Extra range on abilities is great too.

These seem outdated as the recent changes from a few days ago has apparently disrupted the general "feel" of the spec. People are saying they're doing less damage than on live, but then against some dude is claiming he's doing 95k single target with no logs to show for it.

[Frinata]

How it performs is going to have to wait for live, as testing balance changes is a bit difficult with a small sample size

How it feels, however, is pretty great. I made a build of my own making, and opted to go with the Crusading Strikes, which replaces your auto attacks with Crusader Strike, and man, it was hilarious how much Holy Power I had generated. I was able to Templar Strike 5 times in a row. They've since 'nerfed' it to give holy power every 2 seconds, but I have to imagine it's still going to be fairly strong

I felt less bursty, and more consistant, which to me, is how it should have been from the start, I don't understand why they decided that Ret was the burst specc, and not Arms Warrior

[Donkeywing]

Massive improvement in terms of defense. Ret now has excellent defensives (options), which is good for the game in general because rets position made no sense gamewise. In general things like 10% sta, 10% avoidance, divine protection, leech effects and passives etc are major improvements. They also made some hidden improvements to abilities like divine shield.

Also some slight improvements to mobility with steed off gcd and freedom pvp talent shifted to the general tree. Slight improvement to general utility with reworked ret aura alongside devo aura. Considering we have very powerful niche/specific utility, this is a meaningfull change I would say.

In terms of damage? That remains to be seen, there's going to be a lot of conflicting opinions I'm sure. There definitely have been some sacrifices, dmg profile might be weaker depending on the context. That's almost a guarentee when you ask for abilities to be pruned or deleted. Don't really give a shit though, for me it was extremely insulting how weak ret had become compared to other classes and they fixed that. I would say that's a major win going forward.

[Kalisandra]

They've been looking to pull back burst somewhat and buff sustained, and that's going to result in damage feeling lower unless those testing run some high-level m+ with plenty of tough trash - assuming they got it right. If they didn't and over-nerfed burst and under-buffed sustained, well we'll all know soon enough, and I'd expect adjustments to put our damage right back where it's been since roughly WoD - in the mid-range, trending lower as an expansion ages.

[kliffharry]

This last hotfix will improve us quite a bit for aoe. The big 2 minute burst window is gone, but in return we get Wake of Ashes every 30 sec, wings every 60 sec as well as other small procs and mini cds lowered from 30 to 20 seconds. So overall this will be a nice buff in terms of sustain aoe damage as well as a big buff for ST in raids.

The original post made it seem like we would be getting massive improvements to mobility, which we sadly didn't get but it's definitely noticeable with 2 seconds longer steed duration as well as it being off gcd. Blessing of Freedom giving a speed boost (if talented) is also very welcome.

Survivability definitely has increased by a lot.

All in all it is a clear buff to the spec.

[Elepenke]

Massive improvement in terms of defense. Ret now has excellent defensives (options), which is good for the game in general because rets position made no sense gamewise. In general things like 10% sta, 10% avoidance, divine protection, leech effects and passives etc are major improvements. They also made some hidden improvements to abilities like divine shield.

Also some slight improvements to mobility with steed off gcd and freedom pvp talent shifted to the general tree. Slight improvement to general utility with reworked ret aura alongside devo aura. Considering we have very powerful niche/specific utility, this is a meaningfull change I would say.

In terms of damage? That remains to be seen, there's going to be a lot of conflicting opinions I'm sure. There definitely have been some sacrifices, dmg profile might be weaker depending on the context. That's almost a guarentee when you ask for abilities to be pruned or deleted. Don't really give a shit though, for me it was extremely insulting how weak ret had become compared to other classes and they fixed that. I would say that's a major win going forward.

This! Im really looking forward to it. Anyone on live who can confirm that blessing of spellwarding is added as a PVP talent?

[Matt0193]

This! Im really looking forward to it. Anyone on live who can confirm that blessing of spellwarding is added as a PVP talent?

Yes it has.

[GabrielKnight]

Tried it in PvP and it feels much, much better. AoE damage is excellent now, and spamming Divine Storm actually feels useful and fun. The button bloat is definitely improved, and I usually have so much Holy Power to spend that I barely feel any downtime at all.
The removal of the slow is quite a blow, but I feel much more tougher than before, that's for sure. People can kite me but they don't destroy me instantly, at least I can handle a few hits until I manage to reach them.

Overall, it's not a perfect revision, but in PvP it feels better. I can't say how it's going in PvE, but during questing and overall world activities, it's pretty much the same.

[Polyxo]

I'm always main RET, and it feels pretty good in raid. I'm doing 10-30k more depending on the fight. Granted, some of it may be playstyle and how it 'feels' to me, but it's been helpful for me.

[Wrecktangle]

The defensive updates are real and feel very impactful. Damage is there, definitely higher than before, but not staggeringly so. I also have minimal idea of what optimal looks like. I still think they need to maybe make the ST/AOE differentiator less jarring from a talent selection standpoint, but otherwise the rework is great.

[Gloriandus]

I wish they'd change the icon used for Templar Strikes; it's the Ashbringer icon and at times my brain thinks Wake of Ashes and I hit the wrong key.

[Leodric]

I wish they'd change the icon used for Templar Strikes; it's the Ashbringer icon and at times my brain thinks Wake of Ashes and I hit the wrong key.

You can write a macro which casts the spell and use a diffrent icon, should solve your problem.

[caemen]

Since their burst is broken, nerf is on the horizon

[uncl55]

Yee I already feel the meta cry of warrior, mages, rogues ect. Because how can some scrub playing hybrid clases have a change to kill them?!
Im fearing big nerf is coming because of pvp thus destroying the class PVE onece again.

[BeepBoo]

Since their burst is broken, nerf is on the horizon

Broken in what way? PvP? I sure hope they don't nerf us in the actual game, because our performance is still solidly middle of the pack.

As for how the rework has been, I love it. Always something to press, never in awkward hopo builder-starved places, no dumb maintenance buff to manage, the increased mobility is great, and the increased defense is great. 10/10 patch. Love this version of ret.

[Gloriandus]

I'm still trying to undo muscle memory to spend at 3 instead of now at 4 (with the talent). I'm smashing the TV or DS key and then realize, "ohhhh"

[Kalisandra]

That we talent for 120% damage at a 133% cost with our finishers says it all when it comes to Holy Power generation - we've got Holy Power to burn.

I'm really liking the greater damage outside of cooldowns, as struggling to out-damage tanks on no-CD pulls was depressing.

[Toby451]

overall a fairly solid improvement. Your always going to find someone that doesn't like change but as a whole most people would agree its much improved.


I have personally enjoyed playing my pally alt quite a bit this week to the point I am thinking about main swapping next tier.