Ensidia suspended for 72 Hours

[Phation]

This ban is just a further failure on Blizzards part to make this game more and more geared towards the casual players and them not doing their job at testing encounters.

How many patches has it been since we've had a boss encounter that actually works properly the first time? I'm saying somewhere in early BC but that could be wrong.

Ensidia beat the fight, used the game mechanics they were given and came out world first. Isn't that how boss fights are supposed to work? How world firsts are supposed to work? How is it Ensidias's fault that Blizzard has a bunch of monkeys doing their coding for them?

It's been common place for a while now for Rogues to use the bombs in their DPS rotations, there's more than enough information on EJ to support that and even more numbers of high end raiding rogues to. The fact that it just so happened to aid them on the encounters is Blizzards fault, not Ensidia's. The ban is bullshit.

They didn't alter anything that wasn't in the encounter mechanics. As far as they knew it was part of the fight for the platforms to respawn. So banning them for a screw up on Blizzards end is a total cop out. I say give them world first, they earned it after all.

Even in the old days of raiding we used outside influences to help ourselves kill a boss, I can remember our first Nef kill or Rag kill, we used every single buff we could get on us, that wasn't called cheating back in the day and neither should this. It was making use of the encounter they were given, nothing more.

Blizzard, you screwed up, own up to it, admit you were wrong, fix what needs to be fixed and let Ensidia have another go at it at the very least.

I'm no Ensidia fan-boy but I give credit where it's due, and in this case, good job Ensidia, you earned your world first loud and proud.

[Ringthane]

Bergg this bug happened totally random on a few of the tries, it didn't even happen on all tries. Personally I'm not even sure that it was Saronite that caused it. I believe it was a bug in the encounter that caused it to happen, especially since the bombs did 0.000 siege damage. To me it just looks like that wanted a reason to ban us. If it actually was the saronites then there is no way in the universe that we could possibly have known that since they only did damage to the mobs Naihiko used them on. There was no extra damage on anything else.

We got banned for raiding and that's it.

On a side note. Every end boss in the game has had at least one bug since Vanilla for the first guilds reaching it. Onyxia, Ragnaros, Nefarion, C'thun, Kel'Thuzad, Gruul, Magtheridon, Vashj, Kael'Thas, Archimonde, Illidan, Kil'Jaden and the list continue all the way up to Arthas.

Once again. Banned for raiding.

Naaah, you didn't get banned for raiding.

You got banned for cheating. You know it, we know it, and Blizzard knows it.

If you're such a top guild, you should know that the first rule of raiding is, if you find a bug, you stop raiding and report it. You don't use it to cheat your way through and THEN report it. Now, you may be butthurt because you found the bug to begin with, but isn't that the price you pay for being so far out in front? Somebody has to find the bugs for the rest of us. And if your guild powerleveled engineering before the attempt, as some are saying, and then an engineering bug is hotfixed by Blizzard almost immediately after your attempt, what should that tell us?

Face facts. You cheated and got caught. I don't care what you did in the past, I don't give a damn about your reputation. You broke the rules and you got caught, and you deserve the same punishment anyone else would get. Muqq's river of tears on his blog are just the icing on the cake. Hey, Muqq - don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya.

Unless, of course, you want Ensidia's motto to be "We cheat, so you don't have to".

[Griefel]

It's sad that all the Ensidia haters are blind to the most important idea here :
They got banned for using a well known game mechanic that Blizzard didn't have the decency to test, and now they are paying the consequence ingame but more so in their image, this very heinous in the part of Blizzard and I believe, although they did it conciously or not, they should not get banned. In their place I would protest. For people who say: "they got banned for cheating" how you feel if tomorow you find out via email ban warning that you should not be using <insert random class/profession/etc ability> at wichever PVE encounter because it bugs it.

Note for people that don't know about engineering

It is one of the best melee dps profession choices, and saronite bombs are the biggest part of the profession's benefit, it's basically like sockets for blacksmiths etc.

[Thallidomaniac]

Because they intentionally exploited it? How was it Exodus' fault that blizzard fubar'd the Yogg+0 encounter? Drrrrrr...

Well, Exodus also had the option of not taking advantage of Blizzard's slip-up there, but decided to exploit it nonetheless.

[Zobiana]

Hm... I was making a post about being unsure if it was a proper punishment, now I'm not so sure... I do hope that in the future, all encounters, especially ones as important as this one, are thoroughly tested.

[Winlol]

I found a telling line in Muqq's ragequit post. At the end of one of the paragraphs, he says:

You think we wanted to waste attempts if we knew how to exploit this clusterfuck of an encounter of yours?

Basically, he says they knew how to bug the encounter, and that they intentionally used this bug, knowing it was a bug, because they didn't want to waste attempts doing it the right way.

[georgezimmer]

It's sad that all the Ensidia haters are blind to the most important idea here :
They got banned for using a well known game mechanic that Blizzard didn't have the decency to test, and now they are paying the consequence ingame but more so in their image, this very heinous in the part of Blizzard and I believe, although they did it conciously or not, they should not get banned. In their place I would protest.

So Exodus shouldn't have been banned either, by your warped logic at least.

[blupp]

Justice was served imo, countless times we have seen guilds being banned while Ensidia got away with it, its like watching a snitch being snitched out, priceless. But I do think a 3 day ban is harsh, however reading their responses kind of makes me think they really deserved that too, over inflated ego, etc.

countless times you had no clue if they were exploiting. It just so funny to see people like you actually believing this BS they are writing. You have no clue if they exploited this time, the time before or not, you just made it up and call it a fact. And no just because some No lifers calling Ensidia No lifers say they are exploiting is no proof they did.

Same with those stupid OMFG they ALL leveld engeering up in the last hours, every ensidia member. and all the not so clever people here are selling that as a fact just beacuse someone made that up.

Untill they release the vid, their guilty.

yeah ensidia and all its members are forced by law to proof their innocent to the mighty mmo champ forum trolls.

May i, again, send your focus to the Blood Legion 10man WF. Read the first posts: "OH MY GOD, VIDEO OR ITS AN EXPLOIT BY THEM" the news was 10minutes old and some 12years olds already calling Blood Legion exploiters, wtf.

[Envojus]

lol, why would rogue use those lame grenades on bosses at all? They do 5k damage during 1 encounter.. Looks like they just used it through whole dungeon to later have an excuse for the exploit if they are busted.

/facepalm

I really hope you are trolling if not here is an explanation how they did it : they hired a gypsy fortune teller that told about arthas and that he has a bug with saronite bombs.

[Thallidomaniac]

It's sad that all the Ensidia haters are blind to the most important idea here :
They got banned for using a well known game mechanic that Blizzard didn't have the decency to test, and now they are paying the consequence ingame but more so in their image, this very heinous in the part of Blizzard and I believe, although they did it conciously or not, they should not get banned. In their place I would protest.

Oh great, another person begging for mercy like a hobo. Well, it's not real life. Blizzard won't give a shit about your mercy begging when the party in question deserved such punishment, even if it was lenient. (Again, they should have been Permanently Banned just as how Overrated and Karatechop were.)

[Dantia.]

The question here isn't if they knew the encounter was bugged.

The question is: Did they know the saronite bombs were the cause and if so, were the bombs thrown at the BOSS or at the fallen platforms?

If boss: Unjustified bann, no doubt.

If platform: Justified bann, good riddance.

Now, let's all be honest here, would you HONESTLY stop attempting a boss, specially when you are going for World's First, if you knew there was something wrong with the encounter yet you had no idea what was causing it?

I didn't think so.

[john879]

I think they should have just left it alone and left them kill the achieve and loot. Who really cares. Yes blizzard could inform them of the bug and then fix it. But why all the hate from blizz. So there encounter was bugged oh well. Fix it and let it go. I think they are just embarrassed. All that hype on the final boss and he is bugged from the get go.

[kingmob]

The only "wrong" thing Ensidia did is to keep going and kill the boss with the bug because they had no way to identify the source of the problem. Even going through raw combat logs wouldn't help because it looks like they only show Saronite Bomb damaging NPCs.

Is that true though? Isn't the point of the bombs that they do SIEGE damage? Isn't the whole point of that class of damage in that it's environmentally destructive?

[Deleted]

Not really taking sides here as I can't really care anymore about wow pve but you look pretty guilty tbh. Shamans and mages with Engineering? Both your rogues having it could be explained. posting logs that miss exactly the part that interest us the most. Add that to your refusal to post a video and yeah , you seem to look just like Exodus after yogg 0 kill. Just my 2 cents.

[sicness]

What about a log, then? They already revealed that they have WoL files and in-depth data files, but the only one we know of MYSTERIOUSLY has 7 and some change minutes cut out of it. What was during those minutes? Val'kyr.

There's been several raid leaders who have discussed what happens when the platform is removed, and there's a new Ensidia blog post saying that they were AWARE of what happened when the platform re-appeared. But they continued to do it without even a second thought.

I do agree with bias. It's impossible to have a neutral standpoint, but I really enjoy Ensidia and what they've done to game progression. They have solid players. It's why it sucks so much to see them do this type of shit.

There's what, like, 50 guilds or something that are 11/12 ICC 25 now? Correct me if I'm wrong, but if at least one of those guilds haven't had SERIOUS progression, then something is up. I find that hard to believe.

I'll agree with you on a log would clear things up, but assuming that they're hiding the logs is again just an assumption and could be chalked up to anything from people not caring to them not wanting to from being upset with the ban they received and taking that 3 days to have a break from the game. You see how I can just write up whatever comes to mind about it and how it can make it seem like it's not necessarily a guilty move by them? That's the point, these are all assumptions without real evidence and shouldn't be lead into believing that it's any real evidence towards anything.

With the other guilds doing the encounter, I'm sure most of them have attempted it in 10 man at the very least, but due to the competitive nature of these guilds they are extremely wary of posting ANY information on their status of the encounter so they don't unwillingly post information another guild could use to complete the encounter. The only obvious progress you'll see then from these guilds is when they've completed it and nothing more. They've done this in the past and will continue to do so as to not give out useful information to their competitors.

[georgezimmer]

Well, Exodus also had the option of not taking advantage of Blizzard's slip-up there, but decided to exploit it nonetheless.

Umm, so did Ensidia? Throwing Saronite bombs away from the boss doesn't actually add DPS...They knew what it was causing, and they continued to exploit it. How is this any different?

[Deleted]

Do you want to know why there is 7 minutes missing of the combat log? Because Naihiko died. Go watch the movie and tell me what happens at 10%. Thats right, everyone gets ressed, that's why there's 1 grenade out of place. Maybe you should consider different careers than analysts, because you really suck at that.

[Thallidomaniac]

/facepalm

I really hope you are trolling if not here is an explanation how they did it : they hired a gypsy fortune teller that told about arthas and that he has a bug with saronite bombs.

Nah, I'd say it was a divine "vision" from a so-called deity named "God".

[Ramis]

They were caught red-handed, and whoever posted their news story had a complete meltdown, just like what happened with Muqq. They're both idiots.

You do know that Muqq´s Bloq was a parody of a Everquest rant made by Tigole alias Jeffrey Kaplan our beloved Ex-Lead Game Designer.

Fix your goddamn buggy bullshit half-assed encounters. The amount of time we dedicated to get our keys to see this guy die and take a turn at the Emperor is just sick. To finally see Blood die only to have the ENTIRE raid DT'd from anywhere in the room was simply an insult. Blood dies, there are two earrings on the corpse, yet no matter where you are in the room, the Emperor DT's. So congrats rot on those. It's cheap enough to make a mob DT in the first place. But to have his agro radius extend to the entire room is ridiculous. So let me get this straight -- and this is how you guys envisioned this in San Diego: You spend months farming keys to get up to the room. Months farming Shissar Bane weapons (and the recipe is where?). You kill Blood while dealing with 8 other snakes in the room. And immediately after that fight you're supposed to engage the DEATHTOUCHING-FROM-ANYWHERE-IN-THE-ROOM Emperor along with the 8 snakes? Whoever came up with this sheer *fisting* of an encounter can go fuck themselves. Do me a favor so I don't waste my guild's time on this kind of jackass shit-fest again, send me an email at tigole@legacyofsteel.net when you decide to A) Implement an encounter that wasn't designed by a retarded chimp chained to a cubicle B) Get a Quality Assuarance Department C) Actually beta test the fucking thing and D) Patch it live. And please for god's sake -- do it in the order I laid out for you. Don't worry, I won't charge you a consulting fee on that one. And for good luck you might as well E) Pull your heads out of your asses. While you're at it rename the game to BetaQuest since you've used up you're alotted false advertising karma on the Bazaar and user interface scam of '01.

Fix the Emperor encounter. Fix Seru. Rethink your time-sink bullshit. Fix all the buggy motherfucking ring encounters (I suggest you let whoever made the Burrower one do this since that dude apparently laid off the crack the rest of you were smoking). Fix the VT key quest. Fix VT (just guessing it's fucked up considering your track record). Don't have the resources to fix this stuff? Move the ENTIRE Planes of Power team over to fixing Shadows of Luclin AND DO IT NOW. If you don't fix Luclin, you jackassess will be the only ones playing the Planes of Power.

Source

[Cpttrips]

Seems like an unjustified ban to me *shrug*