[TV/Books] Game of Thrones ***SPOILER Discussion***

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Either way, I consider the TV scenes comparable. Ramsay is just such a despicable character, though, which is why a comparison to Dany/Drogo probably don't spring to mind immediately after watching the last episode. We know Dany eventually fell in love with her husband, and the likelihood of that happening with Ramsay/Sansa is close to 0, unless the GoT writing department gets really creative with the rewrites.

I agree they're very comparable. Pretty much exact same reactions, just one is more censored. Just weird people are upset about this when Danny/Drogo happened years ago.

[eschatological]

Again, people were upset with the Dany/Drogo scene too, specifically because she consented in the books.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Again, people were upset with the Dany/Drogo scene too, specifically because she consented in the books.

And we know the TV is a different telling of the story. So did she consent in the TV? Because she looked like she didn't enjoy it.

[eschatological]

No....she didn't.

And it's a perfect example of what I'm trying to say. What purpose did that scene serve? Dany still fell in love with Drogo, and guess what? My friends who hadn't read the book were confused why one episode she was being raped by the guy, and the next episode she's trying to learn sex lessons to please him. Those of us who read the book know that the scene should have been much more subtle, and the character of Drogo much more subtle too, and it weakened both characters.

[cubby]

The Sansa scene wasn't meant for the sex, it was meant for Theone/Reek to start coming around. My guess is that in the coming episodes he'll be her widow maker.

[Deleted]

For me the series has been in a sharp decline since season 3. Everything the writers barf out on the screen that wasn't written by GRR martin is of sub par quality.
The plot is slowly degenerating into typical Hollywood bullshit.
I was never a big fan of on screen forced sexual intercourse and for my personal taste this went overboard in accumulation with the scenes of Crasters keep that were just plain awful in content and style.

There are better series than GoT out these days. (Daredevil for instance) so I won't watch GoT anymore. Not because of one rape scene but just because it sucks.

[Gestopft]

I agree they're very comparable. Pretty much exact same reactions, just one is more censored. Just weird people are upset about this when Danny/Drogo happened years ago.

I think deep deep down, people wanted a storybook ending for Sansa's virginity. So much has gone wrong for her that you just want something to turn out the way she'd have wanted. I'll admit I did (but see post 6395 for my reasoning on the scene).

[cubby]

No....she didn't.

And it's a perfect example of what I'm trying to say. What purpose did that scene serve? Dany still fell in love with Drogo, and guess what? My friends who hadn't read the book were confused why one episode she was being raped by the guy, and the next episode she's trying to learn sex lessons to please him. Those of us who read the book know that the scene should have been much more subtle, and the character of Drogo much more subtle too, and it weakened both characters.

The scene served the purpose of demonstrating that Theone/Reek is still alive someone where deep down in his misery. Also, asking what a scene served then comparing it to what happened in another with examples from future scenes means, to truly answer your question, we'd have to look into the future.

The Deny/Drogo "scenes" were done very, very well. While you are comparing it to the books, I am merely comparing it to what happened with their relationship as time progressed. Of course it wasn't as subtle as the books, there wasn't time for it.

[Celista]

I think deep deep down, people wanted a storybook ending for Sansa's virginity. So much has gone wrong for her that you just want something to turn out the way she'd have wanted. I'll admit I did (but see post 6395 for my reasoning on the scene).

Maybe I'm overly optimistic considering GRR Martin's writing, but I do feel like she'll have at least something significant turn out the way she wanted in the end. Perhaps with Winterfell...it would be quite amusing if she managed to outsmart Littlefinger, depending on how her storyline develops.

[cubby]

Maybe I'm overly optimistic considering GRR Martin's writing, but I do feel like she'll have at least something significant turn out the way she wanted in the end. Perhaps with Winterfell...it would be quite amusing if she managed to outsmart Littlefinger, depending on how her storyline develops.

That would be amazing if she did, and there is a little bit of evidence to suggest that her "innocence" is far behind her (the scene at the Vale where she said Littlefinger was innocent).

However, those that were hoping for a "storybook" ending for Sansa's virginity haven't been paying attention. There is NO ONE left in her world that would be romantic for her. Sansa's best bet for a happy outcome is to marry Littlefinger and perhaps ascend the throne. It won't happen, and if she lives through the coming battle, she'll more than likely retain Winterfell with Littlefinger as her third and final husband.

[Ilikegreenfire]

For me the series has been in a sharp decline since season 3. Everything the writers barf out on the screen that wasn't written by GRR martin is of sub par quality.
The plot is slowly degenerating into typical Hollywood bullshit.
I was never a big fan of on screen forced sexual intercourse and for my personal taste this went overboard in accumulation with the scenes of Crasters keep that were just plain awful in content and style.

There are better series than GoT out these days. (Daredevil for instance) so I won't watch GoT anymore. Not because of one rape scene but just because it sucks.

A few points here.

The thing is the writers have to make up their own stuff because of issues with screen time and actors, let alone the fact the the show is starting to overtake the books in the timeline, like what happens with many Manga/Anime. If the sooner people realize the tv show is inspired by the books and not a direct adaptation the more they will enjoy it. Granted the Stuff not written by GRRM will likely not be as good most of it is still cool.

The show has had plenty of forced sex and worse seasons 1-3 Does Walder Frey ring a bell? The dude impregnates wives to death.

While opinions may be opinions personally i think DD and GOT are both great shows and calling GOT shit seems a little silly to me.

Perhaps 10 Years from know then the books are done we will get a direct adaptation. But for now i thing you should try and enjoy the show for what it is.

[eschatological]

That would be amazing if she did, and there is a little bit of evidence to suggest that her "innocence" is far behind her (the scene at the Vale where she said Littlefinger was innocent).

However, those that were hoping for a "storybook" ending for Sansa's virginity haven't been paying attention. There is NO ONE left in her world that would be romantic for her. Sansa's best bet for a happy outcome is to marry Littlefinger and perhaps ascend the throne. It won't happen, and if she lives through the coming battle, she'll more than likely retain Winterfell with Littlefinger as her third and final husband.

Hmmm, at one point in the books, I thought it might be possible that Tyrion and Sansa would reunite and realize they're probably the best they could do for each other. And that would get Tyrion his seat as a major player, he'd be Warden of the North, he'd become more of a Stark (characteristically, he already is more Stark than Lannister), and Sansa would get her kind, brave knight.

It's hard to see Tyrion coming back from the East, though, without some sort of major attachment to Dany.

[cubby]

Hmmm, at one point in the books, I thought it might be possible that Tyrion and Sansa would reunite and realize they're probably the best they could do for each other. And that would get Tyrion his seat as a major player, he'd be Warden of the North, he'd become more of a Stark (characteristically, he already is more Stark than Lannister), and Sansa would get her kind, brave knight.

It's hard to see Tyrion coming back from the East, though, without some sort of major attachment to Dany.

Interesting, I never even thought of Tyrion coming back enough to be able to settle down with Sansa. And you're right, he is much more a Stark than a Lannister. It would get him his seat at the table again, but yeah, he'll be on Dany's shoulders if he ever sees the Seven Kingdoms again. And Dany has a date with John Snow to ascend the throne. That or Littlefinger.

Man I love that guy.

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Of course, the Bolton's could ascend the throne and GoT could end like The Dark Tower series with the mad little king ending up in charge again.

[Nekovivie]

Tommen really needs to wake up and smell the roses. He has so much power as King but he is acting like a squire.

[ItachiZaku]

If the rape happened in the book, would you find it okay? Cause it seems that's the only argument I'm seeing here - "it didn't happen in the book".

Didn't happen on the show, either.

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And we know the TV is a different telling of the story. So did she consent in the TV? Because she looked like she didn't enjoy it.

She did not consent, but she didn't object either. She actually helped it along. Her "not enjoying it" was simply her losing her v-card, which might still be hurtful, given her horseback riding expereince, but also the emotional impact of "this is my life". It was like losing her v-card to some meh footballer in high school, because it was the "cool" thing to do.

This isn't the book and people should really start getting over the fact that things will be way different between the two. I stopped overly connecting books to movie/TV way back when a Dean Koontz book, a 12 year old crippled girl turned into a 16 year old party girl Alicia Silverstone in her sexy prime.

The only real way to keep this stuff as pure as possible, would be if it was a legit soap opera that was on with General Hospital. 1 hour a day, every day, for the next 30 years. So many characters, so many plots... 10 1 hour episodes a year is not going to do it all justice.

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Dany still fell in love with Drogo, and guess what? My friends who hadn't read the book were confused why one episode she was being raped by the guy, and the next episode she's trying to learn sex lessons to please him. Those of us who read the book know that the scene should have been much more subtle, and the character of Drogo much more subtle too, and it weakened both characters.

Which is the exact opposite of how the Dothraki were portrayed and the opposite of Ramsay. I think we all know Sansa and Ramsay won't be like Drogo and Dany, but lol what if they did? What if after getting married, putting a kid in Sansa, Ramsay gets reborn as some chivalrous crusader to protect all that is North? They did it to Khal Drogo, so why not Ramsay?

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Tommen really needs to wake up and smell the roses. He has so much power as King but he is acting like a squire.

After his marathon sex with Marge, I'm rather shocked he isn't mindlessly killing half the city to appease her.

[Gamevizier]

writers are not writing totally new stories in the new season but rather having the main POVs take on other book character's roles : Sansa has taken the role of Jayne Poole, and Brienne has taken the role of Mance Rayder most likely, Mormont has taken the role of Jon Conningtonsame thing with Jaimie and Bronn.

I consider this season to be among the best GoT seasons so far : the core stories remain the same but the details are tweaked, roles are changed and some characters are killed to keep the audience (both book readers and GoT watchers) guessing and wondering about who the next death is going to be. :3

[BloodyAngel12]

I can see Sansa being Queen of the North.

[MikeBogina]

wondering about who the next death is going to be. :3

Mace Tyrell is gonna bite a coin in Braavos, mark my words!

I'm thinking we're gonna see him and Trant in Braavos soon and Arya will at least kill trant.

[Darth Belichick]

Trant is in Braavos and yeah, that dude is dying soon.

[Wilian]

In the book, it's not a rape, is what I meant.

Why are you not crying out how Margarey raped Tommen?