Feral cat not needed by guilds?

[STS]

I am a raidleader and while most of the time I take whoever signed up for the raid, when I do get to pick people I look for those who play their spec to it's fullest.

That´s pretty much my opinion as well...if I get an application as RL/CA, why should I prefer a Feral that can only Dps over a Feral that can offtank and put out the same amount of damage when needed? A "Dps-only" Feral leaves me with much less flexibility.

That doesn´t only count for the Cat, but also for other hybrid classes: If two Protpallys apply, both with similar quality of tankgear, but one of them has descent holygear as well and is offering to respec and step in if there should be a short supply of healers, who would I take?

[Amgyn]

People who spec cat and say im a cat druid are also the ones who go got to go mum says bed time and lf1m need tank

this is soooo true.. how many times have i seen cat druid go 'sorry im dps can't tank'..

[Mysta]

Don't forget, with changes to Feral Druids, and the outlook Blizz Devs have for it(having full dps talents and full tank talents), Cats are going to be doing HUGE dps, especially because of the warrior bleed debuffs.

[Partyraiser]

People still choose how to play this game...if they choose to play only as a cat they won't see much raids. But that's what they choose for isn't it? And the ones that say: 'Sorry I am Feral DPS and I cannot or wil not tank' are not only kids(where are the statistics that prove that almost every catdruid says this?) I'm not claiming that this is not case, but don't generalize too fast in an MMORPG. There are people who want to play as a cat in instances and heroics, and you must admit that they are not completly useless there(sure there are classes that can do more damage)

People who want to play cat in raids are either narrow minded or have a childish view(but that doesn't make them kids. You people obviously dont know much about kids do you )

[Bloodysorc]

This thread is tl;dr. At the end of the day, cat DPS is pitiful compared to virtually every other DPS spec in the game. On top of extremely low DPS, kitties bring a whopping zero unique raid buffs/debuffs. Everything they bring can be brought by a full feral.

So to answer your question with a question: why bring a spec that is lower DPS and same utility as any spec rogue?

[Mugjoo]

So the general idea is the following about "Feral Kittens" =Totally worthless in raids..

I hear you and i disagree..

Sure we have problems with our DPS not scaling aswell as other DPS Classes and people tend to feel we might aswell OT if we tag along to SSC/BT etc..

I faced the same "comments" as posted in this thread about feral dps not beeing up at the same level as the other DPS classes, so my option was to come as OT if i wanted to raid at all..

So what did i do?

I proved 'em wrong. Lots of RL just go with the general opinion regarding feral dps that its basically, c r a p. Well it isnt if you know how to play the spec and got the gear for it. Nowadays i basically come as DPS 95% of the time when we raid, the other 5% i OT or respec resto.

The problem is that a lot of people got a narrow mind, if they've ever played with a "bad" player playing the kitten DPS spec they just figure that all ferals are worthless in DPS.

Well you are wrong.

Sure i dont TOP DPS in all raids, but im up at top 5 in Kara, Gruul, Mag, SSC and BT.

Am i really too worthless to bring to a raid as DPS?

Learn to play the class and spec you whine about, you might acctually learn something and post threads based on facts instead of a "general opinion".

Im glad to see that Blizzard is getting some work done on "our behalf" regarding the DPS perhaps then people will stop referring to us kitten dps as "worthless".

shut up, no one believes you

[droozle]

The simple answer is that raids are by definition limited in their numbers and hence, the only way to maximise your performance is to take *players* who are able and willing to play their spec to it's full potential. A druid who limits himself to catform simply doesn't do that.

I am a raidleader and while most of the time I take whoever signed up for the raid, when I do get to pick people I look for those who play their spec to it's fullest. If a druid told me he would be kitty only in my raid he simply wouldn't be in my raid because another player (druid or non druid) will bring more to the raid by virtue of his attitude alone.
As someone else said, people have the right to play whatever way they like, but they do not have the right to have their ass dragged along by 9 or 24 other players just because they want to play the way they like and only the way they like. If you aren't willing to do what it takes, don't sign up for everyone's sake.

As for cat DPS in general. We don't scale well currently, simple as that. When a RL is faced with the choice of a feral druid and any other DPS class for a DPS slot, he will most likely take the other classes unless he feels that Innervate and Battleress make up for the loss in DPS (given there are enough tanks already.). This is rarely the case these days beyond Karazhan.

This says it all. Thread closed.

[anyaka21]

I think the main issue with feral cats, as it is now, is in terms of raiding, what actually do they bring to one. 5% to crit, below average dps. Therein lies the problem. As of right now, an enhance shaman, will bring more dps, and superior buffs.

However, a feral who can tank and dps brings much more to the raid.

Will this change in WotLK, lets hope so.

This same holds true for moonkins. And again, this will hopefully change for the better in LK.

[darkenrahl]

The simple answer is that raids are by definition limited in their numbers and hence, the only way to maximise your performance is to take *players* who are able and willing to play their spec to it's full potential. A druid who limits himself to catform simply doesn't do that.

I am a raidleader and while most of the time I take whoever signed up for the raid, when I do get to pick people I look for those who play their spec to it's fullest. If a druid told me he would be kitty only in my raid he simply wouldn't be in my raid because another player (druid or non druid) will bring more to the raid by virtue of his attitude alone.
As someone else said, people have the right to play whatever way they like, but they do not have the right to have their ass dragged along by 9 or 24 other players just because they want to play the way they like and only the way they like. If you aren't willing to do what it takes, don't sign up for everyone's sake.

As for cat DPS in general. We don't scale well currently, simple as that. When a RL is faced with the choice of a feral druid and any other DPS class for a DPS slot, he will most likely take the other classes unless he feels that Innervate and Battleress make up for the loss in DPS (given there are enough tanks already.). This is rarely the case these days beyond Karazhan.

so true
at first our rl followed this policy and we got to archi//teron with no issue at all :P
then when our guild started to flourish again (after a LONG period of stagnation) old scrubs came back and our rl simply wasn't "bastard" enough to say "you suck.. l2p while you benchwarm" or "l2equip.. your gemming suck" or "change that spec, as you are you are worth shit"..
and that pretty much spelled the end of our progress (luckily it was half may, so we may actually start back in spetember, granted our rl takes the ball out and give the slacker a kick) :P

in the end raiding is all about min-maxing..
if the raid is caster HEAVY (and i mean REALLY heavy) and it gets more from a affli lock, instead of a fourth destro lock, heck like it or not, one of the lock HAS to go affli, no QQ accepted :P
you want to raid? you want to get phat loot? want to see the end-game?
well you need to do some sacrifice at times

rl want to be friendly with everyone, accept everything, heck they're human too.. but would your risk wasting a progress night for 24 person, by taking an underperforming (underperforming by either skill, equip, spec output) single person? i would not...

[Auralian]

I think the main issue with feral cats, as it is now, is in terms of raiding, what actually do they bring to one. 5% to crit, below average dps. Therein lies the problem. As of right now, an enhance shaman, will bring more dps, and superior buffs.

However, a feral who can tank and dps brings much more to the raid.

Will this change in WotLK, lets hope so.

This same holds true for moonkins. And again, this will hopefully change for the better in LK.

Well if 80% of a well geared rogue is below average DPS then I'm not sure what to say. I pull Very good DPS numbers every single night and OT or MT with just as much Effectiveness on my Horde or Ally Druids, most of mine even have decent healing sets.

Ferals are getting nerfed in the Xpac here and there. We loss Armor, DPS and have to Spec for either tankage or Kitty. We probably will still be able to pull in the 60%-70% dmg range compared to a Rogue, that isn't real bad considering you have a toon that can OT, DPS and toss on healing gear for decent HoTs without a respec. Ferals will always have a place in Raiding it just takes players that are more adept at actually playing out their toon instead of mashing 3 buttons for 3 hours straight.

[mutantboy]

This is all just semantics and conjecture

Currently Druids OT a bit on trash - then DPS. Then on boss fights they OT a bit - then back to DPS.
Then they get to a fight that doesn't require an OT - and they DPS.

Sounds like a bunch of time DPSing eh?

I for one am pretty pissed that time is spent being sub par. That is "supposed" to change in the xpac - we shall see. But all the statements about what Druid cats will do in LK are pretty previous given the uncertainty about the basic gear/armor/final specs that druids will have.

I read that Blizz wants all classes to be viable - so maybe we will see people chosen on competance rather than what char they chose to play. And maybe we will get less people saying extreme things about char types based on the historical fact that Rogues are stupid OP.

[anyaka21]

Well if 80% of a well geared rogue is below average DPS then I'm not sure what to say. I pull Very good DPS numbers every single night and OT or MT with just as much Effectiveness on my Horde or Ally Druids, most of mine even have decent healing sets.

Ferals are getting nerfed in the Xpac here and there. We loss Armor, DPS and have to Spec for either tankage or Kitty. We probably will still be able to pull in the 60%-70% dmg range compared to a Rogue, that isn't real bad considering you have a toon that can OT, DPS and toss on healing gear for decent HoTs without a respec. Ferals will always have a place in Raiding it just takes players that are more adept at actually playing out their toon instead of mashing 3 buttons for 3 hours straight.

in that sense you made my point for me. My post was about cat spec. If a druid wants to raid as only cat (as of right now), it is likely he won't be invited. He just doesn't bring enough to the table to warrant an invite. As also stated, right now, the same can be said for boomkins, also think smite priests from pre-bc...

LK is going to be definitely a different kind of expansion. It seems Blizzard wants to change how we tank, and how we dps and how we heal... It's gonna get interesting.

[mgp84]

Thanks for proving my point. Why are they in high demand. Theres loads on every server. Oh thats right, only retards spec them, and retards dont get taken to raids. Only ret pallies and hunters taken are peopel who normally play different. Any paladins who dont know how to heal are retarded. Would you want them in ur raid group no way, healing requires only smallest amount of iq and if you cant do that then well, im guessing doors are problem

You my friend have not raided past KZ. A ret paladin increases raid critical strike chance by 3%, returns BOATLOADS of mana and health from refreshing judgements, and contribute decent DPS when accompained by a good Shaman dropping WF. BM, Hunters on the other hand, have proven to be the best single target DPS in TBC. The world-record in DPS is made by a hunter which had 3700 DPS on the Brutallus fight ( No, not netherspite with the gay blue beam but Brutallus- NO BEAMS ). You need to get your facts straight before you start speaking outloud in raiding forums.
As to your boomkin question: They can provide a 100DPS increase per caster in your group (Depending on group make up) or more. Aside from this, their improved faerie fire is a great way to increase hit rating on tanks, which their gear shys away from in SWP (going straight into expertise instead of +hit).
Please NEVER post on these forums again, or any other forums for that matter.