WTF PvP Set?

[ilias]

Way to go for Dire bears that are harder to kill.....
Half feral, half resto anyone......

[cryogenic]

Yes a Rogue in mail with warrior/Hunter abilities with Heals. Brilliant!

You know full well it would be the same as now just with less squishy cat and caster form.
Druid cat will never be a rogue with the complete lack of defensive abilities they have, no vanish no parry, less dodge, no disarming abilities no direct interupts and maim instead of kidney shot, gouge, blind, sap.
It's heals are much weaker then and enhance shamans.
Warrior hunter abilities? Oh the only thing that makes a druid capable of killing someone in arena if they don't escape for it's duration.
For those who don't read he said high in feral....41 points in atleast doesnt give you a lot of healing that.
Imp tree already gets more armor boomkin does too.

[Sava]

make the ability to wear mail a talent deep in the feral tree

rofl xD

[greenmasheen]

Druids are overpowered. I mean, I've never seen any Druid go oom. As a Mage, I can get the Druid to 5%, sure. But if he gets one heal, just one, he's back to 80%. No chance in hell I can kill him now. He'll just keep healing and I'll keep losing mana. In the end the Druid will have 50% of his mana left and I'll be oom. Giving the Druid the chance to slowly kill me.

And what if you go oom? You just change to Cat Form or Bear Form and you can still do a lot of damage with endless energy or endless rage. Please, if you whine about going oom, you just can't play your class.

i have found that having a warrior on the druid or some other class that will stay on them + a mage or priest dispelling or spell stealing the hots is the best way to kill them.

[Jathro]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...00000000000000

1 talent point unspent for the idea to wear mail armor deep in the feral tree.

Give ferals mail, and you give them the world... of warcraft.

EDIT: fixed link

[Panoramixe]

I'd rather have a shield tbh, gief 40k armour in greens.

[cryogenic]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...00000000000000

1 talent point unspent for the idea to wear mail armor deep in the feral tree.

Give ferals mail, and you give them the world... of warcraft.

EDIT: fixed link

You really believe this is a good spec with mail down there?
what exactly is it going to do? in feral gear it's healing is crap it doesn't even have omen of clarity it's damage is horrible it lacks burst and feral has no mana.
If your in healing gear you have less survival then speccing further down resto to imp tree of life for much better healing.
your not killing anyone with it the only thing your surviving better in is cat while severely gimping it's damage.
So what is the point?
Or is it for dueling? Since that works for druids now who duel fine yet fail where it matters.

[Shaggie]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...00000000000000

1 talent point unspent for the idea to wear mail armor deep in the feral tree.

Give ferals mail, and you give them the world... of warcraft.

EDIT: fixed link

And they don't get Swiftmend with this build which is actually more important than Nature's Swiftness. This spec is just going to make you a little harder to kill but not be able to heal your partners nor dps a target. GG.

[Shaggie]

You know full well it would be the same as now just with less squishy cat and caster form.
Druid cat will never be a rogue with the complete lack of defensive abilities they have, no vanish no parry, less dodge, no disarming abilities no direct interupts and maim instead of kidney shot, gouge, blind, sap.
It's heals are much weaker then and enhance shamans.
Warrior hunter abilities? Oh the only thing that makes a druid capable of killing someone in arena if they don't escape for it's duration.
For those who don't read he said high in feral....41 points in atleast doesnt give you a lot of healing that.
Imp tree already gets more armor boomkin does too.

^^^This^^^

Edit: And to add a little more: We're not going to be doing Rogue level damage either. I think our DPS will be more on par with an Enhancement Shaman (or atleast that's where it should be as we are hybrids) and guess what gear an Enhancement Shaman wears. Yup. Mail.

[Furo]

Maybe they will make you acctualy think twice if you really want shift out of that nova or rather wait for the ele.
To actually NOT be unkitable anymore so even druids need some skill to have success.

Awesome!

I just laughed my ass off about the word 'unkiteable' in a feral related post.
Tbh I think the Feral's PvP set is the Rogue's one with a different 4 part bonus.
Even with snare etc etc, no healer will go arena with a feral if there is at least 1 rogue left onteamed on the server, even worse if the feral cant even effort some shifts anymore.

[cryogenic]

Omg mezz if you cant get out of frost nova you die now didn't you hear?
It goes something like frostbolt crit> deep freeze crit>frostbolt crit>frostbolt crit>ice lance crit>WE nova>Deep freeze crit>frostbolt crit>ice lance crit.
The WE is firing too your likely dead before the next freeze.

Sucks to be the guy caught in that shit.....

[delage35]

I wish they would just cut their losses and give us Mail allowing us to share absolutely PERFECT itemization stats with Hunters/Shamans. Looking at their gear -- Agility/Stamina/Int with additional armor -- It's absolutely perfect for a Feral Druid. However, we all know that this is not a possibility simply due to the fact that it would further buff Resto Druids. However, if you just look at how perfect the stats are for Hunter/Shaman mail, it makes you sick that Blizzard decided to make us share itemization with Rogues.

Of course they could do it... make a 1 pt talent in Feral for wearing mail that requires 45 pts invested.... bye bye boomkins and restos using it and simplifies the itemization

[Furo]

Somewhat true, bot it will be quite impossible I guess. Imagine Rogues have to share their leather gear with no one at all.

Edit: I just noticed, Mail would set rust, even in swim form.

[Starfury]

Its obvious that we need that bonus intelect, guess the ones disagreeing didnt get serious feral play.
I also agree 100% that itemization with hunters and ench shammies is perfect BUT.....but giving mail armor to a druid , even only one spec, would ruin whole flavour of this class, I would be very surprised if blizzard actually did stuff like this, many things in this game are remote, but they also have to stick to some basic structure.

Anyway, tough one, I guess blizz will have to rethink their shared itemization idea for us, the way its now its gonna be a drama.

[IndCold]

I think an easy fix would be either buffing the +int% in the Heart of the Wild talent or making it so intellect scales as a percentage of another stat (ie. your intellect is increased by 50% of your agility -totally random example-)

[Wilhelmi]

Yup. Mail.

Shamans already wear what hunters wear.

[Shaggie]

Shamans already wear what hunters wear.

Umm, yeah, I know... I was comparing Feral Druids as a Hybrid to another Hybrid physical DPS class, the Enhancement Shaman.

[cryogenic]

It's not that we need int so much as more mana in any way, some insane regen proc or mana return would be better as it won't just run out after a little longer.
Natures instinct should be giving spell power by next pass to put us inline with enh shamans.

[Seraphk]

What we've basically established as a few fixes in this thread while also recognizing a few things:

• Feral Druids getting Mail as a deep Feral talent.
  
  Feral implies a combatant build. Thus, when going into combat, you should be in heavier armor. Giving mail armor to Ferals through a deep talent would prevent Moonkin/Restos from gaining any additional power. It would bring back superiority in physical damage mitigation and give us all required stats for PvE/PvP utility.
  
  The pros are that Druids in Humanoid/Cat form have less survivability/defense than any other class in the game minus casters with max DR on their CC and/or dispelled buffs -- This would buff that survivability. This extra survivability in Humanoid/Cat form would be really helpful. Druids are not merely suggesting this based on the idea that we want superior Bear Armor, we are looking at it as a way to improve our survivability while attempting to come out and heal ourselves.
  
  The cons are that I really do not see Blizzard doing it as Rogues would indeed share no itemization with anyone and Hunters/Shamans should not have to share more itemization with the Feral Druid. However, anyone that plays a Feral Druid and looks at the current Hunter/Shaman mail -- You can't help say that the stat allocation is anything but perfection for the Feral Druid playstyle. In fact, it's so freaking perfect that everytime I see a piece of Mail drop in WoTLK, I'll probably be drooling myself even though I know I can never have it.
  
  
  
• Feral Druids have mana restoration built into Imp LoTP
  
  This doesn't necessarily have a lot of pros or cons in relativity to other classes. However, it does have comparison. Paladins are able to put Judgement/Seal of Light up and then use Seal/Judgement of Wisdom.
  
  With the changes to where these Judgements scale with AP + SP and have a 4 second CD on the proc. It's basically made Judgement of Light into Imp LoTP -- Which further promotes the idea that Blizzard seriously needs to buff the utility of this thing as Paladins now have the healing component and Warriors now have the +5% crit component.
  
  They could go ahead and give us "Judgement of Wisdom" in our Imp LoTP and allow it to proc off spellcasts. This would extend Imp LoTP's utility benefits into that of spellcasters. The fact that blue posts have suggested that LoTP will be raid wide means that it will benefit everyone -- raid wide while also helping Ferals with mana problems.
  
  I see no problem with this other than the fact that single Paladins can only provide healing for your HP or your mana rather than both at the same time. This is the reason they made Crusader Strike not refresh Judgements anymore as having both of these judgements on a mob is very beneficial.
  
  
  
• Ferals do not really want extra Sta/Int, we want to take less damage and spend less mana.
  
  The developers say that we may no longer have superior armor. In fact, one straight out told us that we may have LESS ARMOR than other tanks. They then described our niche as "superior HP". I agree that survivability, taking hits, and keeping aggro are the three basic things a tank needs. The difference in effectiveness comes in how well they do this. In terms of survivability -- Yes, superior HP will allow us to last longer... WHEN THERE AREN'T ANY HEALERS AROUND. Other than that, taking hits is the next things, the less damage we take from hits -- The more hits we can take and the less healers have to heal us. Mitigation and damage avoidance is the key to a good tank, not HP. I currently gem everything with +10 agi on my Tier 6 and go to Heroics with 58% dodge. You wouldn't imagine the Heroics I've tanked with friends alts that have less than 1 k healing. I then get on my Prot Paladin that has 16 k HP, and a healer with 2.1 k +healing spends more mana healing me than my friend with 1 k healing. Thus, even if my Paladin had 22 k HP and my Druid only had 21 k HP, my Druid would still be better. Damage mitigation > superior HP. Blizzards concept that more HP is worth it in the longer run is completely flawed.
  
  As for intellect -- Feral Druids that once argued that we didn't want Intellect on our gear for the sake of improving other stats were right to a degree. We shouldn't require Intellect on our gear. We should simply have dramatically cheaper shifting costs while our gear has stats that we truly need. It's the EXACT same concept as "superior HP". Give us 10 k mana with 600 mana cost shifts and we'll shift throwing a Regrowth each time and be OOM in less than 5 shifts & about 15 seconds. How long do arena matches last? Definitely not 15 seconds, it's more like 15 minutes... Heck I've had some where my Mutilate Rogue partner is killed and I'm stuck fighting a Resto Shaman / Resto Druid in 400+ resilience for an hour and a half (I did win of course because I remain very efficient about my heals and only throw direct heals as the Resto Druid can easily Cyclone me out of my HoT healing).
  
  There's no way I should be able to OOM so fast simply from shifting. Shifting is the backbone of Feral Druid gameplay design -- Those of you that believe we should not be able to shift out of Poly/Slows/Immobilizes. I feel sorry that you understand so little about Feral mechanics but we have absolutely no snares, no way to control our enemy except for an incapacitate that breaks on damage, and trying to cast Cyclone/Roots on anything that knows how to LoS is pointless -- Even more so if they have an interrupt. Shifting is anti-CC / anti-kiting because without these abilities Druids would be so kite-able they'd be worse off that Death Knights in beta at the moment when their Death Grip is on CD. 30% run speed in Cat Form is nothing when half the classes in the game posses a 50 - 75% movement speed reduction. Even with these abilities, I've had 1800 rating Resto Shamans kite me easier than pushing the up and down on a remote to change a channel alternating Earthbind and Frost Shock. Even with my ability to move faster and shift out of movement impairing effects, nothing compares to a snare. But, I digress.
  
  Shifting NEEDS to cost dramatically less and we shouldn't have to have Int on our gear to be viable. Thus, we really need something to innately restore mana while in Feral forms so that we at least have enough mana to access utility spells. I mean, I don't know who the developer is for Ret Paladins that came up with the idea for Judgements of the Wise. But, if you could please have him work on a way for Enh Shamans and Feral Druids to have nearly infinite mana as well -- It would be great. Though, that's what I want. Most other Ferals, however, have come to more reasonable terms such as the suggestion above with Imp LoTP restoring mana

Thanks those of you with constructive things to say. Like I said, this is my first thread I've ever started. I do not start threads to cry. These things are problems with Ferals. Blizzard should know they're going to have to dramatically re-vamp talents for the Feral Druid. The Feral Druid was scaling juts as bad in DPS as the Ret Paladin in BC, if not more and yet they're almost completely fixed minus excessively high damage on judgements which requires just a slight tweak of a coefficient.

Feral Druids are going to require the same treatment only, based on the way a Feral Druid works and has always been the one and only "role-switcher" rather than "hybrid" in WoW -- It should be quite complicated. Thus, I wait in anticipation for what Blizzard decides to bring to us. However, the things discussed in this thread have not just been problems that now arise from our itemization being shared with Rogues. These are long-time Feral mechanics that should have been changed long ago.

My only wish is that this were on the beta forums rather than here. As, out of most threads I've seen on beta -- Compared to this one -- Most people have been very open to new ideas and come up with some good things. Once again, thank those of you that took the time to post constructively.

[Captain Midnight]

3 - the number of classes that wear cloth
2 - the number of classes that wear leather
2 - the number of classes that wear mail
3 - the number of classes that wear plate

Blizzard just needs to stop being lazy and design some Feral gear instead of trying to change the whole class. Sure, give us the rogue leather through quests - we'll probably want it to level quicker. But once we get to raid where Tier tokens drop...quit dickin around and give us some good LEATHER gear with ARMOR and STRENGTH and STAMINA and AGILITY. Throw in a little INTELLECT for shifting, and maybe some EXPERTISE RATING for tanking. Cut the crap with all this Crit and Attack Power stuff though. Druids are FINE, Blizzard just wants to make more work for themselves by changing the class, launching the ExPack, and then scrambling to fix Druid gear because they're taking more damage than Warriors and only have 2k more health.