What can keep players subscribed...longer?

[NtflxnChill]

Nothing at this point, that ship has sailed long ago and it isn't going to get any better, probably sitting at under 1M subs in WEST by now.

[MasterHamster]

Imagine if your iLvl simply couldnt jump by 20+ in one day

[Zenfoldor]

Fix class design(gameplay), give us long term goals and tier gear back(reward structure).

Simple fix. It can be done any of 1000 different ways, and which way they pick to do this is not as important as you might think. Doing it is.

The thing is, it feels that gameplay and reward structure was not designed around fun, it was designed around something we don't completely understand. Perhaps they want to port WoW to the PS5 next gen, or something? Perhaps internal algorithms said that this is the best way to design it even if it doesn't appear fun, for maximum engagement. Whatever it is, these problems are huge. Who plays an unrewarding game with bad gameplay for 2 years straight?

Note that these are the two things that Legion did right. Lots of people here hated Legion, but filter out the noise. How did the community as a whole feel about Legion and how do they feel about BFA? Think about it. What changed? <hint, bolded>

[Misuteri]

Completionists are the “whales” of WoW.

They almost never unsubscribe, they change factions, they use the cash store.

Yes, they likely have OCD to some degree. They want all the mounts, all the transmogs, all the recipes for their professions and all of the achievements and titles.

They may not be into PVP for those titles/achievements but they likely will get seasonal RBG mounts just because.

Short of developing greater rewards for players like this you’re not going to get casuals to say subbed for 10 months of the year when they think they have “finished” an expansion in 3. They’re not the people that are going to go oooh and ahhh over buying a year/expansion extra pet, mount or pre-purchase a new title unrelated to WoW to get such things.

Remember the Hearthstone mount?

[Flower Milk]

I'd gladly play again if they just stop time gating flight, and you can do it on launch or 6 months after launch at most.

[Eucep]

I think important step is making sure that content is not rushed through to easily. I just cannot fathom that the highest tier raid stuff got steamrolled in such a short time. So yeah, for me a big needed change feels, less loot, in particular what gives massive boosts. The tbc model was pretty descent for me.

[rohoz]

I think important step is making sure that content is not rushed through to easily. I just cannot fathom that the highest tier raid stuff got steamrolled in such a short time. So yeah, for me a big needed change feels, less loot, in particular what gives massive boosts. The tbc model was pretty descent for me.

You understand that they put hundreds of millions of gold into preparation plus 7 days of 12 hour raids to do that, right?
No? Okay.

[Yunaqt]

Kill Jaina and steal her mount

[quijote3000]

higher tier things to do, I guess.

[trapmaster]

Stupidity is what keeping players subbed... right guys? I rather play osrs over bfa cuz bfa has it limit right there while osrs you have so much goddamn things to do. I'll probably return on next xpac or maybe not cuz the path blizzard are going doesn't look really good.

[Eucep]

You understand that they put hundreds of millions of gold into preparation plus 7 days of 12 hour raids to do that, right?
No? Okay.

Yes I do. Fact they could do that is where there is something wrong to start with. How long did it take in earlier expansions to get final bosses on highest difficulties down?

These lightning defeats, gives the feeling that the material is not even worth attempting.

Gear is to easy to get in major stepups. The statsquish has been useless again.

And it gives me the feeling that making the game ever again feel like it has long term goals... unlikely.

[rohoz]

Yes I do. Fact they could do that is where there is something wrong to start with. How long did it take in earlier expansions to get final bosses on highest difficulties down?

These lightning defeats, gives the feeling that the material is not even worth attempting.

Gear is to easy to get in major stepups. The statsquish has been useless again.

And it gives me the feeling that making the game ever again feel like it has long term goals... unlikely.

how many raid weeks with mediocre people is 81* hours for plebs?

If you're looking for excuses sir, w/e.
But I don't think you understand and you're weaponizing that ignorance

[Eleccybubb]

Unless they go back and realise what made them great and stop making a game for investors and one for players then nothing sadly.

Especially when the majority of players are leaving WoW and finding more enjoyment in games like ESO and FF14.

Hell I've had people tell me Neverwinter is more fun right now. And that's F2P with P2W/P2A elements.

[Eucep]

how many raid weeks with mediocre people is 81* hours for plebs?

It does not matter how much worse most are, even the 'worse' still beat it all solid in record times. Oh I am sure there are still those who take months, but it's not even remotely the norm anymore.

So you are left with a growing group of people who go 'what's next to devour?'.

How many are already like, done, with Atal'Dazor raid and waiting for 8.2 raid? This just keeps on getting worse every expansion.

[Sharby]

Just remove the hard-cap on progression (excluding lockouts ofc.)

Even if I can only get tiny amounts of progress towards something such as titan-residum or rep from spamming M+/Open world quests I'd enjoy playing more. The fact that we're only allotted a set amount of stuff a day/week is lame.

[rohoz]

It does not matter how much worse most are, even the 'worse' still beat it all solid in record times. Oh I am sure there are still those who take months, but it's not even remotely the norm anymore.

So you are left with a growing group of people who go 'what's next to devour?'.

How many are already like, done, with Atal'Dazor raid and waiting for 8.2 raid? This just keeps on getting worse every expansion.

Are you one of them? Noone here is one of them.

Are you one of those people that co-opt the concerns of the wealthy thinking that bc you subscribe to them on social media, that their problems are your problems? Like, did you do jaina M?

190 guilds have killed jaina so far. That's nowhere near the "worst" of anything, when there are hundreds of thousands of guilds.

[dope_danny]

I've subbed to WoW for like a month at the start and the end of the last few expansions for a simple reason: what am i doing outside of the gear treadmill?

Conversely i've been subbed without a break from FFXIV for half a decade now because there isn't a day i log in that i do everything i want to do. None of it involves chasing the purple dragon.

Time was that guy in full molten core gear was impressive because of what he did to get it and that sense of prestige. Now gear just exists as a stepping stone to increase your number boner. No matter who you are nobody gives a shit about your gear since its probably transmogged anyway. Every item is a stat stick and in a game where everything outside the instance scales the open world element seems rather pointless when the quests are all done with and that sucks.

[Alex86el]

- Offer the player a "goal".
- Have Goal require 100x "work".
- But allow him to put in only 1x Work per day.
- Player will have to keep sub and login every day, or fall behind.
- Profit? Yes. Fun? No.

[yamix]

Focus on things that aren't just higher item level gear. Gear is no longer a very interesting carrot. Add in more content that isn't "queue for instance, repeat".

[rohoz]

Focus on things that aren't just higher item level gear. Gear is no longer a very interesting carrot. Add in more content that isn't "queue for instance, repeat".

You mean like doing keys with friends?
The less things you use group finder for, generally the more fun you have.