Niblung vs MH/OH

[Achtland]

So currently I'm using the frozen bonespike and heroic scourgelords baton and it was suggested to me that the Niblung staff would be an AWESOME dps increase. I've never been a fan of staves mostly because of the stat loss on the off hand that would be sustained but obv i'm not a theorycrafter. I'm looking for some other opinions because I can't actually FIND a comprehensive gear list(in terms of priority) for my spriest. I looked on shadowpriest.com and got two lists that didn't even list ICC gear. And the shadowpriest thread on EJ linked to Shadowpriests.com.

HELP?


edit: I should mention I'm using black magic on my MH and also was wondering which enchant would be better....blackmagic or 81SP?

[Docta]

http://shadowpriest.com/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=24134 <-- Gear List

Black Magic vs 63 sp is more a matter of choice, they're nearly a wash. Caluclating dps change would be a matter of figuring out how much movement/how much use of the BM procs you get. If you get a staff 81 sp will almost always be superior unless you had a really strange haste setup. I think I recall BM losing value at like 11 or 1200ish haste, but that was just a random comment from our spriest when he swapped chants, based on his setup/latency.

edit for nibelung

#14 Nibelung(277) + Runed Cardinal Ruby + Purified Dreadstone + Reckless Ametrine
Icecrown: Lady Deathwhisper / Heroic-25
948.0 = 837+115*0.22+23+17.9+21.8+9(bonus)+14

#10 Frozen Bonespike(264)
Icecrown: Lord Marrowgar / Normal-25
835.39 = 741+59*0.76+67*0.22+59*0.59
#07 Scourgelord's Baton(264) + Runed Cardinal Ruby
Icecrown: Lady Deathwhisper / Heroic-10
174.38 (296.58) = 97+45*0.76+69*0.22+23+5(bonus)+(65*1.88)


835.39+174.38 = 1009.77 ... this shows bonespike coming in ahead of nibelung, and technically if you are using the hit it should even be worth more (835.39+296.58) = 1131.97

[Brusalk]

http://www.shadowpriest.com/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=24134


Your MH/OH combo is better. (much better)

In terms of your black magic vs SP enchant, black magic is better than the SP enchant, but it does add a bit of RNG into your casts more so than the spell power enchant. That is mostly a personal choice in my opinion.

-EDIT-

Sigh. I want the old forums back (or at least the ability to know when someone else posted while you're making a post)

[Pappadin]

Nibelung isnt that good tbh, stick with Mh/Oh.

[orangeaccord311]

Assuming you can use all of the hit on the heroic Baton, the only upgrade you could make would be to the LK25 1H mace (this is also assuming you don't have access to heroic icc25 gear).

[Achtland]

I guess what I'm really asking is that if the proc rate on Niblung is worth giving up MH/OH. I'm looking for something in depth on this.

[aarondf2003]

None of you touched on the most important aspect... Blizzard does not count the Valks as 'pets' so they don't receive the Icecrown Citadel buff. You're effectively trading all the stats on an MH/OH combo that DO GET the 30% buff for a staff that's missing itemization and Valk procs that don't scale with the ICC buff.

You used to be able to make a case for Nibelung on about 4 bosses back during the 0% buff days... not anymore.

[Docta]

you can safely assume the math from shadowpriest.com has gone in depth on the proc rate/value of nibelung to prove the info we've provided

[Hagu]

you can safely assume the math from shadowpriest.com has gone in depth on the proc rate/value of nibelung to prove the info we've provided

With the caveat that you have to ignore anything you read that was written prior to the buff (Jan/Feb perhaps?) IIRC, that about doubled the proc damage and added in the self-heal.

[kenn9530]

the main reason nibelung isnt good is the lack of stats, i would lose around 150 haste if i used it over the festergut 10 hc staff which is handy with the haste and hit on it, the proc alone doesnt make up for the dps loss from the haste you lose from using nibelung, its still a decent weapon but its preferable to get more haste than the proc it provides.

[Achtland]

I always KNEW Nibelung was GARBAGE...thank you my wonderfully smart friends. ><

[Samurai]

Its nick named Nooblung for a reason

[Direshadow]

It is one of the more "Fun" items in the game and by far one of the easiest weapons to get your hands on. I've always been a staff user personally. People will go on and on about if staffs are better then daggers/off hands.

I raid with another Shadow Priest who is equally geared as me, except he uses the Dagger/Off Hand combo, while I use Heroic Dying Light.

In almost every fight, our dps ends up being equal, with only a few digits being the difference. Both of us usually push around 10K.

Use what you want. One or two items are not going to throw your dps way off. Do your own research into the Nibelung. Seriously, go do it. You may be surprised at what you find.

[_leander]

Use what you want. One or two items are not going to throw your dps way off. Do your own research into the Nibelung. Seriously, go do it. You may be surprised at what you find.

If your own research surprises you then you did other research wrong. Nibelung average about equal to other ICC weapons if you can not use hit on other item and there is not AOE damaging. Also fight can not be with ICC buff, or other weapon become better. Proc die too fast on Halion and that only other fight where DPS really matter. If turn off ICC buff then Nibelung good on a couple of ICC boss, but not many. Big use mainly to wear in 5 man to have pretty proc.

[Direshadow]

If your own research surprises you then you did other research wrong. Nibelung average about equal to other ICC weapons if you can not use hit on other item and there is not AOE damaging. Also fight can not be with ICC buff, or other weapon become better. Proc die too fast on Halion and that only other fight where DPS really matter. If turn off ICC buff then Nibelung good on a couple of ICC boss, but not many. Big use mainly to wear in 5 man to have pretty proc.

This is why research, for school especially, is good.

[gaymer77]

first off I have to say that I really hate control R right about now >.< anyways....


1) General rule of thumb for weapon enchants for shadow priests is staff = 81 SP & MH = BM. The spellpower conversion for BM is 66 2/3 which is why it beats out the 63 SP enchant for a MH but simple math shows why the 66 2/3 gets beat by 81 SP for a staff. This is for shadow priests not all classes. Ele shaman and druids will still be using 63/81 SP to their weapon because they benefit more from the static spellpower than a haste buff.

2) Nibelung is by far the best pvp weapon out there & possibly beats out some of the actual arena weapons. The reason for this is because the Valks got buffed in damage, health, and AOE resistance like pets get. Its great to have what can turn into your own personal army when you're fighting someone. Even as a healer its a great weapon if you are doing offensive dispells because those can & will proc a Valk. Nibelung is also great for 5 mans as someone else mentioned and that's because it helps speed things up as you are zipping through your 15 minute run.

[Direshadow]

Gaymer77 did his research.

You get an A+

You are also allowed to go read under the oak tree in beside the school.

[_leander]

This is why research, for school especially, is good.

No reason to be condescending. My English not so great and I never say it is. Not the same thing as not do research about game and not the same as poor education in other thing. My math fine and know about Nibelung fine. If you can not understand what I say it one thing, but not need to insult. You compare Dying Light to use one hand and say staff not big DPS different. Problem you see is other staff with stat also better than Nibelung in fight I describe in other post. Not talk about small DPS difference. Talk about 500 or more DPS different because proc die too quick on many fight and not scale with ICC buff any.

[klaps_05]

nib vs mh/oh is pretty much a no brainer, but does rawr and all the other software calculate the extra 30% dmg that the valkyr gets?

[Samurai]

As above, the valks don't get the buff