Should GW2 have raids?

[Mif]

They weren't nerfed as such, but the players were 5 levels above the boss, and half the people participating were ArenaNet staff back in Seattle, who also said they got their asses quickly handed to them when they first few times they did the boss to learn it.

[Durzlla]

That would be awesome. There was a lot of talk on whether it was or not at gw2guru, but there was never any proof for either side.

I remember hearing it during one of their many FAQ's, someone made a comment about the shatterer even being easy, and they had said they nerfed all their events by a flat percent, and increased their spawn rate so that more people could experience the events during demos, and because there wouldn't be enough time for people to become beastly at the game and do shatterer.

[Fernling306]

They weren't nerfed as such, but the players were 5 levels above the boss, and half the people participating were ArenaNet staff back in Seattle, who also said they got their asses quickly handed to them when they first few times they did the boss to learn it.

If you watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1JfSbKjHHI .

At 3:35 you will see that the characters level is 59, while Tequatl is 58 and the adds are also 58. I wouldn't think 1 level would make that much of a difference in difficulty.

[Mif]

If you watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1JfSbKjHHI .

At 3:35 you will see that the characters level is 59, while Tequatl is 58 and the adds are also 58. I wouldn't think 1 level would make that much of a difference in difficulty.

Hmmmm, I'm sure I heard ArenaNet say there was a level mismatch involved.
No way I'd ever find it again though, so /shrug

[Fernling306]

Hmmmm, I'm sure I heard ArenaNet say there was a level mismatch involved.
No way I'd ever find it again though, so /shrug

I'm hoping they just nerfed the hell out of 'em.

[Mif]

I'm hoping they just nerfed the hell out of 'em.

Judging by the feedback if they weren't nerfed they've probably been buffed by now.

[Fernling306]

Judging by the feedback if they weren't nerfed they've probably been buffed by now.

Or they will be buffed by the end of beta.

[Valeron]

They said they were toned down so that everybody could see and enjoy the fight.

There was one event which involved pirates which wasn't toned down and consequently many people got their asses handed to them.

Anyway, as said before, if you want WoW style raiding then look elsewhere. But there is sure to be some challenging content if that is what you are looking for.

[Tackhisis]

You cannot have an intersting fight mechanics which is failsafe at the same time, or I just cannot imagine one.

If there will be bunch of people 'participating' in fight by doing random things, how the game will protect us from this kind of griefing? Because if you can do anything, but will prevail as long as you deal damage, it's not an interesting fight.

The raids became limited and instanced for a reason: to allow more complex fight mechanics and prevent griefing. There must be something we don't know, or these end-game events are not a challenging equivalent of raids in other MMOs.

[Deleted]

You cannot have an intersting fight mechanics which is failsafe at the same time, or I just cannot imagine one.

If there will be bunch of people 'participating' in fight by doing random things, how the game will protect us from this kind of griefing? Because if you can do anything, but will prevail as long as you deal damage, it's not an interesting fight.

The raids became limited and instanced for a reason: to allow more complex fight mechanics and prevent griefing. There must be something we don't know, or these end-game events are not a challenging equivalent of raids in other MMOs.

Not every fight in WoW is that complex to be honest. I'd even say it's a small minimum. And those fights are probably something you can expect in the dungeons, that are said to be the toughest thing around. DE's aren't, because they are also public. Not that they should be easy mode, but the toughest thing will be the dungeons, that are instanced.

[Hockeyhacker]

I know creating this thread, will most likely start some raging and yelling at each other but lets try to keep a civilized as possible.

So thats the question. Should GW2 have raids. 10-25 people

I personally dont think that putting raids in is all that much to ask (not that i am). They are merely just world bosses contained in a zone it spot.
I think having raids would bring more people to the game as well, and hopefully give them a taste of what balanced pvp is like.

There are raids in GW 2... they are just not instanced raids you can farm, they are open world raid bosses that spawn based upon dynamic events and some days youll run into one, play with who ever is there and then do whatever else you where doing before hand.

You don't need raid content to be instanced for it to be fun and challenging, you just have to make it scale to how many people are there because if its designed for 10 people and 100 come and its not scaled then its boring which is why they have been working so hard on trying to make a scaling system that works.

For what they are trying to do with the game having an instanced raid that you can put on farm status would feel immersion breaking, but having open world raids based upon what everyone has or has not done recently would not break immersion. And for that reason I would say no to instanced raids, the world is suppose to be dynamic your not suppose to be able to go "ok at 5:30 pm we are going to go kill x when the raid resets so everyone go there and stand around waiting for him", you are on the other hand suppose to "ok we finally pushed back the enemy line to the point where they feel threatened enough to pull out their big guns, lets make this one last push against this big bady to drive them back for a while till they can regroup"

You cannot have an intersting fight mechanics which is failsafe at the same time, or I just cannot imagine one.

If there will be bunch of people 'participating' in fight by doing random things, how the game will protect us from this kind of griefing? Because if you can do anything, but will prevail as long as you deal damage, it's not an interesting fight.

The raids became limited and instanced for a reason: to allow more complex fight mechanics and prevent griefing. There must be something we don't know, or these end-game events are not a challenging equivalent of raids in other MMOs.

This would be true in a game where the company is scared to make something open world something you can and will die to, they already stated that the scaling would be better then "oh he is taking a pot shot once every 60 seconds lets scale it up as if there was another player", how good it will be has yet to be seen, but they are not afraid to put in something that will be challenging, there is a reason why anyone can rez without a CD on it, it is designed around you dying and dying a lot.

[Squirrelbanes]

You cannot have an intersting fight mechanics which is failsafe at the same time, or I just cannot imagine one.

No one has at any time suggested anything of the sort. They are not failsafe.
Stop posting.

If there will be bunch of people 'participating' in fight by doing random things, how the game will protect us from this kind of griefing?

ur attempt at sacrasm by saying 'participating'? & doing random things? ........... stop posting until you read more GW2 info.

Because if you can do anything, but will prevail as long as you deal damage, it's not an interesting fight.

They don't "do anything". If you can only play randomly, don't ascribe such play to others.
Please stop posting until you read more GW2 info.

The raids became limited and instanced for a reason: to allow more complex fight mechanics and prevent griefing. There must be something we don't know, or these end-game events are not a challenging equivalent of raids in other MMOs.

There are a great many things you don't know.
For the love of god please stop posting until you read more GW2 info.


And I'm honesty not an arrogant, rude or vindictive person by nature...but your apparent stubborn and increasingly infuriating lack of ability to increase your knowledge base and cognitive CPU power has driven me to apoplexy and serious alcohooism.

[Tackhisis]

--insults removed--

In other words, you state that arbitrary number of people present at the boss fight, doing random things and not following boss mechanics cannot affect success or failure of our group in said boss combat? Because otherwise, without instancing or locking, we cannot remove or harm offenders.

How GW2 will protect our group from such griefing?

Just look how creative people were getting griefing L2's Zaken encounter.

[Deleted]

It's incredible how easy is to troll bait people around here. Tackhisis is a great example of this, all he does is supply semi-related arguments and denial - and all people fall for it. I'm actually disappointed people discuss anything with this type of a person.

[Durzlla]

It's incredible how easy is to troll bait people around here. Tackhisis is a great example of this, all he does is supply semi-related arguments and denial - and all people fall for it. I'm actually disappointed people discuss anything with this type of a person.

And if he's not a troll (oh god i hope he is) he's preeeeeeety thick...

In other news, what do you guys think will consist of the Elite DE's? And do you think they'll have abilities that can completely decimate groups if they mess up? Going with a super version of a wow mechanic, beam of light connects 2 people, if they don't join together(or maybe get far enough away that the link breaks) them, and like 5 people around them blow up for BIG NUMBERS.

[Valeron]

Tackhisis has been winding people up on these forums and other games for a while now. He must be pretty good though, people keep on biting on what he says.

[Maarius]

In other words, you state that arbitrary number of people present at the boss fight, doing random things and not following boss mechanics cannot affect success or failure of our group in said boss combat? Because otherwise, without instancing or locking, we cannot remove or harm offenders.

How GW2 will protect our group from such griefing?

Just look how creative people were getting griefing L2's Zaken encounter.

despite your trolling this is actually a fair question, it has been answered a couple of times: the system is fairly intelligent here and detects if the player is actively participating or not.

some of the answers:

Question #63: "Will people be able to grief a dynamic event by being present just to increase the event difficulty, but not actually contributing anything towards the completion of the event?"
Answer: "Nope. "

reddit ama q&a with the developers

Events can detect that players have not performed any actions relating to the event within a period of time and will scale down the event accordingly.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dynamic_event

it's constantly pulling and looking to all of the things you're doing to reward you. When we say participating in an event you have to get rewarded, you have to be actively participating in the event. If you stand in the middle of the event and do nothing, the game is recognizing you're doing that and it won't give you any reward. So we are constantly pulling and using intelligent Game-AI to detect: "What's going on?" and then detect, if you deserve rewards for it.

http://guildwars2.ingame.de/

[Protoman]

I think they should def add some raids, maybe like 10 or 20 man.....but I don't think GW2 PVE is in depth enough to really make many interesting encounters.....can't add much complexity without tank and heals which is unfortunate. Guess people will have to settle for the big dynamic events but from what I have seen so far of those I'm not too impressed.

[BlairPhoenix]

Tackhisis has been winding people up on these forums and other games for a while now. He must be pretty good though, people keep on biting on what he says.

Tackhisis is a good troll because s/he actually puts forth effort and relies mostly on actual argument and not just internet memes and personal attacks/insults. It's quite refreshing, as a lot of trolls these days simply do not put forth the effort. Also, even if Tackhisis is just trolling, the actual discussion can still have merit for those who are less informed, and may be thinking some of the things Tackhisis brings up.

[Acquiesce of Telara]

I think they should def add some raids, maybe like 10 or 20 man.....but I don't think GW2 PVE is in depth enough to really make many interesting encounters.....can't add much complexity without tank and heals which is unfortunate. Guess people will have to settle for the big dynamic events but from what I have seen so far of those I'm not too impressed.

Unless the lack of a designated tank and heals makes a fight naturally more complex in nature.