Battle of the Badasses (Bracket Finals): Arthas Menethil vs. Grom Hellscream

[Drakhar]

I can't believe I actually read through 29 pages of this garbage. I honestly think at least 90% of these Grom voters believe these points:

1) His 'hellscream' can shatter mountains, no no, worlds!
2) He can move at the speed of light
3) He is a tactical genius (lawl)
4) He can swing with such force, he could cleave the universe in twain! In fact, his cleave is so strong it could cleave Saurfang's cleave.
5) Gorehowl is a superpwn weapon that is forged by the Old Gods and infused with the power of the elemental lords.
6) The only way Grom could lose a fight EVARRR would be if his opponent blew up (o rly?), in fact otherwise he'd never even be TOUCHED by his opponents.
7) IF it were possible for him to be hit, it would just bounce off his super-invincible-mega-skin.

Clearly, if he were in Brox's position, he would've one-shotted Sargeras.

There are (per usual) an assortment of 'u r fanboi' posts followed by 'no u.' But IMO with the exception of those omnipresent morons who still think we're talking about the Lich King here, this thread is just rampant with people who would love nothing more than to bask in Grom's 'glory' aka make retarded arguments and not give a shit about lore.

Any COMMON SENSE post made in defense of Arthas or arguing for him is countered by something along the lines of 'lawl grom would roflstomp him hands down' without any evidence, or citing the same old refuted nonsensical crap. Not to mention the awful arguments about game mechanics (WC3 OR WoW) and cinematics being reasons for /thread.

Grom is not a superhero, he is an experienced, above average orc (exaggeration, to a point) without much more than brute strength and bloodlust. Arthas, even as a DK, weilds Frostmourne and has an impressive resume of destruction and slaughter, more than enough to defeat Grom.

Good thing I lost faith in this community a long, long time ago. I'm at the point where I'll actually laugh if someone like Grom beats Medivh/Malfurion (which is certainly a possibility).

TL;DR: i think death knight is a pretty cool guy, eh would pwn silly orc and doesn't afraid of anything.

Not that anyone cares but I think I've agreed with Lokann on every single BotBA... makes me feel good about my Warcraft knowledge.

[muffpuff]

Gooooo grom!

[Overtroll]

If you remember Arthas(LKs Champion) beat Illidan. A 10,000 year old NE empowered by both the Dark Titan and demonic artifacts.

I don't think Grom's exp is a huge bonus in this one.

Grom killed Illidan's (demi) god.

edit: and he also killed mannoroth

lol he's not very experienced is he

[Deleted]

Not that anyone cares but I think I've agreed with Lokann on every single BotBA... makes me feel good about my Warcraft knowledge.

Awwwwwwww... :3

[Canitnerd]

Frostmourne - Demon forged weapon
Mannoroths Glaive thing - Demon forged weapon
Mannoroths Armor - Demon forged

As long as Grom is giving his all as he did agains Manny, which I believe we can assume considering we are having Thrall fight Vol'jin, anyone can see what will happen. I wonder if Grom will like the 10% dps phase after Frostmourne shatters.

[trulte]

So Arthas with frostmourne having killed Uther, Terenas, Antonidas, Kel'thuzad (living), Sylvanas, Anastarian, Gavinrad the Dire and a Forgotten one. he also have defeated Illidan and Kael'thas in 1 on 1 combat, raised a mighty blue dragon when weakened..

Grom is not a weak one either, He killed Cenarius and Mannoroth... but still i think Arthas would win this, he is well trained with all weapons, he is smart and dont have to worry about the bloodlust taking over and with frostmourne he would win in the end

[Shanur]

Frostmourne - Demon forged weapon
Mannoroths Glaive thing - Demon forged weapon
Mannoroths Armor - Demon forged

As long as Grom is giving his all as he did agains Manny, which I believe we can assume considering we are having Thrall fight Vol'jin, anyone can see what will happen. I wonder if Grom will like the 10% dps phase after Frostmourne shatters.

1. Gorehowl a run of the mill orcish weapon with a name wouldn't shatter frostmourne, sorry.
2. Frostmourne is infused with a part of Ner'zhul(possibly THE most powerful warlock ever)'s soul.
2a. AND the souls of anyone who's flesh has been sundered by frostmourne.
3. Arthas can raise minions from any nearby corpses, or from the souls in frostmourne itself.
4. Arthas IS experienced in battle, he's been trained since he was a boy and thrust into war very quickly.

what's grom got going for him?
~ Little to no actual armor.
~ Demon Blood
~ 15-25 years more battle experience(corrections thanks to -Dalliah- )
~ Little strategic intelligence, sorry to break it to you but he's all about killing and asking questions later.

Not trying to sound like a fan boy, but Arthas really has this one lore wise... He defeated Illidan while weakened. I honestly dont know even with all of grom's awesomeness if he could beat Illy.

[The Madgod]

Arthas has an advantage in the fact that he is capable of casting spells. Even the most powerful warrior cannot withstand a barrage of magic. They don't have anything in their repertoire that can defend themselves from it, unless they have enchanted armor. In Grom's case, all he has is his strength and willpower. He could withstand some magic, but in the end, it's too big of an advantage for Arthas.

[Zoma]

that's actually Garrosh you are referring to.
Garrosh is the son of the man involved.

Garrosh would win this easily. he damn near soloed a pit lord and (while enhanced and with help) took out a demi-god.

the demigod part takes backseat because of all his power ups at the time.

arthas killed... his dad, and civilians. he had help or powerups foreverything else he did pre-LK. the only possible exception i can think of is Illidan and that might have been after LK. even if it was pre-LK Mannoroth>Illidan(it was Mannoroth right? i lose track sometimes)

While correcting the other poster about which Hellscream was involved, you made the same mistake

Anyway, I have a couple questions about how people are judging Grom, since this is apparently supposed to be w/o the blood curse.
-Didn't he spend most of his life with the blood curse? How do we know what he is like w/o it?
-This is supposedly after Mannoroth's defeat. Grom can't fight. He is dead.

Phenomina, Mannoroth didn't kill Grom.
Manny stabbing Grom would be killing him.
Manny pushing a boulder off a cliff on top of Grom would be killing him.
Manny putting some arsenic into the fountain containing his blood would be killing Grom.

Manny exploding with Grom standing face-to-face with the source of the explosion isn't killing Grom, it's being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
If you still want to argue that Manny killed Grom, you have to admit that it wasn't through strength, skill, or intelligence. It was a Pit Lord biological process over which Mannoroth had no control.

Finally, anyone who says that so-and-so is supported by fanboys, no matter who you voted for, please, SHUT THE F@#% UP!!! This applies to all Battle of the Badass threads.

[Shanur]

Grom is actually around 50-80 years old (his age is debatable) and he has been training/fighting since he was a child.
Arthas is around 17-30 years old.
Last time i checked 17 + 10 is 27 and 30 + 10 is 40, which is younger than Grom.

mistake on my part. i think in WC3:tft he(arthas) is 27 ill look it up when im less lazy and i thought grom was late 30's for some reason.

[godofslack]

Arthas no contest, he was able to defeat the power of Illidan (a demon hunter with thousands of years of experience) and Guldan. Grom had was able to defeat Mannoroth killing himself in the process, whereas Illidan killed Tichondrius without dieing (and you have to assume they have simular power as they are equals in the legion). Its simple logic.

[The Madgod]

Well he's a blademaster and they are the elite warriors. Besides they have the ability to move so fast that they seem to be invisible (wind walk) and move so fast that there seems to be more of them (mirror image).
As long as Arthas doesn't have the WoW spell mechanic (cast and heatseeking missiles) most of his spells would miss.

Grom Hellscream, from a lore standpoint, can't do that. If he could, he would have done so in the cinematic where he fought Mannoroth. A higher speed means higher PSI, which means a better chance to pierce armor and cut through vital organs. Any warrior would want to be as fast as they could before tackling a powerful being like Mannoroth. Sure he's fast, but he's not DBZ fast.

[Robbyjawz]

I can't believe I actually read through 29 pages of this garbage. I honestly think at least 90% of these Grom voters believe these points:

1) His 'hellscream' can shatter mountains, no no, worlds!
2) He can move at the speed of light
3) He is a tactical genius (lawl)
4) He can swing with such force, he could cleave the universe in twain! In fact, his cleave is so strong it could cleave Saurfang's cleave.
5) Gorehowl is a superpwn weapon that is forged by the Old Gods and infused with the power of the elemental lords.
6) The only way Grom could lose a fight EVARRR would be if his opponent blew up (o rly?), in fact otherwise he'd never even be TOUCHED by his opponents.
7) IF it were possible for him to be hit, it would just bounce off his super-invincible-mega-skin.

Clearly, if he were in Brox's position, he would've one-shotted Sargeras.

There are (per usual) an assortment of 'u r fanboi' posts followed by 'no u.' But IMO with the exception of those omnipresent morons who still think we're talking about the Lich King here, this thread is just rampant with people who would love nothing more than to bask in Grom's 'glory' aka make retarded arguments and not give a shit about lore.

Any COMMON SENSE post made in defense of Arthas or arguing for him is countered by something along the lines of 'lawl grom would roflstomp him hands down' without any evidence, or citing the same old refuted nonsensical crap. Not to mention the awful arguments about game mechanics (WC3 OR WoW) and cinematics being reasons for /thread.

Grom is not a superhero, he is an experienced, above average orc (exaggeration, to a point) without much more than brute strength and bloodlust. Arthas, even as a DK, weilds Frostmourne and has an impressive resume of destruction and slaughter, more than enough to defeat Grom.

Good thing I lost faith in this community a long, long time ago. I'm at the point where I'll actually laugh if someone like Grom beats Medivh/Malfurion (which is certainly a possibility).

TL;DR: i think death knight is a pretty cool guy, eh would pwn silly orc and doesn't afraid of anything.

Not that anyone cares but I think I've agreed with Lokann on every single BotBA... makes me feel good about my Warcraft knowledge.

1. His Hellscream is a good distracting/stunning the opponent tactic. No one has compared it to shattering mountains or worlds, even Orcs of the Warsong clan can't stand that noise, and I imagine they have heard it multiple times.
2. Blademasters are the best of the best, that is why there aren't many around. They are much faster and agile than your average humanoid, let alone a guy wearing plate armor.
3. I doubt anyone has said that. He just runs about wherever he can do the most damage on the battlefield.
4. He doesn't use cleave as much as Bladestorm, and no one compared it to sundering the world.
5. No one has said Gorehowl is on par with Frostmourne. Frostmourne made Arthas who he is, Grom Made Gorehowl what it is. Plus I think Grom made that axe, not fully sure though.
6. Not counting getting captured by Cairne and Thrall in that gem thing, he wasn't ever actually defeated in battle.
7. Either he kills his opponent before they can strike back or he dodges more than anything as he has very light armor if any at all.
Your post is unintelligent. The only thing that even came close was agreeing with Lokann on everything, and I love to argue with intelligent people over lore so that just makes this that much better.

[Canitnerd]

1. Gorehowl a run of the mill orcish weapon with a name wouldn't shatter frostmourne, sorry.
2. Frostmourne is infused with a part of Ner'zhul(possibly THE most powerful warlock ever)'s soul.
2a. AND the souls of anyone who's flesh has been sundered by frostmourne.
3. Arthas can raise minions from any nearby corpses, or from the souls in frostmourne.

Gorehowl wouldnt be sundering frostmourne, grom would. And it seems all those souls "crying out for release" would weaken the sword.

[Rend Blackhand]

Grom may have killed cenarius with the second dose of demon blood but he was cleansed of it when he killed Mannoroth.

[Shanur]

Gorehowl wouldnt be sundering frostmourne, grom would. And it seems all those souls "crying out for release" would weaken the sword.

Eh wat?

Barehands on frostmourne? i honestly dont know what you mean
^ and if you do mean that, that's just silly.

and the souls don't weaken the sword. Look at shadowmourne, you need to infuse it with souls to make it more powerful, and Arthas has harvested many with Frostmourne.

[Lazertrooper]

This particular battle is more like battle of the jackasses.

Arthas: killed his own people
Grom: enslaved his own people

[Delekth]

GoGo Arthas!

[Deleted]

I'm gonna go with Arthas. What? I practically jizz on anything to do with Lordaeron or Quel'Thalas!

[Canitnerd]

Eh wat?

Barehands on frostmourne? i honestly dont know what you mean
^ and if you do mean that, that's just silly.

and the souls don't weaken the sword. Look at shadowmourne, you need to infuse it with souls to make it more powerful, and Arthas has harvested many with Frostmourne.

I mean that its not weapon v weapon, its weilder v weilder. The souls inside frostmourne press against the walls of their prison, making frostmourne vulnerable to sundering. Thats why tirion was able to break it, and hellscream has already shown the ability to break demon forged gear.