Races and Classes getting advantages in 8.3

[Moggers1990]

Mythic raiding is ruining the game. They can't express themselves creatively in design (whether it's story, class, or mechanics) because it might negatively affect raiding. My class is getting hit with nerf after nerf despite being average in most content because mythic raiders like to min max. So yes, I think it would be beneficial to focus on PvP, RP, mythic+, literally anything other than raiding, most people don't do.


Something that would be RP related would be like cool questlines or toys like Reivur said. What I'm talking about is mostly gameplay.

Nice bullshit you're spouting out. Mythic raiding is what's keeping the game going, this includes "casual" guilds still on progression. The top "min maxers" probably don't even cover 30% of Mythic Raiders and they barely effect you.
You claim your class is getting "nerfs after nerfs" because of these Mythic raiders, which is also bullshit. If something is doing way too much damage, it's been nerfed (everything nerfed recently has needed it, and there's not even been many nerfs) not just because of Mythic raiding but because of Heroic and M+. Also sounds to me that you don't exactly get much out of your class to begin with so a few nerfs aren't going to be crippling you.

Also try and look at it from the other side. You enjoy role playing, which is just alien to me. I enjoy Mythic raiding and getting the most out of my characters, which seems to be alien to you.
My Mythic raiding apparently ruins your enjoyment of roleplaying, the lore and your class (99% sure raiding is what's pushing class mechanics to be better/improved but oh well). Now your role playing and lore is ruining my enjoyment of the game because i'm forced to do shitty quest lines, scenarios and have annoying pets and toys all over the place.

Not a single area of the game ruins another. Sure, they could focus more on one thing and ignore others, but why should they focus on what you and ruin the game for someone else?

[Schizoide]

Little perks for shadow priests, forsaken, and void elves would make sense and be cool. Trick is to make them cool but not powerful enough that anyone would switch race or class, even at the highest levels of mythic progression. Perhaps give them 5 baseline corruption resistance but only outside of raids and mythic+, and a lowered aggro range in the 8.3 small group content.

[[Apok]]

Mythic raiding is ruining the game. They can't express themselves creatively in design (whether it's story, class, or mechanics) because it might negatively affect raiding.

Less to do with raiding and more to do with balance in general, or they would have left other things in the game such as undead players being able to be shackled and taking more damage from holy abilities.

[Mister Cheese]

What I'm proposing is currently not in the game, and yet judging by EP and any key over 15+ it's bring the class/race, not the player.

Bring the player will never be a thing. It's time to move past this outdated concept.

That is already being done at the highest level of play. What you are suggesting would make it even worse. And would only be seen as a way for Blizzard to make money off character race changes/boosts.

[Elkfingers]

Mythic raiding is ruining the game. They can't express themselves creatively in design (whether it's story, class, or mechanics) because it might negatively affect raiding. My class is getting hit with nerf after nerf despite being average in most content because mythic raiders like to min max. So yes, I think it would be beneficial to focus on PvP, RP, mythic+, literally anything other than raiding, most people don't do.

Because there's no mix-maxing involved at all in PvP or M+, right? It's not a behaviour that's driven by content. It's driven by better access to data and analytical tools.

Mythic raiding isn't ruining the game at all, you're being dramatic. Raiding has always been part of this game, and people have min-maxed since they had the ability to do so. All that's changed is that two lower tiers of difficulty have been added to cater to people who don't have the time or ability to complete the content as it was originally intended.

The problem isn't that things are balanced around raiders. Ther only way to establish a baseline is to look at players who are performing maximally, so no matter what the game will always be balanced around mix-maxing.

[Marrilaife]

My class is getting hit with nerf after nerf despite being average in most content because mythic raiders like to min max.

Tbh no idea which class you're playing but all the nerfs lined up for 8.3 are goddamn well deserved, and some of the OP specs deserve even more. Anyway how does it affect you how the class performs if you're a roleplayer anyway? Every class is playable in casual content. Balancing passes are important to min maxers and irrelevant to casuals, so they should happen since they help one group and don't affect the other. The only people harmed by balancing passes are riders of fotm bandwagon because their spec will no longer be broken op and delete people in pvp or rock the meters for little effort.

Some specs could use some bigger reworks than numerical buffs / nerfs, for example disc priests could use some tweaks how atonement works so it doesn't work exponentially better the more people you have in the group and you can abuse rapture / evangelism for it. If atonement had diminishing returns then it could be tuned to be actually good in 5 man but not broken op in a 20 man raid.

What would be cool in the RPG aspect would be that there are easter eggs, references and maybe even lines or things to those particular players. Maybe making offers of power to turn in their friends, maybe spell/racial interactions that unlock a toy.

Pretty much. I liked all the small interactions in Legion you were getting due to your class or artifact. The class specific toys. In BFA we got some races heritage armour, but only 4 out of original 13 (will go up to 6 in 8.3 but still half of them are missing).

I'm definitely not missing mechanics like bosses immune to fire damage or poison cuz "muh immersion". Nothing breaks immersion more than having to reroll or race change, you stop treating characters as your avatar and start treating it like horses in your stable or pawns on the board, akin to heroes in MOBA or Overwatch.

Most important in an RPG is so you can live your fantasy of whatever type of hero you picked, as long as you build it well (every RPG has some stats, talents, perks, gear slots, etc. you're meant to synergize to make the build the best it can be). For every person that demands their race / class "be special" for "reasons" there would be 10 other players shafted by that disparity of power. And if your class doesn't have any special flavour, like rogue or hunter, you wouldn't even hope that "your turn will come" to have some cool perks.

[Schattenlied]

Considering they've stated how undead are resistant to old god void stuff.

Got a source for that? I'm pretty sure they never said anything of the sort.

The only Undead to my knowledge that were shown to have any resistance to the Old Gods corruption were specifically those under control of the Lich King, mindless undead who had already been dominated by another powerful force... The Old Gods corrupt by playing with people's minds, they can't corrupt something that already has no free will... Undead with free will have never been shown or said to be resistant to void/old gods corruption.

[jellmoo]

You just said it. They should get advantages in certain content because that's the way they're written in lore.

But this already exists in game. Void Elves and Forsaken both have resistance to Shadow damage.

[Mirishka]

What I'm proposing is currently not in the game

It isn't currently in the game because its a stupid-ass idea.

[rrayy]

It's an mmoRPG.

Maybe they should stop catering to fotm raiders and focus on a different aspect of the game. I've brought this up before but WoW is more than mythic raiders.

Wow is a lot more than just you. Bascially all this thread is you wanting Blizzard to solely cater to you.

[[Apok]]

Wow is a lot more than just you. Bascially all this thread is you wanting Blizzard to solely cater to you.

Just have a look at his posting history, it seems that whenever there's something that he doesn't agree with it's because of elitists or mythic raiders.

This is a guy who like titanforging and thinks that the removal of it is down to "elitists", no it was removed because the majority didn't like the rng factor behind it. it had nothing to do with people being obsessed with the gear other people are wearing it's just a silly system.

My class is getting hit with nerf after nerf despite being average in most content because mythic raiders like to min max.

You play a priest, the latest round of nerfs was needed, especially considering the way priests scale compared to other classes, they were already strong and with stronger gear coming in 8.3 they would have been even further ahead.

[reploid]

No, obviously no.

Blizz moved away from those kind of class/race-specific advantages a long time ago

yeah, sadly they did. I wish they hadn't, its such a cool lil nod to particularities,adds flavor and immersion, ask neverwinter nights.

[united]

Just have a look at his posting history, it seems that whenever there's something that he doesn't agree with it's because of elitists or mythic raiders.

This is a guy who like titanforging and thinks that the removal of it is down to "elitists", no it was removed because the majority didn't like the rng factor behind it


You play a priest, the latest round of nerfs was needed, especially considering the way priests scale compared to other classes, they were already strong and with stronger gear coming in 8.3 they would have been even further ahead.

Lol, keep pretending like the majority of complaints about titanforging weren’t made by people that couldn’t dare to see casuals with a single tf piece of equipment better than theirs.

- - - Updated - - -

Got a source for that? I'm pretty sure they never said anything of the sort.

The only Undead to my knowledge that were shown to have any resistance to the Old Gods corruption were specifically those under control of the Lich King, mindless undead who had already been dominated by another powerful force... The Old Gods corrupt by playing with people's minds, they can't corrupt something that already has no free will... Undead with free will have never been shown or said to be resistant to void/old gods corruption.

The void is afraid of Sylvanas. You can look in that three sisters comic or whatever

[[Apok]]

Lol, keep pretending like the majority of complaints about titanforging weren’t made by people that couldn’t dare to see casuals with a single tf piece of equipment better than theirs.

I'm a "casual" as are most of the people i play with associate with, none of them disliked it because they didn't like people getting higher ilvl gear than they did. Simply because titanforging was a poor rng shitfest

In some ways it kills the progression part of the rpg for some people, most people who continue to raid after clearing said raid isn't to make themselves feel good for having higher gear, simply so they can progress their character towards greater challenges in higher difficulties or following content.

Wheres the merit in a system that isn't reliable but can invalidate certain aspects of that?

What's your next argument? "i pay the same sub, i should get the same as them" ?

The void is afraid of Sylvanas. You can look in that three sisters comic or whatever

That's open to interpretation, given the events were about to witness with shadowlands, it points more towards they are afraid what she has planned is a counter to their own endgame.

Fear of an individual and fear of what the might accomplish are two different things.

[united]

I'm a "casual" as are most of the people i play with associate with, none of them disliked it because they didn't like people getting higher ilvl gear than they did.

Simply that titanforging was a poor rng shitfest, in some ways it kills the progression part of the rpg for some people, most people who continue to raid after clearing said raid isn't to make themselves feel good for having higher gear, simply so they can progress their character towards greater challenges in higher difficulties or following content.

Wheres the merit in a system that isn't reliable but can invalidate certain aspects of that?

What's your next argument? "i pay the same sub, i should get the same as them" ?

I could probably buy the titanforging kills progression argument if gear actually titanforged often enough to truly ruin it. Also, weapons can't titanforge, so one of the biggest parts of gear progression isn't affected. A much better argument against rng elements in game would be sockets (which they're kinda addressing in 8.3) and lack of pvp vendors.

[Ielenia]

It's an mmoRPG.

Maybe they should stop catering to fotm raiders and focus on a different aspect of the game. I've brought this up before but WoW is more than mythic raiders.

You do realize that the removal of race/class bonuses like you mentioned was done for the casuals so they can play any race/class combo they want instead of feeling "required" to pick a specific race/class combo?

[[Apok]]

I could probably buy the titanforging kills progression argument if gear actually titanforged often enough to truly ruin it. Also, weapons can't titanforge, so one of the biggest parts of gear progression isn't affected. A much better argument against rng elements in game would be sockets (which they're kinda addressing in 8.3) and lack of pvp vendors.

Pvp Shouldn't have vendors or seperate gear, everyone should be placed at a the same level stat-wise akin to a template, with no scaling of gear.

With regards to titanforging, again you're rejecting other peoples point of view because you like titanforging because it allows you to get gear that otherwise you wouldn't have access to. weapons can Warforge and Warforging is part of titanforging system, the whole system should be removed.

[united]

With regards to titanforging, again you're rejecting other peoples point of view because you like titanforging because it allows you to get gear that otherwise you wouldn't have access to. weapons can Warforge and Warforging is part of titanforging system, the whole system should be removed.

Raiding isn't the only way to get geared.

[[Apok]]

Raiding isn't the only way to get geared.

Never did i say it was

[derpkitteh]

i wish.

it's so retarded that my velf mage wouldn't be trying to study some of this old god shit she's gonna be cleaning up.