My Tanking build. Lack of Vigilance.

[Tmbrland]

The way for a protection warrior to do more damage and see more big flashy numbers is NOT to get impale, you have to sacrifice too much to get it (wasted talent points)

the way to get more damage/bigger numbers is to stack block and strength/AP.

Slam effected by AP thus by Stength and soo much of it by block value, again more stength same with our damage shield.

Pro tip: Best way to increase your threat generation and damage done is strength.

Did you even think about this before you wrote it?

[heerobya]

What's the problem Mr. Troll?

Am I wrong?

Considering most all our abilities are based off of AP stacking strength is full of win for more damage/threat because it also gives Block value as well as AP, for things like Slam and our damage shield.

[Tmbrland]

The way for a protection warrior to do more damage and see more big flashy numbers is NOT to get impale, you have to sacrifice too much to get it (wasted talent points)

the way to get more damage/bigger numbers is to stack block and strength/AP.

Slam effected by AP thus by Stength and soo much of it by block value, again more stength same with our damage shield.

Pro tip: Best way to increase your threat generation and damage done is strength.

Did you even think about this before you wrote it?

What's the problem Mr. Troll?

Am I wrong?

Considering most all our abilities are based off of AP stacking strength is full of win for more damage/threat because it also gives Block value as well as AP, for things like Slam and our damage shield.

With this impale spec what exactly are you missing again? You say you have to sacrifice so much...and since you refer to damage show me what damaging ability I dont have...
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...h=000000000000

You are attempting you compare a spec to damage... you show me a spec without impale and one with. Both warriors would be geared EXACTLY... who does more damage and has more "BIG FLASHY NUMBERS"?

[heerobya]

Nub tanks..

Ok.

You said this thread WASN'T about damage and threat after I wrote that post. It was about vigilance.

So I came back and said, "it's one point, take it it has benefits that are HUGE for only 1 talent point."

Now you are asking me about damage and impale again?

Think outside the box man.

For instance. Rend. How much does rend cost with 3/3 Focused Rage? 2 rage?

2 rage for over 1k damage raid buffed. Worth it every time the bleed goes off. Definetly worth it when boss/mob is over 90% health because it does extra damage.

Worth putting talent points into improved rend? of course not.

Your builds flaws-

2/5 shield spec: Seriously? You know our class (prot spec) is based around shield use right?

Besides that it's not bad.

But is more rage from Charge worth it? Is reduced rage heroics strikes worth it? I'd rather have cheaper Devestates and my shield wall on a 4 minute timer.

I thought this thread wasn't about impale, but obviously it turned into one about impale.

Is threat a problem right now? No.

Is tanks staying alive a problem? Always.

Why take points out of mitigation and put them into more damage and threat when we don't NEED more damage and threat.

Come talk to me again if they patch and threat becomes an issue again. Until then, impale is a waste of points better spent in mitigation talents.

[Tmbrland]

Nub tanks..

Ok.

You said this thread WASN'T about damage and threat after I wrote that post. It was about vigilance.

So I came back and said, "it's one point, take it it has benefits that are HUGE for only 1 talent point."

Now you are asking me about damage and impale again?

Think outside the box man.

For instance. Rend. How much does rend cost with 3/3 Focused Rage? 2 rage?

2 rage for over 1k damage raid buffed. Worth it every time the bleed goes off. Definetly worth it when boss/mob is over 90% health because it does extra damage.

Worth putting talent points into improved rend? of course not.

Your builds flaws-

2/5 shield spec: Seriously? You know our class (prot spec) is based around shield use right?

Besides that it's not bad.

But is more rage from Charge worth it? Is reduced rage heroics strikes worth it? I'd rather have cheaper Devestates and my shield wall on a 4 minute timer.

I thought this thread wasn't about impale, but obviously it turned into one about impale.

Is threat a problem right now? No.

Is tanks staying alive a problem? Always.

Why take points out of mitigation and put them into more damage and threat when we don't NEED more damage and threat.

Come talk to me again if they patch and threat becomes an issue again. Until then, impale is a waste of points better spent in mitigation talents.

I quoted the post...you decided to respond about your other post... dont blame me...

I will just stop... and let others pick away at you. I know I am a "nub tank", you got me...

Lets just leave your armory link here...

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...laran&n=Kaedin

I am sorry that I have not been, wait how does your sig go...

Protection Warrior since '04

Almost 1800 Achievement point, nice.

[heerobya]

I'd even argue that Focused Rages and Puncture aren't really needed anymore, that the points are better spent in things like Improved Spell Reflect or maybe even Improved Disarm cause of the 10% damage increase (though not useful on bosses)

but every once in a while you find yourself in a low rage situation so rage effeciency is still important.

I get 1.4k+ dps in 5-mans. That's enough for me to feel good about my e-peen.

[heerobya]

Wow you are such a scrub.

This toon is not my first. I started on a PvP server playing a tank, got my a$$ handed to me because it was a PvP server and I was a tank.

This was the first month the game came out.

Then i played an alliance tank for a while. Go me. F alliance.

This toon just hit 80 on Thursday and I've already ran most every heroic and geared the F up pretty damn fast for not raiding yet. Check my guild and look at some gear, yeah.. I'm a scrub in comparison.

I wasted too much time on my DK instead of leveling my main.

Your troll post is FAIL, your tank logic is FAIL. Post your armory.

I'm proud enough to link my main in my sig. Not because he's the most uber geared tank in the world but because I have nothing to hide.

I'll be the first to admit (as I did) I just hit 80 and started gearing in heroics and w/ crafted pieces.

Doesn't change the fact I've been tanking instances and raids as a warrior since Ragefire in Ogrimar the first week the game was live.

[heerobya]

The point you missed, of course, was this:

"Is threat a problem right now? No.

Is tanks staying alive a problem? Always.

Why take points out of mitigation and put them into more damage and threat when we don't NEED more damage and threat.

Come talk to me again if they patch and threat becomes an issue again. Until then, impale is a waste of points better spent in mitigation talents."

If as a tank you need more damage so your group hits enrage timers, you need better DPS not tanks who can DPS more.

If you need more threat you either aren't using your abilities properly or in a timely fashion or you don't have enough block/AP to generate threat.

[Strifesword87]

Take Vigilance. Your talking about taking impale for more damage to = more threat, when you could

just put Vigilance on the highest dps and it will probably be much more threat than your "impale" will do.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...gion&n=Sinicul << best warrior spec.

[Vampyrr]

So to summarise, Vigilance is really useful if you play with dps retards, and a few other encounters. Thanks for this discussion about Vigilance and the avoidance to go off on one about impale and/or revenge. Nice. Fortunately I found another site which was much more help than this one.

:

People like this guy is why I dont rely on others to tank for me. A man who obviously does not understand how talents/warriors in general work. Hope he isnt on my server.

[heerobya]

Take Vigilance. Your talking about taking impale for more damage to = more threat, when you could

just put Vigilance on the highest dps and it will probably be much more threat than your "impale" will do.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...gion&n=Sinicul << best warrior spec.

You are right about Vigilance but I do NOT agree with you on that being the best warrior spec.

Booming Voice and Commanding Presence your dps warriors should have. Waste of points for a tank IMO.

NO DAMAGE SHIELD? ARE YOU FUCKING SERIOUS?

[Tayen]

yeah dude wtf no damage shield? booming voice = fail, get a dps warrior.

[Gerrin]

I really like vigilance. I use it often on the offtank for instant taunts and to decrease the dmg he's taking. An example is patchwerk who does huge hatefull strikes. The 3% dmg decrease is significant here. Another example is with Kel'thused (sp?) at the end of naxx. I put vig on the offtank again for phase 3. He takes quite a bit less dmg and if he dies the adds come right to me rather than having to pick them off the healers.

Imp spell reflect is definitely worth it for at least 1 point. You can mitigate a decent amount of dmg in 5 mans or on malygos phase 2.

I also like imp revenge. Alot of mobs are stunnable and thats usefull on trash in raids as well as 5 mans. The dmg boost from the talent is good too not just from a threat perspective but also since I farm as prot.

[heerobya]

Everyone likes to think they can come up with a better spec then the "cookie cutter" because they are so damn smart and uber blah blah blah but I think many don't realize why the cookie cutter build is the way it is.

It's been tested and proven by the top guilds in the world who've been testing it in beta, in alpha, on PTR, in every 10 and 25 person raid, in the world PvP Arena tournaments...

They are the cookie cutter build because they are point for point the least wasteful of talent points and give you the most bang for your buck.

Period.

Anything else is just a personal touch, a little added flair at the cost of what is generally considered to be the "best" spec.

Don't want to use the proven best spec? Want something more personalized?

Cool, enjoy. But people who don't play your class will see that you aren't the cookie cutter build and will think less of you because of it. You can always prove them wrong by being a really good player, but chances are the really best players use the best proven builds because they min/max more seriously then the rest.

With all that said....

Take vigilance, don't take impale. Story over.

[Strifesword87]

I have Booming voice / Commanding presence in my build because i'm in a 10 man raiding guild, and the only warrior who consistently raids. Booming voice is nice for the fights where everyone has to spread out so i dont have to run over and redo or not even give (depending on the fight) commanding as much. I've had damage shield before and i wasn't impressed, basically comes down to 10% better commanding shout or do a little bit more damage. Survivability vs damage, and when i have no problem with threat i'll always go with survivability.

[Tigercat]

With this impale spec what exactly are you missing again? You say you have to sacrifice so much...and since you refer to damage show me what damaging ability I dont have...
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...h=000000000000

You are attempting you compare a spec to damage... you show me a spec without impale and one with. Both warriors would be geared EXACTLY... who does more damage and has more "BIG FLASHY NUMBERS"?

Ok moron, I'll play your little game.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...h=000000000000

This spec is superior to speccing Impale, by quite a bit. The reasoning? Threat isn't a huge issue in most encounters, and the one or two where it is Vigilance more than takes care of it. The more important thing is not getting killed.

As for what you are missing out on with your "LOLIMDPSIMPALE" spec, the most glaring omission is Improved Spell Reflect. A free 4% spell avoidance, on top of the 16% spell mitigation warriors already have? You'd be crazy not to take it, defense against spells is one of the things that makes warrior tanks stand out. Also, you are losing out on 2% block. This may not seem like a lot, but between Critical Block and all the strength on gear nowadays, honestly unblocked attacks are the new crushing blows. Spec 5/5 Shield Spec and you reduce the damage you take, period.

You will lose some damage not going with impale, but even with dps specs Impale isn't responsible for as much overall damage as you might think. The damage lost is traded in to become easier to heal, and the tradeoff is in your favor. That extra 2 seconds that it takes to kill a boss because you don't have impale doesn't compare to how much healer mana you save with Imp Spell Reflect alone.

Get this through your heads, all of you, repeat it as many times as necessary:

I am a tank, not a dps.
I am a tank, not a dps.
I am a tank, not a dps.


PS: Let's not even get into the threat gain from Puncture alone vs Impale, I'd waged that point for point Puncture is better.

[Deleted]

Vigilance is defo worth 1 talent point,

impale worth it or not? I think thats a personal choice, as a tank either OT or MT, you need to get as much avoidance and dmg reduction as possible as priority, then go for threat, as tbh with revenge/shieldslam/Hs you wont have any threat issues.

My new build doesn't have Cruelty, I don't think its that important for a tank, 45% of our threat comes from our shield, which isn't affected by this

I still feel Devastate is a good agro tool, but only with a 2.6 speed weapon, Puncture is pretty redundant now, as when we tank we don't have any rage issues.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...h=051602020306

Is probably the "default" warrior template. You then put the remaining points where your "style" to go imo.

Cruelty or impale for more threat
Imp Disc if your more a "safety" sort of tank...

p.s.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...h=141602020306

is something I'm going to try out, as a single target insane dps/threat build, revenge/HS spam.. would like opinons ;p

[Tmbrland]

Ok moron, I'll play your little game.

(At the time of this post)

You have +12 Stam on your gloves.

You have a green quality gem in your belt.

You actually socket for the bonus... yeah I see PARRY/STAM gems.

You have imp spell reflect.

You have 2 points in puncture.

EH is what is actually easier to heal...remember that is stacking HP and Armor...

PS: Let's not even get into the threat gain from Puncture alone vs Impale, I'd waged that point for point Puncture is better.

PS: You are serious about your PS?

[Tmbrland]

Well, you can socket for the bonus ...thats alright. I guess its just because I see PARRY and not EXPERTISE...

So, yeah I spoke fast there...I apologize.

[gravios]

Vigilance has its uses, and you might not have threat issues now, but once you start running with really well geard dps and speed running heroics, vigilance helps.

This is the spec I use, and that most end game raiding tanks use:
but remember that each of the talents left out have their situational uses. I used safeguard on our first full naxx clear to help the MT live through Maexnas stun since we didn't have HoT healers.

Impale is really good, and it works really well with incite. 7k+shieldslam crits ftw!
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...h=000000000000