[Megathread] DotA 2

[Deleted]

I have the opposite feeling when against troll, a 5 / 6 slotted troll scares the hell out of me, granted he is weak very early he is pretty strong mid game if his farm isn't bad.

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Troll suffers from a classic case of what I affectionately refer to as "Ursa Syndrome". He'll absolutely destroy anyone he can reach, but getting to them in the first place is the problem. To do that reliably you usually need either a Blink Dagger or a Shadow Blade. Then you want a BKB so you can stay there without getting instantly stunned, and of course you want a pair of boots, and usually a Lifesteal item so you can stay in the fight and all of a sudden you're looking at 4 full items just to be effective.

Heh i call that "The Sven problem".

But i never have that problem with troll, always been able to catch people without too many problems.

[M1r4g3]

Id rather take on 2 6-sloted trolls over 1 6-sloted naga.

But yea sven,lifestealer,ursa,troll are all easily kited, though ursa/troll can at least blink and burst people down before they can react.

[Lysah]

I think Sven stands a better shot of killing people with blink dagger, as he brings his own stun, the others do not. Sven with crits and ult up can unload 3000 damage before storm bolt wears off without needing help from allies. You can run from troll and naix and ursa, provided they don't instant-bash like they always do against me. While all 3 of them have slows, slows are not stuns and won't stop force staffs, ghost scepters, CCs, etc. Sven doesn't need BKB to gank Lion, the other three do (luckily naix gets his for free, but his damage is nowhere near the rest either).

http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1335776740
6 slots Troll vs me with only 4 slots on PL, and really the only reason we lost was because we had no way to contest Rosh so they got it 4 or 5 times uncontested and managed to break base with aegis, and they had a couple of team fights they should've lost but got clutch black holes to turn it around. Troll really did very little work and wasn't a threat at any point in the game, he's just the one who gets the kill while his team is doing the actual work keeping people CCed. But, any carry could do the same thing, what does Troll have that anyone else does not?

Also, if you really want to fuck with Troll pickers, just pick Bloodseeker and spam rupture on them. The only thing I actually like about this hero is his ability to beat most heroes in lane phase.

[M1r4g3]

I think Sven stands a better shot of killing people with blink dagger, as he brings his own stun, the others do not. Sven with crits and ult up can unload 3000 damage before storm bolt wears off without needing help from allies. You can run from troll and naix and ursa, provided they don't instant-bash like they always do against me. While all 3 of them have slows, slows are not stuns and won't stop force staffs, ghost scepters, CCs, etc. Sven doesn't need BKB to gank Lion, the other three do (luckily naix gets his for free, but his damage is nowhere near the rest either).

http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1335776740
6 slots Troll vs me with only 4 slots on PL, and really the only reason we lost was because we had no way to content Rosh so they got it 4 or 5 times uncontested and managed to break base with aegis, and they had a couple of team fights they should've lost but got clutch black holes to turn it around. Troll really did very little work and wasn't a threat at any point in the game, he's just the one who gets the kill while his team is doing the actual work keeping people CCed. But, any carry could do the same thing, what does Troll have that anyone else does not?

Also, if you really want to fuck with Troll pickers, just pick Bloodseeker and spam rupture on them. The only thing I actually like about this hero is his ability to beat most heroes in lane phase.

Meant more early/mid game but yeah sven 6 sloted is probably the strongest out of those 4.
Also winter wyvern is a direct troll counter.

[Deleted]

I find Troll brings utility early and mid game - attack speed buffs to everyone, a slow, blind and potential stun, which is decent for a hard carry.

Late he is only really good at 1v1ing people, i find the best way to play him late game is jump the supports and ignore the other carry, because odds are you will beet him 1v1 - i mean i almost died to him 1v1 in this game http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1338598202

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Meant more early/mid game but yeah sven 6 sloted is probably the strongest out of those 4.
Also winter wyvern is a direct troll counter.

6 slotted sven is in my opinion one of the best carries in game. How is WW a direct counter to troll tho ? I mean she pretty much stops any auto attack hero in thier tracks than just specifically Troll.

[Lysah]

I think WW is a troll counter on paper, but considering his movespeed it's pretty easy for him to just switch targets when the ice comes out. Not to mention that the ice gives a hero like Lina a guaranteed kill on anybody so you can't actually use it in team fights.

[EqualWin]

i think troll beat any1 1v1 cuz perma fkn bash, even if he has no dmg (I barely build dmg on him, but if i do i get a crit and its a ez game) I prefer jug over him tho if I've to pick a safelane carry its between troll jug or pl (sniper sometimes)


shadowblade is a such a good item on troll and jug, free kills everywhere. troll sb is so fun with sb attack->ult->perma bash to dead

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this game was so hard to win http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1347135240 . (pl took forever to farm) . also he would 2 shot any1. somehow we were winning rly hard till brood left, after that the game got like x100 harded, because pl couldn't do shit with 1k hp, and I couldn't kill tiny (also tiny burst is so retarded, mid game I'd die to his blink toss stun combo few times) I'm not a good storm spirit , we were rly ahead we died like idiots and they took 2 barracks in like 2 secs.

at the end , we killed tiny (or troll i dont remember) we were pushing all mid except techies, tiny (or troll) bought back and they both tpd to our base.. our throne was exposed but techies lol, killed troll with booms and tiny had like 500 hp left he sheep him and right clicked him to dead.

tiny passive is op as fuck t-t

[Kralljin]

i think troll beat any1 1v1 cuz perma fkn bash, even if he has no dmg (I barely build dmg on him, but if i do i get a crit and its a ez game)

Any right klicker without a super long disable (=Chronosphere) will have a hard time to man fight Brewmaster before you get Bkb / Mkb, Drunken Brawler & Drunken Haze make it quite hard to deal serious damage to brew with right klicks.

Personally i've been playing Brew on offlane a bit, early phase was actually quite decent, Supports had a hard time in harassing me, i just ran up to them with boots+stout and slapped them with Thunderclap + Guaranteed Crit, Guaranteed dodge allowed to shrug off some hits from the carry and gave me actually some room to farm on offlane.

Mana was obviously a serious issue, but farming up stuff like Bottle or Arcane Boots wasn't that difficult in most games.

[EqualWin]

he has bkb, hell even i bet troll could 1v1 pa w.o mkb, his attack speed insane it doesnt matter if he miss 50% of his attack. (i just played a game where troll didnt have mkb i had btfly as slark, he would rekt me if i didnt kill him in abyssal into ult and stuff.




brew mostly in pubs is so good, supports barely know how to zone u off correctly (w.o them tanking creeps) and brew dmg burst is high with thunderclap and crit. I play him once or twice because my micro isn't that good and im not a fan of the hero

[Kralljin]

he has bkb, hell even i bet troll could 1v1 pa w.o mkb, his attack speed insane it doesnt matter if he miss 50% of his attack. (i just played a game where troll didnt have mkb i had btfly as slark, he would rekt me if i didnt kill him in abyssal into ult and stuff.

30% or 50% Dodge aren't compareable to 75% Miss Chance, on top of attacking a target which has 25% Dodge, next to that, Brew probably has more HP and his Ult.

PA vs. Troll is basically Bash Luck vs. Dodge & Crit Luck.

[EqualWin]

would be fun to see troll vs carry panda. troll w.o mkb panda might have a chance if u ult his bkb and stuff idk.

[theostrichsays]

Was starting to get really burnt out on playing support. Just gets boring trying to set up other people to succeed and watch them fail over and over again.

Then I had a random Kunkka on my team, as Vengeful Spirit. We set up the same in lane kill over and over with Nether Swap, Magic Missle, X marks the spot on the enemy, Ship, then torrent nd Missile again if need be to finish the kill. Was enough to reenergize my desire to play support and not just 5 man core teams.

[Crackleslap]

Feel like I've just played my best support and mirana game ever! Played it a few days ago, It's a long game (55 minutes) but it made me realise the true potential of it. Like, I'm not a great player, made some mistakes, but I generally felt really good after this game. (I didn't build into support at the start because I wasn't going too until we swapped lanes)

ID: 1350245405
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1350245405

[minteK917]

30% or 50% Dodge aren't compareable to 75% Miss Chance, on top of attacking a target which has 25% Dodge, next to that, Brew probably has more HP and his Ult.

PA vs. Troll is basically Bash Luck vs. Dodge & Crit Luck.

No troll will ever build an MKB vs a brewmaster carry, second or 3rd position. Past a certain level and time of farm when your MKB would be online without gimping yourself, brew is a non issues for right clicker and the ults instantly dies to right clicks. BKB is more then enough.

[StrawberryZebra]

No troll will ever build an MKB vs a brewmaster carry, second or 3rd position. Past a certain level and time of farm when your MKB would be online without gimping yourself, brew is a non issues for right clicker and the ults instantly dies to right clicks. BKB is more then enough.

BKB isn't more than enough, its an outright better option for dealing with Brewmaster. It halts everything he can do to you but his right clicks. No Attack Speed Slow, no miss chance, no CC from his ult to worry about. While his right clicks can be quite dangerous, when it comes to him man-fighting with a BKBed Troll, Brew is definitely the underdog.

That being said, MKB on Troll does have its place. Troll likes flat damage items and MKB has a ton of it, the extra attack speed is a bit wasted, but the mini-bash stacks with his regular bash so with a bit of luck he can keep someone in place permanently while he murders them. Its a situational buy, at best, but its a solid pick up when you need it.

[Kralljin]

No troll will ever build an MKB vs a brewmaster carry, second or 3rd position. Past a certain level and time of farm when your MKB would be online without gimping yourself, brew is a non issues for right clicker and the ults instantly dies to right clicks. BKB is more then enough.

Brewmaster doesn't scale bad with items, but Carries like Troll are simply stronger with the right items, if you go with a Carry Brew then you should finish the game quickly with an early Agha on Brew, and a lot of ganks on the enemies carry.

But i doubt that you can kill off Brewlings that easily with just Bkb, in late game they die easily, but before that point any of them remains hard to kill if you control them properly.

If you're playing Brew on Mid or Offlane, most Carries won't bother to get Mkb anyway and they probably rather attack other targets than you during a Teamfight, but after Bkb runs out, Brew becomes a huge nuisance for any rightklick hero without Mkb.

[Crackleslap]

ti5 tickets sold out in 8 minutes combined. 10000 tickets. I didn't get any.

I am so fucking sad right now.

[theostrichsays]

Reddit is such a depressing place, for reading about Dota.
I tend to read threads on there about people telling supports they suck, or what they should be doing. There was one from a guy in the 4k bracket, and one of the things that was mentioned was maintaining the creep line and communicating with the carry on when to push the line so you can safely use the pull camp without excess tower damage (which seems like a really odd thing for the carry to not have to know at all but communication is always good.) Then somebody piped in at 4.8k and how they hated when jungle heroes would kill the pull camp even if the support said they were going to pull and bring the line back to their tower.
I was really hoping that things like that would get better at nearly 5k levels.
Nothing like telling the Ursa/Lifestealers you will double stack the camp and pull it to the line just please let you pull and they let you double stack but at :05 after the minute they are melee'ing the double stack camp and you struggle to pull the lane back.

[Longview]

that kind of stuff happens in that bracket because you can get there with just good farming technique and no deeper understanding of the game
¨
i was trying to learn supporting properly and i lost 14 out of 15 games lol

[StrawberryZebra]

Nothing like telling the Ursa/Lifestealers you will double stack the camp and pull it to the line just please let you pull and they let you double stack but at :05 after the minute they are melee'ing the double stack camp and you struggle to pull the lane back.

Ursa and Lifestealer both like to clear the easy camp in the early levels, before they really start to pick up clearing power. Its one of the few camps they can both do without losing too much health, even when its stacked. Other frequent clearers include Wrath King, Legion Commander and basically any other jungler who needs to tank the creeps themselves. A Stout Shield will allow them to block most of the damage they take, making it great for staying at high HP if you expect to be running into any trouble from the other team. I'm not saying that they should clear it regularly, just that they do.

Its probably also worth pointing out that with proper lane management, you can never have to pull the lane at all. Attacking any creep that's below half should be enough to keep it pushing towards your tower if you need it to be, and if done regularly can keep you from ever having to pull. Naturally, the other team can do the same too, but I usually take it as an opportunity to land some free hits on them during their attack animation.