Does anyone else feel embarrassed that the Dracthyr lore creates a huge plot hole?

[Count Zero]

New lore that expands on old lore does not automatically equate to a retcon.

It probably releases Q1 or Q2 2023. Wait for the actual lore before you start making these claims.

[Verdugo]

Wait for the actual lore before you start making these claims.

Oh I waited, and what I got is "conclusion to the 20 year old story arc".

[darkoms]

There's one problem.... Nefarian didn't make the Drak'thyr, it was actually Neltharion.. aka Deathwing.

"Neltharion, later known as Deathwing, created the ideal solider in the Dracthyr—a race with both a humanoid and draconic form that brandish the power of all five dragonflights." - The actual press kit and Blue Post from the trailer.

- - - Updated - - -



They said in an interview that it's in the North East... My guess is probably between Northrend and Quel'Danas.. or even a little further behind Quel'Danas.

Try...re-read...my...post....

[defibrillator]

There's one problem.... Nefarian didn't make the Drak'thyr, it was actually Neltharion.. aka Deathwing.

"Neltharion, later known as Deathwing, created the ideal solider in the Dracthyr—a race with both a humanoid and draconic form that brandish the power of all five dragonflights."

You need to practice your reading more. That's exactly what he told you and that's exactly what the plot hole is. Nefarian was the first to manage to utilize all 5 dragonflight powers in one being, and no it wasn't a dragon either as Aucald falsely pointed out. It was in Chromaggus.

- - - Updated - - -

New lore that expands on old lore does not automatically equate to a retcon.

It probably releases Q1 or Q2 2023. Wait for the actual lore before you start making these claims.

If it contradicts the original lore it is automatically a retcon regardless of the "reasons" (read: excuses) given.

[Lady Atia]

Not an invalid point, but I guess there's possible outs.

Maybe the dracthyr were exactly WHY Deathwing tried to create chromatic dragons - he successfully did it before with the dracthyr, but they're fairly small and nowhere near as powerful or durable as actual dragons. So he tried to recreate his previous success on a different scale, but it turned out that there's problems if you scale things up.

Haha "scale".

[OwenBurton]

So how is this any different from the mountain of retcons and plotholes that already exist and that have yet to come?

It's not. I mean...I don't automatically like or dislike this new expansion, I've read a bit about it on Wowhead, and while surely original and creative, a part of me also feels that this doesn't seem exactly fitting into the previous Warcraft dragonflight lore either. I mean, why did the Sundering, the Cataclysm, the four wars, and everything else not affect these new characters? Why did no one else even mention or know about them beforehand, and why did Deathwing not use them against his enemies when he had the chance to do so? And does this mean that the dragons are NOT going to become extinct, and are getting new Aspects?

Sure, it's better by far than Shadowlands perhaps, but that is not saying very much honestly. I also was reminded that Steve is in charge of this new expansion, according to Wowhead, and therefore, I am to say the least tempering my enthusiasm and hopes for the moment.

[Asrialol]

Anyone who expected anything but retcons born of willful ignorance from Danuser and team has clearly had his head in the sand for years.

Danuser mentioned in the first response? Oh my, are we on a roll today!

On topic: No, I don't feel embarrassed. That would be really fucking weird.

Off topic: Why are retcons of trash lore in the past a bad thing?

[Syegfryed]

nefarian: Build perfect warriors/soldiers wielding the power of the 5 dragonflights 10.000 years ago, that can turn into blood elves and humans, who didn't even exist in those time.
Also Nefarian: Ditch then in the dragon isles forever and start creating "inferior" drakonids and dragonspawn, failing in creating anything that wields the power of those 5 dragonflights

SUUUUURE, he didn't even though how he could use those "perfect weapons" in his quest, he just abandon then.

I rly can't believe they come up with something so stupid to add a race and a class that was already in ingame lore for years, its trully amazing their reverse midas touch ruining everything the community wants

[czarek]

I mean, Nefarian spent years creating chromatic dragons that wielded 5 dragon powers at once, and even when Deathwing personally continued these experiments, they had problems reviving Chromatus. Chromatic dragons simply died, apparently due to an overabundance of power. But now it turns out that once upon a time Neltharion simply created an entire race of Drakonids who wielded all 5 powers of the Aspects without any restrictions or consequences? Amazing

Yeah but the diffrence is that Nef was pretty much obsessed and corrupted.

[bloodkin]

The Dracthyr appear to be failures from Neltharion's point of view - the Chromatic dragons were intended to be actual dragons, with all the power and physical might that entails, able to wield the power of every flight. The Dracthyr, while able to wield multiple sets of power, can only do so on a limited "mortal" level - making them no more powerful than your average humanoid spellcaster. That's probably not what Neltharion was gunning for, and the Chromatic and Twilight flights are continued iterations on the same theme.

This is most likely the what the lore is going to be, it's a relatively simple explanation without any (noteworthy) retcons.

[Woggmer]

Try...re-read...my...post....

Re-reading and I'm left wondering... Where exactly did Nefarian get the idea to make a Chromatic Dragonflight to begin with? Obviously Nefarian wanted to follow in his dad's example.

Nefarian was obsessed with following in his father's footsteps by achieving what his father could not. He has been experimenting with the blood of all of the various dragonflights to create a chromatic dragonflight

Exploring Azeroth: Eastern Kingdoms page 44.

My honest guess (and this is pure conjecture on my part, so it may be different than what Blizz has in mind),

Neltharion was creating the Drak'thyr and trained them for most situations, until the Sundering happened and the Dragon Isles separated from the large continent, the Drak'thyr went dormant.. the beacons are turned off meaning that no other dragon, not even the Aspects were allowed to go back including Deathwing.

Without the Drak'thyr, he conscripted Nefarian to make their own Drak'thyr, but Nefarian wanted to one up his father by creating the Chromatic Dragonflight. An improved more powerful variant than the Drak'thyr, but it resulted in failure after failure...

(Again, that's just my idea of what might've happened, I saw articles stating that the Drak'thyr are in some dormant state until the beacon was lit which is how they discover the Alliance and Horde expedition teams when they make landfall. This seems like a similar scenario with the Demon Hunter starter zone where the first half is done as a flashback leading up to the Drak'thyr going dormant, but in the second half they wake up in the present day and see the Alliance and Horde groups.)

- - - Updated - - -

You need to practice your reading more. That's exactly what he told you and that's exactly what the plot hole is. Nefarian was the first to manage to utilize all 5 dragonflight powers in one being, and no it wasn't a dragon either as Aucald falsely pointed out. It was in Chromaggus.

I made a reply already.

[Mace]

Anyone who expected anything but retcons born of willful ignorance from Danuser and team has clearly had his head in the sand for years.

haha /10 - thread won.

I don't even bother to bring these thigns up any more, they don't matter. It's new lore everye xpansion and re-written.. I thought Neltharion making the Dracthyr was not an interesting move.

[kranur]

Why would I feel embarrassed? It's not my story .. Blizzard is the one who should feel embarrassed if the story doesn't make sense.

On another note, I do feel "meh" that the dracthyr look like crap (personal opinion)

[Nachtigal]

Not a retcon. Both neltharion and nefarian wanted chromatic DRAGONS. These are not full dragons. These are a stable combination of dragons and humans/elves.

- - - Updated - - -

If anything y’all should feel embarrassed you’ll believe this is a retcon.

[david0925]

They obviously just pulled this out of nowhere for gameplay reasons, but these can be explained away without retconning much, if anything, for reasons people already statead
-Draknoids are not dragons, so hybrids may be failures/first step in their experiment that was then abandoned.
-They imbued power into them, so mission successful and they moved on to actual dragons/eggs and this proof-of-concept project was then set aside.

[VinceVega]

But these are not dragons. At all... just dragonlike humanoids.
I highly doubt that was what he tried to create later on and also they had 10000 years to grow into whatever they are now.

Why do you think they always have been what they are now? Evolution and magic is a weird combination given that most of the races in azeroth just puffed into being by the titans and later by the old god curse. SO them evolving from red lizards to what they are now in 10000 is not that far fetched.

The ONYL actual retcon i can see for now is the problem with the centaures only being 1000 years old in lore. But they said they have been let there by a wildgod who maybe found a way the circumvent the closing of the dragon isles

[NED funded]

I mean, Nefarian spent years creating chromatic dragons that wielded 5 dragon powers at once, and even when Deathwing personally continued these experiments, they had problems reviving Chromatus. Chromatic dragons simply died, apparently due to an overabundance of power. But now it turns out that once upon a time Neltharion simply created an entire race of Drakonids who wielded all 5 powers of the Aspects without any restrictions or consequences? Amazing

I deffo expect some kind of retcon but we don't really how Neltharion created them or why they weild the 5 dragon powers

[Alaskandan]

I mean, Nefarian spent years creating chromatic dragons that wielded 5 dragon powers at once, and even when Deathwing personally continued these experiments, they had problems reviving Chromatus. Chromatic dragons simply died, apparently due to an overabundance of power. But now it turns out that once upon a time Neltharion simply created an entire race of Drakonids who wielded all 5 powers of the Aspects without any restrictions or consequences? Amazing

Personally, I feel like it will be a combination of a couple different things, some of which has been mentioned previously. I feel that the Dracthyr, currently being labeled as essentially the perfect soldier, are going to be these versatile, powerful casters that use a specific configuration of mortal DNA to be stable, but their big failing is that physically, they are not nearly as imposing or (likely) as durable as dragons.

It's also possible that there is a specific feature or quality to the Dragon Isles that made their creation possible, that then became inaccessible to Deathwing with the Isles being shrouded during the War of the Ancients. Do I expect an actual well thought out answer from Blizzard? Not really. So for now this is my working theory.

[Mustardisbad]

Lol, getting embarrassed over lore that is already made up. I am sure it will be explained in the starting storyline.

[Devonitar]

Maybe Deathwing went Dr. Gero, and after initial setbacks he just left the Dracthyr in some vat to ferment, while writing them off as failure. Then he got all corrupted and went to create a bit less complicated androids... I mean dragons.