Avengers: Endgame (2019)

[roboscorcher]

I loved said scene. At the same time, I groaned that the incels were going to lose their minds over it.

To be honest, the moment felt hamfisted when I first saw it. Then I remembered all the incels make hundreds of videos bashing Capt Marvel, and I'm happy this scene exists.

[PACOX]

Who's to say they could't go back in their own timeline and retrieve Black Widow from before she died to get the Soul Stone?

That's not how time travel works in MCU. You can't go back to your timeline. You can't revisit your own timeline. You can go to a parallel identical timeline though, one where a copy of you exists. If they brought that other Black Widow she'd only have the same memories of the dead Black Widow up till ~Avengers 2 (the timelines split sometime around GotG 1). If a person is there memories then she would be missing a lot of them.

[MrLachyG]

I loved said scene. At the same time, I groaned that the incels were going to lose their minds over it.

I actually think that is why they put it in. to give a giant middle finger to those people

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Loved it. It was a good ending to the Infinity Saga, but it wasn't perfect.

My only real complaint though is Steve going back in time to live with Peggy since I feel it invalidates Peggy's journey and does more harm than good to both their characters, but I choose to believe that instead of somehow going back in the main timeline he just lived that happy life in an alternate timeline and continued to help the world by helping Peggy with SHIELD instead of sitting back in retirement watching terrible things happen "because they needed to" instead of helping prevent them. Then when Peggy died in that timeline and things were in order, he came back to the main timeline to see his original friends and pass the mantle on to Sam. It opens up its own problems but to me it's much more satisfying than time traveling Steve being Peggy's husband in the main timeline all along.

but when he returned the space stone and stayed with Peggy that was still in the main timeline. i don't think that was an alternate one. and yeah it would mean that Steve was Peggy's husband the entire time, but if there was anyone who could keep a secret it was Peggy.

[seleri]

but when he returned the space stone and stayed with Peggy that was still in the main timeline. i don't think that was an alternate one. and yeah it would mean that Steve was Peggy's husband the entire time, but if there was anyone who could keep a secret it was Peggy.

I'm well aware of what they most likely intended but I think it's horrible for both characters which is why I said I choose to believe otherwise.

[Polybius]

Maybe Cap used the Time Stone? Rules were established but they only had the Quantum Realm at their disposal.

[Polybius]

Where did he learn the litany of spells...

He'd have to return it to the Ancient One. And we don't know what interactions he had in those past timelines.

[MrLachyG]

Where did he learn the litany of spells...

This whole alternate universe bs is just that. If it were true returning the stones wouldn’t really matter. Hell, it would prevent the snap in those universes.

no but that was the point of the conversation between the Ancient One and Bruce. by returning the stones to their original timeline the alternate timelines never happened, ceasing to exist.

[Polybius]

Yeah, she’d totally send him back to live with Peggy.

It's all fair game if we don't know what happened. Tbh I was sorely disappointed in their use of time travel but they refer to the timelines as realities.

For all we know they're in a new reality.

edit: nevermind on the gap, the writers better have a good explanation

[D3cadent]

You made this up yourself to fix a plot-hole, but for it to work properly he had to have appeared on the pad not on the bench

Funny, considering my friends and I all interpreted Cap's return in the exact same way that poster did.

i.e. "Our Cap" goes back in time with the stones + Mjol, returns them to when/where they were taken, then goes back to a time where his younger self (i'll call him CapB) is on ice. Whilst there, he stays and spends, in essence, an entire lifetime with Peggy, aging in the process whilst CapB remains frozen. He remains hidden, and Peggy silent as to his presence, so as not to drastically alter CapB's timeline.

After Peggy dies, "Our Cap" comes back to the Endgame movie timeline, post thanos' defeat. He does this in the exact same way all the other characters returned to this timeline pre-thanos' defeat except now "Our Cap" has aged considerably because he didn't just spend a few hours gathering the stones like everyone else did earlier on, he spent a lifetime with Peggy.

Doesn't break any rules established in the movie at all. In fact it makes hardly any difference to that particular branch of the multiverse (well established in the movie btw). To be honest, the biggest effect our avengers had on the branches they returned to was the branch of time where loki makes off with the Tesseract. Our avengers did nothing as far as I can recall to correct that.

ThanosB who fought our avengers at the end of Endgame fucked over his own timeline by coming here with GamoraB and NebulaB and getting himself and NebulaB killed and losing GamoraB

Anyway, Cap's story at the end seemed pretty straight forward to us.

[PACOX]

Where did he learn the litany of spells...

This whole alternate universe bs is just that. If it were true returning the stones wouldn’t really matter. Hell, it would prevent the snap in those universes.

Technically they prevented the snap in one timeline and reversed it in theirs. They can only be responsible for their timeline and returning the borrowed stones.

[Polybius]

Then they weren’t traveling to alternate timelines and dusting Thanos and the rest fucks everything up creating a paradox.

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No, it doesn’t. You need to check the MCU timeline again, it doesn’t follow the years movies were released.

Yes they do. Marvel has an official book titled The First 10 Years. You can see the timeline there. Either way we'll have it confirmed once they reveal the year in Peter Parker's passport as it was edited out for the trailer.

[MrLachyG]

Then they weren’t traveling to alternate timelines and dusting Thanos and the rest fucks everything up creating a paradox.

the alternate timelines were erased when the stones were brought back. did you not watch the conversation between the Ancient One and Bruce? because that explained it all

[D3cadent]

The way they fixed it leaves SO many holes. Wife was snapped and you moved on found a new wife had a kid? Well here's your old wife back and to her, its been 5 minutes.
You've been gone 5 years, your house is occupied by new people and all your finances are fucked, welcome back.
5 years of social decline due to infrastructure being decimated because of brain drain? Ehh, lets just dump 3.5 billion people back into the just starting to recover works.
But hey, Tony has a daughter so lets not fuck around with her, lol.

This isn't really a plot-hole... It's just something they can't explore in a 3hour film already over-stuffed. It is very interesting food for thought though.

[Polybius]

https://www.mpaa.org/2018/11/the-off...marvel-movies/

Based on your source you are wrong. The 8 years was retconned in said book.

Right, and earlier I was referring to Homecoming and how it takes place in its release year despite the opening card with "8 years later".

[Charge me Doctor]

Shes actually used pretty sparely in the film.

But theres one part in the battle that is just eye rolling.

Oh yeah, all that thing about
major crisis on earth and she pops up on telecom and says, basically, that "there are thousands of "earth" with problems like this" - great way to invalidate whole fucking plot, isn't it?

And the very last battle, when she just swooped through a battlecruiser, then took a punch from Thanos with the glove like it's nothing, while being thrown around liek a ragdol before he even equipped the glove. Fucking stupid.

[MrLachyG]

Funny, considering my friends and I all interpreted Cap's return in the exact same way that poster did.

i.e. "Our Cap" goes back in time with the stones + Mjol, returns them to when/where they were taken, then goes back to a time where his younger self (i'll call him CapB) is on ice. Whilst there, he stays and spends, in essence, an entire lifetime with Peggy, aging in the process whilst CapB remains frozen. He remains hidden, and Peggy silent as to his presence, so as not to drastically alter CapB's timeline.

After Peggy dies, "Our Cap" comes back to the Endgame movie timeline, post thanos' defeat. He does this in the exact same way all the other characters returned to this timeline pre-thanos' defeat except now "Our Cap" has aged considerably because he didn't just spend a few hours gathering the stones like everyone else did earlier on, he spent a lifetime with Peggy.

Doesn't break any rules established in the movie at all. In fact it makes hardly any difference to that particular branch of the multiverse (well established in the movie btw). To be honest, the biggest effect our avengers had on the branches they returned to was the branch of time where loki makes off with the Tesseract. Our avengers did nothing as far as I can recall to correct that.

ThanosB who fought our avengers at the end of Endgame fucked over his own timeline by coming here with GamoraB and NebulaB and getting himself and NebulaB killed and losing GamoraB

Anyway, Cap's story at the end seemed pretty straight forward to us.

I always interpreted the conversation between the Ancient One and Bruce as once they returned the stones everything that had happened in the alternate timeline they created was erased. which would include Loki disappearing.

[Polybius]

The claim I responded to was that homecoming took place post snap. That’s clearly not true...

Which is why I edited that part out. There are continuity errors and it's best to leave it at that.

[Ielenia]

This is my biggest gripe with the movie:

After Tony Stark is brought back to Earth, the group starts talking about Thanos and where he is. Nobody knows where he is, but then Nebula says he knows where he is. "The Garden." Great, but no one knows where this "garden" is. Moments later, Rocket explains how, two days ago, the sensors picked up the stones being used again on another planet.

Two days ago.

They've known Thanos' locations for TWO DAYS, already! How could they say they did NOT know where he was!?

Did no one proof-read that part of the script?

[MrLachyG]

Then Tony should be alive as the alternate timeline where his forces travelled to the future was erased. it’s almost like the writing was shit for that stuff...

not quite, Thanos's forces forced their way into the main timeline. and yes, were erased. but when the power stone was returned that alternate timeline was erased and the Guardians of the Galaxy movie happened as usual.

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This is my biggest gripe with the movie:

After Tony Stark is brought back to Earth, the group starts talking about Thanos and where he is. Nobody knows where he is, but then Nebula says he knows where he is. "The Garden." Great, but no one knows where this "garden" is. Moments later, Rocket explains how, two days ago, the sensors picked up the stones being used again on another planet.

Two days ago.

They've known Thanos' locations for TWO DAYS, already! How could they say they did NOT know where he was!?

Did no one proof-read that part of the script?

maybe they didn't know what they were looking for? they were probably scouring the universe but because they didn't know the location of his 'Garden' they couldn't tell he was there. as for the sensors picking it up, maybe it took time for them to relay that information back to them

[D3cadent]

This is my biggest gripe with the movie:

After Tony Stark is brought back to Earth, the group starts talking about Thanos and where he is. Nobody knows where he is, but then Nebula says he knows where he is. "The Garden." Great, but no one knows where this "garden" is. Moments later, Rocket explains how, two days ago, the sensors picked up the stones being used again on another planet.

Two days ago.

They've known Thanos' locations for TWO DAYS, already! How could they say they did NOT know where he was!?

Did no one proof-read that part of the script?

I thought this was silly too. But overall a minor gripe for me personally.