Haste and Mastery: When to reforge?

[Antonne]

So I've been reading around a little bit and have heard the general consensus say that Haste is better than Mastery for Holy priests, but Mastery is still good. I personally have more Haste than Mastery and don't plan on changing that anytime soon. That being said, I'm kind of interested in at which point I can stop going for Haste and go for Mastery. I've heard 12.5% Haste adds the 6th Renew tick (which, mind you, is not the only reason to stack Haste), and I've also heard that 37.5% Haste does that. However, I assume 37.5% is raid buffed assuming you have 5% from Darkness, 5% from SPriests, etc.

What I'm really looking for is this: How much Haste do I want?

I know its really valuable behind INT and SPI as it gets Heals, etc. out faster, but how much is TOO much? My armory is listed below. My gear is pretty good, I'm raid-ready and raid-geared in some areas, despite missing a few enchants. This isn't a "RATE ME PLOX" thread, more of a "Help me achieve maximum awesomess" thread.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...dralina/simple

Thanks for any help provided, in advance!

[zenkai]

I have a post about haste here ---> http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...Math-inside%29

12.5% haste (buffed) adds a 5th renew tick, 37.5 adds 6, the default is 4, and this is only vital if you're not refreshing renew with heal.

Details on this and the rest of your question is covered in my post

BTW darkness has 3%, and yes you can get 5% more from raid buffs meaning raid wise you only need 4.5% haste to get a 5th tick (but I really don't recommend worrying about this since we don't use renew on people unless we're tank healing)

[Deleted]

Whenever I see these threads the replies always seem to be based around renew, which whilst valid seem quite negligible.
Looking through some logs I see renew accounts for only 10% of my healing on average, this is often less than echo of light.


whilst mastery is the clear winner from a healing per mana perspective I would be interested to know which stat (haste or mastery) offers more throughput in an AoE healing situation (in 25mans)

if for example you have 25 people all sitting at 1 health, and you need to get them to 100% asap, which stat would be most effective?

I often notice my echo of light overhealing anywhere between 15%-60%, this coupled with having more mana than the other healers led me to reforge out of mastery and into haste with the hopes of having more effective and 'lifesaving' heals at the cost of HPM.

It's a debate I've been having in my head for some time now, I too would appreciate other peoples views on haste vs mastery where renew is essentially ignored.

[Posh]

Most of people say you should have spirit on every slot, so u cant reforge spirit. Even if you dont have spi on every slot (i think that would actually overkill the needs for mana, but it's my opinion), you cant reforge spirit MOST of the time.

That said the only stat that gives you more hpm is mastery but haste gives more flexibility and for sure more output. So i'd say: reforge haste IF you dont have mana problems it'll give you more hps but if you have problems with mana, mastery will help more.

I dont think there is a specific point where you should give up haste for mastery but it depends on which role you have in the fight, if u prefer casting coh/pom (obviously not affected by haste) or poh and on the type of encounter itself. After reading like a milion posts about haste vs mastery i came to the conclusion that really depends on your healing style. When it will be possible to have 37.5% haste then i'll think about stacking haste but for now i'd say go for a balance between the 2 stats. Then again: it works for me but i dont think there's a general rule about it as there is no general rule about how much spi u should have (depends how much you value having a "safe zone" of mana regen).

[zsun]

As for how much is too much haste? You don't have to worry about that at this point in time. The GCD cap is nowhere in sight yet, so you can go nuts on haste if your mana supports it.

I am personally not a mastery fan as the healing it provides is less useful than the initial heal that was dished out. Like a lot of people have mentioned, a large portion of echo of light goes to overheals

[chir0n]

I'd say that when you reach the 12.5% cap it is a good time to start investing in other stats.
Haste gives your heal casttime a benefit and mastery gives you a benefit inbetween casting heal's on the tank. I think a balance between those is best

[Kuismar]

Personally I reforge crit only into another stat. If the gear has no spirit I reforge for that. If no haste or mastery then one of those. If it has neither haste or mastery then currently I choose haste, because the small benefit from EoL doesn't help my playstyle.

[zito]

As for how much is too much haste? You don't have to worry about that at this point in time. The GCD cap is nowhere in sight yet, so you can go nuts on haste if your mana supports it.

I am personally not a mastery fan as the healing it provides is less useful than the initial heal that was dished out. Like a lot of people have mentioned, a large portion of echo of light goes to overheals

Reason we wanted GCD in the first place in wotlk is because we spamed renew. This is no longer the case anymore and we have a talent for that. Now we go haste for shorter cast times and extra renew tick.

In terms of reforging:

Reforge all crit to spirit if there is no spirit on that piece of gear, to haste if you are not at 12.5% haste (if that is your goal with haste), or to mastery if there is already haste/spirit on the piece of gear.

Reforge mastery to spirit (if you need spirit) or haste (if you need haste).

Mastery is basically it increases your healing spells by X% but you get it over Y seconds instead of direct healing. In my eyes anyway.

[Posh]

Another thing about the overheal mastery is supposed to cause. My personal aim is to keep the tank at 90% not 100%, so yes i'll keep casting heal even if tank is 100% yet the mastery overheal will be not too much and use big heals (possibly always avoiding fheal) just if the tank is under say 60% or so. The overheal effect this way should still be there yet minimal. On aoe heals situation is different, i know, but overheal with poh will be mostly caused by glyph (and probably ppl in the grp not really needing the heal at the moment) while we cant really have any control over pom overheal and coh (usable imo if u r using inner will) will most likely cause very little overheal if used properly.

[Kelesti]

Quoting Nisala here:

I'm going to say, Gun, that haste is better - and here's why: Beyond throughput, beyond numbers on a meter, your job is to keep people alive. What is likely to achieve that more? A HoT ticking for a few hundred per second after a heal has landed... or a faster response to damage thanks to haste? As far as I can tell, it's evident that being able to respond to damage quicker is far more beneficial than leaving a 300-a-second HoT on a target.

The mastery becomes more impressive in helping us sustain tanks thanks to the fact it stacks and thus offers a consistent buffer to our healing. As a raid healer, however, whilst mastery is nice, it is in no way comparable to haste as far as I'm concerned.

And it's never just cast one Prayer.

---------- Post added 2011-01-08 at 12:23 PM ----------

That said, I'm going to miss my 22% raid-buffed haste. Haste cloth is seriously lacking on my remaining upgrades to 359 gear (unless I go without Spirit on more pieces than I want to with the incoming nerf).

[Posh]

I dont want to start another thread since there are a milion about haste and mastery. I was just wondering one thing: mastery in a way scales with intellect cause it's a % on the heal u cast so bigger heal, bigger the benefit u get from it while haste doesnt interact in such a way.

So i was thinking: what happens when gear gets higher level? It would also be nice to know what will happen with itemization next step, yet that we cant know unless somebody has a ghostcrawler emulator at home. If they keep on putting mastery and not haste on cloth we might as well adapt before...

Edit: kelesti, since you appear to be into the programming thing, can u start programming a ghostcrawler emulator?

[harky]

Minimum Haste is 12.5%. After that Haste still offers the highest output of your secondary stats, while Mastery increases output by less, but also increases efficiency slightly. I would not recommend reforging Mastery -> Haste, or Haste -> Mastery under any circumstance. There will always be a better way to reforge your gear. The main reforging you should be doing is if you have Crit on your gear at which point you should reforge in one of these priorities based on how many mana issues you have: Spirit > Haste = Mastery, or Haste > Mastery > Spirit. The first for if you have mana issues and the second for if you don't.