Protection Paladin avoiddance / crush. cap

[warptwist]

Greetings all mmo-champion forum readers

I'm currently leveling a Protection paladin and was wondering what my caps are for lvl 70 Raiding
my current on her are:
Armor:.............10260
Defense:..........406
dodge:.............9.06%
parry:..............12.84%
block:..............7.84%
armory profile: http://armory.wow-europe.com/charact...rand&n=Sintrix

i know my Defense cap is 490~ but ive been looking at other posts and they mentioned that avoidance needs to be 102.4% or something O.o what's that about? and how is it calculated?
(ive been looking for an Online crushing blow calculater and hoped for a easy mode calculation - but no succes)


these are the items are going to go for at lvl 70 to fastest possible be able to tank trough Karazhan:
Helm:..............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23535 - Helm of the Stalwart Defender
Neck:..............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29173 - Strength of the Untamed
Cloak:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27804 - Devilshark Cape
Shoulders:.........http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27803 - Shoulderguards of the Bold(already completed SL last night and gotted em at lvl 67 )
Chest:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28262 - Jade-Skull Breastplate
Wrists:............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23538 - Bracers of the Green Fortress
Gloves:............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23517 - Felstreel Gloves (gloves)
Belt2:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30034#created-by - Belt of the Guardian
Belt1:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31460 - Sha'tari Vindicator's Waistguard
Leggings:..........http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29184 - Timewarden's Leggings
Boots:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29325 - Flesh Beast's Metal Greaves
Ring1:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28407 - Elementium Band of the Sentry
Ring2:.............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29323 - Andormu's Tear
Trinket1:..........http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30300 - Dabiri's Enigma
Trinket2:..........http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27529 - Figurine of the Colossus
Weapen:............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29185 - Continuum Blade
Shield:............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29176 - Crest of the Sha'tar
Libram:............http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29388 - Libram of Repentance
in case someone is bored and very helpful - will i be crushing immune?

thanks in advance

[Sulika]

You need 490 defence to prevent critical hits from lvl 73 bosses.

You need a combined miss + block + dodge + parry of 102.4% to be uncrushable.

To find your avoidance add your block%, dodge%, parry% and miss%. The first 3 are listed on the tooltips for the relevant stat, miss is calculated as 5% + whatever percentage increase is listed on your defence stat.

Note you need 102.4% with holy shield active, so assuming you have the libram that means you need 62.2% without it active (+35% holy shield +5.2% libram).

[Lazyjoe]

http://elitistjerks.com/f47/t21425-paladin_protection/

A general macro to see if your are uncrushable :

/script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage("Need 102.4 combined avoidance. Currently at:",0.8,0.8,1)
/script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(GetDodgeChance()+GetBlockChance()+GetParryChance()+5+(GetCom batRating(CR_DEFENSE_SKILL)*150/355 + 20)*0.04,1,0.5,0)

You have to use this macro when holy shield is up, of course.

[warptwist]

okay thanks a lot to you both - I'm currently only at 77.5% avoidance with Holy shield up(with Libram effect) - that means i have to get 25% more avoidance!? 25% more dodge parry and block.. that's quite a lot.. oh well.. the cap shouldn't be THAT easy to get anyways should it?

defense tool tip: "increases chance to parry dodge and block by 2.84%" is that 2,84 to all 3 stats, or 2.84 spreaded over the 3 stats?, and is that already included in the shown %'s listed?

[Gwaeni]

Paladins want to stack block rating, you get 1% for every 8 points.

[warptwist]

what do you mean with "stack" block rating?

[Deleted]

Once your uncrushable you do NOT want to stack block rating.

Warptwist you old dog, surely you remember me.

Head over to http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com and read all the stickies

Thats a forum dedicated to paladin tanking, there are some guides there on how to hit uncrushable easy, spell rotations, threat boosts and generally everything you ever needed to know.

[Jathro]

490 defense (as well as the other target numbers) are not caps, they are minimums. Feel free to go above and beyond them.

[warptwist]

oh hi Arthran! good old guild master (nice to see you gotted into Mount hyjall )
ive ofc already checked: http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com
its a imba Forum site

490 defense (as well as the other target numbers) are not caps, they are minimums. Feel free to go above and beyond them.

ye ye, but still going higher is not necessary its better go for other stats when you hit Caps or minimums
for example raw avoidance

[Revak]

I have an alt that is a protection paladin. The 490 defense is fairly easy to get once you start raiding and getting gear. However uncrushable is not so easy. I'm sitting around 100. That being said I've tanked all of Kara, 5/6 ZA, 3 bosses in SSC, Void Reaver, and all heroics.

Work on your uncrushable but don't obsess over it :P

[warptwist]

ok thanks

this is the end of this Post - unless anyone els wants help, I've got all help I've needed thanks all

[Huffy]

There is no defense cap.

[Hiccup]

Some other easier/cheaper options:

Head - Myrmidon's Headdress
Neck - Good
Cloak - Cloak of Eternity With dodge enchant
Shoulders - Spaulders of the Righteous Will last you a long time
Chest - Vindicator's Hauberk
Wrist - Good
Feet - Good, but could go after Boots of the Colossus from Heroic Mana Tombs (First boss)
Hands - Good
Belt - Both Good
Legs - Good
Rings - Both Good
Trinkets - Good
Weapon - Crystalforged Sword
Shield - Good
Libram - Good

[sanent]

Elitist Jerks has probably one of the most comprehensive resources on class development. This article discusses a lot of aspects of the Protection Pally:

http://elitistjerks.com/f47/t21425-paladin_protection/

Don't worry so much about getting the crush ability out of the way, it doesn't play a role until you start tanking level 73 (Boss) mobs, anything lower cannot crush. First order of business is to get yourself a decent HP pool. It's harder on a Paladin than Warrior due 1k lower base HP.

When gearing to rid yourself of crushing blows, here are the rating values that would result in 1% crush reduction (via block or avoidance):

7.9 Block Rating = 1% Block
15 Defense Rating = Approx 0.25% Miss, 0.25% Dodge, 0.25% Parry, 0.25% Block
18.9 Dodge Rating = 1% Dodge
22.4 Parry Rating = 1% Parry
22.7 Agility with Kings = 1% Dodge (otherwise 25 Agility)

Going into Karazhan on my Paladin, I was still crushable, but with the gear there, you can easily get crushing blows out of the way. With a decent HP pool however you can still be quite effective in there.

[Diatribe]

Never want to say "490 Defense is enough...." Personally, I'd say shoot for 525 and all the other tanking stats you can get along the way, but never sacrifice complete effectiveness for any one particular thing.

[Anaema]

Never want to say "490 Defense is enough...." Personally, I'd say shoot for 525 and all the other tanking stats you can get along the way, but never sacrifice complete effectiveness for any one particular thing.

525 is a bit high imo. Aporx. 500 def should be a good number. You can start using dps trinkets for aggro then too.

[WildEther]

525 is a bit high imo. Aporx. 500 def should be a good number. You can start using dps trinkets for aggro then too.

depends on what gear you have.

I have a spl dmg shield and one trinket, with a stam trinketw/holy dmg on the other one and i sit at 515 def to keep my 102.4% w/holy shield up.

[Stenhord]

In the beginning with blue gear its best to go for warrior tank items, you need the extra avoidance, hp and defense those got. Mana wont be an issue as you will take a lot of dmg
Get 490 defense asap and never go below it again. After that you can try go for uncrushability. Its not very hard to reach but takes some time.

Karazhan has some nice items like gloves+neck from Maiden, chest+shield from Nightbane, T4 head, bracers from attumen etc. There are plenty of good badge rewards like the cloak, warrior legs with 73stam etc. When you start getting these you will be uncrushable in no time.

Saw you got blacksmithing so try get hands on the recipe for Boots of the Protector, these are good upto BT/Hyjal, and getting the SSC crafted belt done shouldnt be a problem now that you can buy nether vortexes for badges or pretty cheap from AH.

[sanent]

525 is a bit high imo. Aporx. 500 def should be a good number. You can start using dps trinkets for aggro then too.

I would disagree simply because defense is the next cheapest stat to pad your uncrushability:

7.9 Block Rating = 1% Block
15 Defense Rating = Approx 0.25% Miss, 0.25% Dodge, 0.25% Parry, 0.25% Block
18.9 Dodge Rating = 1% Dodge
22.4 Parry Rating = 1% Parry
22.7 Agility with Kings = 1% Dodge (otherwise 25 Agility)

There's no issues with stacking defense, except that items usually will have dodge/parry/block rather than stupid high amounts of defense on them.

Now if you were working on a bear tank, defense does not make sense past 490 to remove crits as you don't benefit from block/parry.

[Fearlys]

This is for a starting Pally freshly dining 70.

How to get 11.5K HP Pre-Kara

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now before i go into this there are few things everyone should know about paladins (and all these can be looked up on the armory if you care to do a little research and know ANYTHING about math.

These are:

Pally base HP is 3377
When you add in stam (including the base Stam) your HP gained are (Stam*10)-180

Therefore your total HP is (stam*10)-3197+HPGAINED ((this last bit is enchants that are just HP) )

For avoidance (now note i am adding block here into avoidance even tho it is technically mitigation - the reason i am doing this is because block counts towards your total avoidance goal of 102.4%)

So the avoidance equations are:

Def: [(rating/2.4)+20]/25*4 = total avoidance from def

Parry: rating/35.1 + base (usually 5 or 10%) = parry percentage

Dodge: rating/18.9 + base (this is usually 5% but may be slightly different) = dodge percentage

Block: rating/7.9 + base (Usually 5%) = block percentage

Miss: base miss of 5% + [(def over 350)-(350)]*.04

Now we're not going to subtract anything from these because we're already calculating it in with our goal being 102.4%

Ok now that all that fun stuff is out of the way... lets get to the gear. (skip to the end if all you want is the summary of stats) ::

Head: [Helm of Burning Righteousness]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28285
Enchant: [Glyph of the Defender]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29186

Neck: [Strength of the Untamed]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29173

Shoulder: [Spaulders of the Righteous]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27739
Enchant: [Greater Inscription of the Knight]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28911

Back: [Devilshark Cape]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27804
Enchant: [Formula: Enchant Cloak - Dodge]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=25086

Chest: [Jade-Skull Breastplate]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28262
Enchant: [Enchant Chest - Exceptional Health]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=27957

Wrist: [Bracers of the Green Fortress]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23538
Enchant: [Formula: Enchant Bracer - Major Defense]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=27906

Hands: [Felsteel Gloves]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23517
Enchant: [Formula: Enchant Gloves - Superior Agility]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=25080
(Note: this enchant can be switched for the major Spellpower one if you need the threat gen)

Waist: [Girdle of the Immovable]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27672

Legs: [Timewarden's Leggings]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29184
Enchant: [Clefthide Leg Armor]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29534

Feet: [Boots of the Colossus]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27813
Enchant: [Elixir of Minor Fortitude]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=27950

Ring 1: [Protector's Mark of the Redemption]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31078

Ring 2: [Elementium Band of the Sentry]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28407

Trinket 1: [Adamantine Figurine]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27891

Trinket 2: [Figurine of the Colossus]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27529

Weapon: [Continuum Blade]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29185
Enchant: [Formula: Enchant Weapon - Major Spellpower]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=27975

Shield: [Crest of the Sha'tar]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29176
Enchant: [Formula: Enchant Shield - Lesser Block]
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=27946

Libram: [Libram of Repentance]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29388

Gems: [Solid Star of Elune]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=24033

Ok now for the summary of all those stats.

Sta: 467 (from gear) + 123 (base for a BE) + 192 (16 gem slots all filled with +12sta gems) = 782 * 1.06(the talent any decent protadin will have) == 828.92 stam

Def: 345 Rating: [(345/2.4)+20]/25*4 = 26.2 avoidance from Def (block/dodge/parry/miss)

Block: 82 Rating: 82/7.9 = 10.4 Avoidance

Dodge: 118 Rating: 118/18.9 = 6.24 Avoidance

Parry: 0 = 0

SO:

That stam == 11,606 Hp
Total Block = 21.95
Total Dodge = 17.79
Total Parry = 16.55
Total miss = 11.55
Block From HS = 35%

All this together makes :

HP = 11606
Avoidance = 102.8%

So as i said 11.5k HP and Uncrushable.

Oh and if you don't want to go to heroics for the belt or boots... you can replace them with:

[Flesh Beast's Metal Greaves]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29325

And

[Sha'tari Vindicator's Waistguard]
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31460

Now this will drop you down about 50 sta or 530 Hp's But personally i think 11k and uncrushable is fine if you don't want to deal with the heroics before Kara.

I'm @ 15k hp unbuffed(no blessings) I believ i'm @ like 14-15k armor and I'm uncrushable. Only bad thing is I need to get my +spell dmg up only @ 233.