[Megathread] DotA 2

[Kuntantee]

Since Lysah played with coL(was it?), I wonder were they giving missing signal when some1 is missing on map or just keep silent on voice chat. I think giving missing signal is a requirement, especially in pubs(but not limited to pubs) where team communication and coordination is very lacking together with map awareness of general player base.

[Finear]

im always calling miss both on mumble and chat im just used to do it (and especially on chat when i rarely play solo)
because when one of us forgets we are flaming the shit out of each other XD

[Longview]

Pretty much requires me to play carries, which I'm not really fond of. I kind of find them boring, support play is so much more varied.

you what mate

[PizzaSHARK]

you what mate

That's what they always say, and it sure seems like it. I play as a support and even if I wanted to try and carry I'm 30 minutes behind the gold farm and couldn't outcarry a shitty enemy carry anyway.

[Hermanni]

I agree with kuntantee. You are exceptionally wrong and have the wrong attitude not us. It isn't a single player game, it's a team game, and requires communication.

If someone is missing, inform your team, and give location information if you can. When I am playing I will shout miss and inform them of the direction i believe them to be coming from if possible (and if accurate enough). How much this little bit of information can turn a game is staggering. It isn't everybody's responsibility to be checking every lane, and it isn't possible either.

When you die to a gank, from a person who is missing, and you weren't told about it, you rightfully ask why you weren't told. You don't know WHAT they are doing, they might disappear from the minimap because they are low and returning to base, they might disappear because they are staying in the fog (see: Pudge mid, Keeper, Slark hero's that utilize fog during laning phase) they might be pulling (see: any support hero/any hero who wants too) they might just be grabbing rune, they could be going to secret shop to buy an item, could be pulling back to receive items from courier, could be stacking ancients... they could be doing anything, you don't know just from looking at minimap - but the person who is with them, checking their items, checking their level, watching their play be it aggressive/defensive/coercive/suggestive and checking their farm, their direction, their mana/hp - they do know, and you cant keep on top of all 5 hero's on the map all the time, incl. what they are doing.

I think you must have played VERY few games if you are of the attitude that you are supposed to watch the minimap. I don't know about games you play but in games I play If someone doesn't call missing, you are dead, in a heartbeat, and the enemy team will take advantage of the situation, you will lose - and more importantly, you will not get better, while you keep blaming yourself for their mistakes.

TL;DR, call missing.

I don't really get you. Ariadne never proposed that you shouldn't be calling misses, how I understood it was that they just said that a lot of people seem to, often rather irrationally, prefer blaming other people for not playing the game for you. Would you mind explaining why you say you can't get better if you blame yourself? Isn't that a key element for getting better, to recognize what you did wrong or could have done better so you can do better next time? Instead of blaming someone else, shrugging it off and moving on?

And like was already mentioned, when playing with random people of whose skill, playing habits and language skills you know nothing of, why would you rely on them rather than yourself? It's still a team game if you don't assume you can just throw map awareness out of the window because you have team for that. I'm pretty good about calling miss, even I often get the slight feeling of "I shouldn't be doing this at all", but let's say you're in a group with me and my stack of 3-4 people, I routinely called miss in my VOIP but you missed it because you aren't there and died. Tough luck, but I won't feel sorry for you.

When I play in a stack I always let people I am in VOIP with know what the enemy are doing and what they might be doing. When I soloqueue I almost always call miss, I often even take a moment to write something the other people might not pick up like "Lion might roam" or "possibly inc mid." Yet I blame nobody but myself if I get caught out, however easy it would have been for someone else to write it in chat or yell at me. When I was learning DotA in WC3, I when I kept getting ganked in games I would often load up the replay, hide enemy vision and just watch myself play and follow the minimap. That's how I learned, and it didn't take long for me to notice how I was suddenly dying a lot less when I routinely glanced at the minimap and accounted for the enemies' last known positions.

Even if you can't know what's going on in other lanes as well as the people who actually are there there's no reason to not try to keep up with every enemy hero and their last known positions. However the average player is going to be surprised when they get ganked by a jungling Furion, not because they're getting ganked but because they didn't know or remember the enemy team actually had a Furion. That's about the game awareness level of a lot of players, and sadly as long as blaming someone else remains a standard response a lot of people will never attempt to get better at or even acknowledge how lacking they are in a vital part of the game.

I have to ask though, what exactly was going through your head when you wrote the sentence "I think you must have played VERY few games if you are of the attitude that you are supposed to watch the minimap." That might just be about the most backwards thing I've read so far this year.

[Longview]

That's what they always say, and it sure seems like it. I play as a support and even if I wanted to try and carry I'm 30 minutes behind the gold farm and couldn't outcarry a shitty enemy carry anyway.

I thought it was common knowledge to frequently play support if you wanted to raise your MMR. MMR doesn't have anything to do with w/l-ratio though.

edit: or so I have read but we don't know that do we huh

[Hermanni]

That's what they always say, and it sure seems like it. I play as a support and even if I wanted to try and carry I'm 30 minutes behind the gold farm and couldn't outcarry a shitty enemy carry anyway.

My first ~150 games of Dota 2 were like 75% support games and at that point I had a win record of 100-50 or something. I'd say supporting is the easiest way to high ratings because you depend on nobody to do your job and your team will always have a good and willing support, which is already a major advantage in mid level games.

[Enkidulgaa]

That's what they always say, and it sure seems like it. I play as a support and even if I wanted to try and carry I'm 30 minutes behind the gold farm and couldn't outcarry a shitty enemy carry anyway.

Why do you need gold? The point is not to outcarry the enemy's carry
The point is that a support can influence the game beginning at 00:00 and feed his team kills/prevent them from dying which wins you the game
If you're playing Carry you have to watch as your team feeds and gives up towers while you have to farm. Most of the time you will have to 1v5 a team with 30 kills which is impossible for almost every carry in the game

[PizzaSHARK]

Why do you need gold? The point is not to outcarry the enemy's carry
The point is that a support can influence the game beginning at 00:00 and feed his team kills/prevent them from dying which wins you the game
If you're playing Carry you have to watch as your team feeds and gives up towers while you have to farm. Most of the time you will have to 1v5 a team with 30 kills which is impossible for almost every carry in the game

Not much I can do when someone keeps overextending vs a double stun lane after being told several times not to.

[Black Rider]

Who is next hero in Dota 2 ? Any info?

[Deleted]

Who is next hero in Dota 2 ? Any info?

Medusa, however when she comes out i doubt she will be alone maybe with troll and/or tuskar

[PizzaSHARK]

Medusa, however when she comes out i doubt she will be alone maybe with troll and/or tuskar

Hopefully they do something about Tuskar's voice before they release him.

[Demidov]

Hopefully they do something about Tuskar's voice before they release him.

Welcome to the Greeviling.

[Finear]

Welcome to the Greeviling.

one of the reasons i have played only~10 games of greeviling ;_;
imo this event was horrible


im really getting into earthshaker
one of my fav hero now

you have to stack clarities but its soo fun to land good fissure

[PizzaSHARK]

one of the reasons i have played only~10 games of greeviling ;_;
imo this event was horrible


im really getting into earthshaker
one of my fav hero now

you have to stack clarities but its soo fun to land good fissure

I'd rather play Jakiro and not have to worry about aim, just spam Ice Path!

[Deleted]

Medusa, however when she comes out i doubt she will be alone maybe with troll and/or tuskar

[Deleted]

Hey there guys, I've gathered 8 bloody DOTA 2 keys, so I'm happy to give them away to anyone, and a cheap game in trade for it wouldn't be nasty, but otherwise I'm sick of getting them. First 8 people to message me their steam account names get the keys!

[Lysah]

Since Lysah played with coL(was it?), I wonder were they giving missing signal when some1 is missing on map or just keep silent on voice chat. I think giving missing signal is a requirement, especially in pubs(but not limited to pubs) where team communication and coordination is very lacking together with map awareness of general player base.

Against* so I wouldn't know, but I did watch the two games I played against merlini (from his stream) to see the game from his perspective, and there was no team chat going on during the game. All 5 players were expected to watch the map themselves, the only team chat was people trying to organize ganks/team fights or roshan. Really good players don't need to talk to each other to play, which doesn't really surprise me. That's really the difference between top level players and tournament level players. Individual skill only gets you so far, having four people you can play well with means so much more. Even one player on the team who runs around like a hero and gets ganked all the time and refuses to show up for team fights where you have the advantage can ruin an entire game, which is the problem with PuGs.

I thought it was common knowledge to frequently play support if you wanted to raise your MMR. MMR doesn't have anything to do with w/l-ratio though.

I agree. I'm not sure how it judges performance but my performance with every support hero is around 0-1 bars. How many smokes/sentry wards you buy and how many assists, rather than kills, you get is probably part of the judgement. We don't know how Valve judges MMR, but in my experience if you can "play well" (whatever that means for the given hero) it will go up even if you lose.

[Kuntantee]

How many smokes/sentry wards you buy and how many assists, rather than kills, you get is probably part of the judgement.

I am almost sure it doesn't take those things into account. %99 of my support plays are completed without feed and I ward, stack, pull, buy smoke, counter ward, gank etc. etc. None of my support performance is above 2 bar(starting from left). Ironically, I performed bad in few QoP games while I was trying to get used with new engine's controls(and never toucher her again because of very clunky animations) and I have almost 5 bars with her.


btw abandoned practice games counts as loss?

[Lysah]

I am almost sure it doesn't take those things into account. %99 of my support plays are completed without feed and I ward, stack, pull, buy smoke, counter ward, gank etc. etc. None of my support performance is above 2 bar(starting from left). Ironically, I performed bad in few QoP games while I was trying to get used with new engine's controls(and never toucher her again because of very clunky animations) and I have almost 5 bars with her.

The question then becomes, does anyone actually do "Good" as support, according to Valve? =p

I figured the games I went lothar's ES and never bought wards because I was playing carry counted against me, but the few times I random CM and don't repick all I do is gank and buy wards because no item is going to help her very much, still like 1 bar rating. It really makes me curious to how they judge performance by hero.