Nerfbat doesn't stop.

[Deleted]

i cant disagree with a nerf to healing. dps specs shouldnt be doing so much healing. But nerfing a strength and leaving weakness alone means a class has only weakness.
DKs need to be brought up in other area's of gameplay. But sadly blizzard seems hell bend on making sure warriors are always the best melee, especially in plate. Look what happend to paladins and now DKs. Every comp with either is no beter off getting a warrior instead, working as intented?

This... I've always believed that blizzard has 3 staple classes. For healers its the priest, casters its the mage and for melee its the warrior. Even when they are nerfed they are often hotfixed very fast to be back up in the top again. The classes bugs get fixed much faster and they are always viable.

[AnarkanDK]

Not a terrible nerf. It wasnt really the problems with your CC or Damage being TOO OP. It was the healing, finally blizzard is slowly getting the idea. Idea why they are still nerfing Hungering Cold ? But hey we all get hit by the nerfbat. Glad to see this change but DKs dont despair.

Adjust and be good, youll be alright

You definitely have no clue about how this will affect us. So I will tell you.

The moment a frost DK is seen in an arena game, they will be trained 24-7 (we're pretty trained already). Without a proper self heal, we'll die very quickly. Add in the other nerf (cast time on HC) we'll be trained even harder, so we can't get it off. Solution? Spec unhol - oh wait. That spec suffers also from the DS glyph nerf, and it's pretty weak at the moment anyway.

Watch DK representation drop massively if these nerfs make it to live. We'll be back to S7 imo.

[Yemiena]

I care less about nerfs and more about the design direction of the class. It seems like every patch, even small non-content ones, there is some change to the core elements or fundamentals of the class requiring us to rethink aspects of our priority rotations, rethink how we use the tools we do have, and then have another change or knee jerk reaction to something else that changes everything we just relearned.

Obviously the class is younger than the others so requires tweaking and fine tuning that others haven't, though when you think about it most classes had huge overhauls that almost made them a new class anyway. That being said, I don't PvP anymore mainly because the game bores me to tears. I do however still raid because I love my guild, and I'm MT. Some heroic modes are not as forgiving as others and being as that we have 4 dk's in total in our 25 group I can see this change having some unintended consequences and require some adjustment. I can see certain fights being more of an issue than others however, but having the self heal was a nice utility for dps dk's that is now being thrown to the wayside.

This isn't really QQ because whatever like I said I don't pvp anymore I'm just more annoyed about the fact it seems like Blizzard doesn't know what they want to do with us at times. Nerf this, buff that then next patch revert nerf then nerf the buff and something else etc etc etc. I played a Warlock back in Vanilla in the early days so believe me I have experience playing the red-headed stepchild of classes, I enjoy DK and will play it regardless of nerfs, it just frustrates me that we're on this roller-coaster of nerfs/buffs that are normally related to core mechanics or fundamentals of the class and how it plays.

Thats how i feel too.

[Huckfealing]

Death Strike Level 85
1 Unholy, 1 Frost Melee Range
Requires Melee Weapon
A deadly attack that deals 150% weapon damage plus 330, healing you for 20% of the damage you have sustained during the preceding 5 sec (minimum of at least 7% of your maximum health).

See? At least 7% of your maximum health, and what was it before nerf - 15-20%? That's not an 80% nerf you moron. At least people can out dmg it with this nerf.

Also fixed something about the cast time thing.

Right, adding "unless it's fake casted." Doesn't strengthen your point anymore. So your saying that a melee class needs to fake cast 3..4..5 times just to get a cast off? You know this was a problem back in Bc and Some of wrath, then blizzard made Scootnshoot spells to avoid this.

The glyph is for stabilization nothing more, If we did not have the glyph a caster could shred us without cd's. Even with AMS, even with Lichborne heal, EVEN with Ghoul sac, its still simply enough to kite a DK. Even with CoI and DG, Mages can blink, locks can port, druids can shit/dispell, priest can dispell. The list goes on, the reworking of this glyph is devastating.

If they break that equalization we will die that much faster, making what heals we do have 80% less potent, because it will only heal for roughly half as much, and if we are not stabilizing we will die = less healing = that amount.

Btw, I would not call somebody a Moron, Mods are on the loose.

[Frostx]

Am currently rerolling as a Frost Mage now.

I took a break from wow like 2 months ago (before 4.1 patch went live) and before I quit, my Unholy DK topped the DPS chart in most of the dungeon runs.

NOW I went back and discovered that my DK is now on the bottom of the dps chart 90% of the time (I performed the correct rotation mind you) and often got kicked out of the group for only pulling 6.5 k.

Result? Death Knight went soft

Time to reroll...

[gaymer77]

I gave up reading this thread after 3 pages of QQ we are no longer viable in pvp so we all must reroll. Seriously STFU. DKs have and will still have some of the best utility in the game for a melee class. This MUCH NEEDED NERF is exactly that, much needed. No other class could solo 1 heroic boss let alone 2 but DKs were able to...AS CURRENT CONTENT. As it stands now, frost DKs are most burst than mages & ele shaman. I don't agree with the cast time on hungering cold and do agree that Ring of Frost needs to have a cast time put in there but the self healing that DKs do needs a big ol nerf.

[Huckfealing]

I gave up reading this thread after 3 pages of QQ we are no longer viable in pvp so we all must reroll. Seriously STFU. DKs have and will still have some of the best utility in the game for a melee class. This MUCH NEEDED NERF is exactly that, much needed. No other class could solo 1 heroic boss let alone 2 but DKs were able to...AS CURRENT CONTENT. As it stands now, frost DKs are most burst than mages & ele shaman. I don't agree with the cast time on hungering cold and do agree that Ring of Frost needs to have a cast time put in there but the self healing that DKs do needs a big ol nerf.

They are not nerfing Blood Soloing will continue.

---------- Post added 2011-05-27 at 05:29 PM ----------

Am currently rerolling as a Frost Mage now.

I took a break from wow like 2 months ago (before 4.1 patch went live) and before I quit, my Unholy DK topped the DPS chart in most of the dungeon runs.

NOW I went back and discovered that my DK is now on the bottom of the dps chart 90% of the time (I performed the correct rotation mind you) and often got kicked out of the group for only pulling 6.5 k.

Result? Death Knight went soft

Time to reroll...

Although I understand your plight, 6.5 is waaaaay to low. Something must be hankey with your stats/priority.

[Ashareth]

While I agree that death strike itself needs a buff there are no nerfs needed for the DK tank. Right now they are mediocre unless played at a skill far above the block tanks. Of course high-level play will require some sorting out afterwards, but that's an issue for another time. >>

Also, any nerfs to our mastery would not change our scaling or fix it. It needs a much more notable change than something that silly.

You understood me wrong. I don't ask for DS nerf at all, just that the bullshit with really different efficiency between presences stop, the only way to do that is by making it healing the same all around... which mean reducing the effect of Blood Mastery otherwise it would make DS+Blood Shield too potent (since you would have 10% heal AND 10%*mastery BS instead of 7%/7%) to make it up.

After that, i'm one of the people thinking DKs need a slight buff, but it's mostly on Armor because otherwise we are pretty decent. But it's a complicated matter. But on the other hand, i guess a 20/30% physical damage reduction bundled up in AMS as a talent for a slight silence duration on Strangulate should be "spot on" and "not overpowered at all" since it seems doing that for Wars is working "as intended".
(I bet once again Wars weren't 40/50% of the MT anymore and there was too many pallies taking the job, so they buffed wars and nerfed pallies, like they did in Wrath with DKs and Pallies everytime Wars weren't the MT for 50% or more of the progression guilds ).


But it's another discussion.

---------- Post added 2011-05-27 at 08:05 PM ----------

You don't see anything wrong with you being able to solo
current level HEROIC bosses?

I'm waiting for you to ask Blizzard to nerf Hunters into the ground since a HUNTER soloed al VP HC alone like 1 week after the release.
Oh and Paladins too, because they can solo the same bosses.

It's about 2/3 bosses that have a pitiful damage output IF you don't stand in their attacks and don't fuckup like a moron, and are soloable by quite some people, specially when they are in half HM Raiding gear and partaking into content balanced (at release) for 333 gear roughly, and that has been nerfed by roughly 20% since then...

It's NOT current Heroic content, no more than the Wrath release HC were "current" content during ICC.

---------- Post added 2011-05-27 at 08:21 PM ----------

4.1 my friend, do you not see dks going frost instead of unholy?

That wasn't because of an insane buff to Frost, but because of a slight buff to Frost and a HUGE nerf to Unholy (ie : Frost went from being 5% or so in damage behind UH to roughly the point where Unholy was before, and Unholy went 10/15% under their previous state).

That and the change of Blood Runes made the spec more bursty, aka "more annoying in pvp" instead of just "lol a FreeKill" for everyone.

(on a side note, the Death rune change is stupid, it gave us more burst we didn't need, gave us MORE AoE damage and more bursty one, removed 2 abilities from our bars, and the choice making, all the while with Blizzard pretending they want to tune down aoe... even if they buff it through the roof for pretty much everyone, even those that didn't need it (hunter s *cough*, wars, kitties, etc etc).

[ihyln]

So Blizzard wants us to either quit or reroll mage?

[Huckfealing]

So Blizzard wants us to either quit or reroll mage?

lol apparently! lol

[Windborne Sword]

Did you really think dk's would be untouched by the nerfs lol.

When have we not been rebalanced, reworked or nerfed in a patch? This is getting stupid.

[Vergil]

The pvp nerf was needing, but not that badly. 10% healing from death strike or so would be fine, and this won't just be a pvp nerf, in raids i end up death striking every once and a while to save me and i end up using it a lot in heroics because everyone who can tank has been trying to run zg/za and failing at holding aggro horribly even when i hold off on my dps for more than enough time for the tank to get aggro on bosses and trash. And now i even have less of a chance against any half decent frost mage in pvp Q_Q. Nerf frost mages and it'll make the death strike nerf hurt a little less kthx.

[msdos]

omg, DK tears...



self-healing is out of control and you know it!

[Zheryn]

Still doesnt justify that all the non PvP DK's now have absolutly no means to self heal in PvE...

This just shows how used DKs have become to being able to heal themselfes. You're supposed to have healers healing you in both PvE and PvP.

[Deleted]

Glyph of Dark Succor has been redesigned. Rather than placing a 15% maximum health floor on Death Strike healing while in Frost or Unholy Presence, it causes the next Death Strike within 15 seconds after killing a foe that yields experience or Honor Points to heal for at least 20% of the death knight's maximum health.

It was nice pvp-ing as a dk since day one of woltk but now that time is over. If this goes through, dks are finished for solo pvp. Nothing more than 2nd class arms warriors.

Already leveling a feral druid.

Hahahahaha quit acting like it's ruining your class, it simply makes it just that bit more balanced.

Now, if you wanna talk about ruining a class, look at the Rogue changes. But hey, I guess you think that's just fine. Right?

[Fancyursa]

Now, if you wanna talk about ruining a class, look at the Rogue changes. But hey, I guess you think that's just fine. Right?

Not sure if srs?

[Deleted]

Not sure if srs?

Yeah, because a 2min CD on Cloak + it now shares CD with CR is absolutely needed. Talking about overkill. Yeah, Rogues needed surviability nerfs, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. But this will kill the class' survivability completely. Gawd I'm glad I quit retail, sheesh.

[Tyrusaran]

hmm plenty of talk on EU forums in DK thread:

eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151657226?page=1#10
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151656711
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151656772?page=1
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151657226?page=1#10
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151587063
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151656255?page=1
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151587319
eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2151657063?page=1#14

as to other classes QQ'ing about nerfs, sorry go to the apropriate forums and posts for that, this is about DK and their thing

[Zheryn]

This nerf WILL handicap us at high rateing arenas. Because when your healer is CC'd in 3v3 and you dont have AMS/Icebound and sacrefice is done. You can kiss your ass gbye

So you're saying that you think it's wrong that a team should get a kill if they force all CDs from one person and get their healer in a CC chain? Sorry to introduce you to the arena we non-DKs have been playing, where you actually need teamwork to win, and can't just spamheal yourself each time your healer gets CCed.

[Sharpopiev2]

Is it possible they will make HC scale well with haste? That way it has a base of 1.5 but maybe all the haste they get from UP will drop it down lower, possibly to 1 second if not less?