[Megathread] Star Citizen

[qwerty123456]

If you're not ready to endure the uncertainties that come with game development and are just looking for a complete and polished game experience you shouldn't pledge for crowdfunded games. Period. Stick to officially released games and if you're interested in a product in development wait for it to release and review it before committing any money to it. Simple as that.

As for Elite Dangerous joining Star Citizen, well we've seen a big influx of new players ingame stating they come from Elite and asking questions along with some Youtubers known for Elite content starting to play Star Citizen:

https://as.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/...s_are_turning/

There's also the steam charts showcasing the decline in players after the release of Odyssey: https://steamcharts.com/app/359320#3m

Lying to people and selling one game and creating another is not what other crowdfunded games do. Why does Star Citizen get a pass? People have a right to be pissed if they wanted hello kitty island adventure and instead got a half finished buggy pokemon. Even if I think pokemon is better its a scummy thing to do.

LoL 2 of the people you linked have videos from several different space games and all of them are still posting Elite videos......

The steam charts show numbers going back down to their normal levels if you were to show the full chart.

"there was this one player who opened a thread and told us how he came from EliteDangerous after not liking it anymore.."

Lol he could only find 4 people with 2 of them being a couple on the same youtube channel and all the channels are still making Elite content.

[notaltacc]

There's no "easy & fast" way to make innovative and ambitious AAA games. Requires a lot of work time and money and big studios to pull off.

There's a reason why GTA 6 is still in development 9 years after GTA5 released. The reason why RedDeadRedemption 2 took 8~ years. Mind you that Rockstar is a established company with multiple studios across the world and 2000 developers and both of those games are sequels that have a lot of prior work already done.

CIG has just recently reached the 720+ developers and keeps growing.

The only despair seems to be coming from those who can't understand simple facts of game development and have to conjure a "shitshow" inside their head as a way to cope with the harsh reality of not understanding what's going on.

So simple yet so hard for some to acknowledge, it's as if they've became too comfortable being in angry mode that they refuse to acknowledge the reality right in from them.

Well, good job on purposely missing the point, I guess.

Having to conjure a shitshow? My dude, Squadron 42 is a crowdfunded single player game that was supposed to be released back in 2014, after multiple missed release windows, we are still waiting just for the fucking beta. Those 350 quotes in that album that I shared are a clear sign that even the lead developers themselves are just stumbling around without a clear direction.

If this isn’t a shitshow, then I don’t know what it is.

Also, if we want to start making comparisons with rockstar, let’s start with the fact that rockstar started relatively small before jumping into projects such as this, they pay for their own shit instead of relying on crowdfunded money or selling shit that isn’t even implemented on their still unreleased video games, they also don’t go around doing pre-orders just to delay their shit over and over for almost a decade… but hey, don’t let that stop you from shilling my dude, go get them tiger!

Edited: Oh, and by the way, I didn't say “easy and fast”, I said easier and faster, its slightly different, but you know that, you just might want to drop the intellectual superiority act of the one who does see the magnificent emperor’s new clothes if you are really going to pull crap like that.

There sure are some interesting quotes in that album.

You'll find one for each silly dumb fuckery being pulled from where the sun doesn't shine in order to justify this totally-not-a-shitshow of game development. Enjoy.

[Henako]

Well if there's folks who fail to grasp such things it's only normal that they have to be pointed out again and again. Anyone who has problems waiting for video-games to come out has only himself to blame as it's something completely out of it's control and literally a "1st World Problem" that could easily solved by simply playing other games.

What's funny is that those who angrily demand games to be rushed to release are then the first ones to cry wolf when said games are released in a unfinished and broken state. Cyberpunk is just the latest mainstream example. When will gamers learn there's no point in rushing things, just let developers do their work and release things when they are ready, meanwhile enjoy other games. Why is that so easy and simple to some yet seems so hard to others?

I agree that it's foolish to rush an unfinished problem out the door. However, I never implied they should.

I'm implying that development never should have taken this long, and that there's a long list of examples to prove that CiG's project management is suspect and at least partially to blame. We've been through this, though. This whole thread is a never ending loop.

Odyssey release pushed many Eliteangerous players into trying Star Citizen, so there's benefits when companies release rushed products, just not for the company who release it.

Ironically, I've actually been putting a fair amount of time into Elite lately. It's a good time. Really good for unwinding and listening to stuff in the background.

You like to ignore simple facts, 2 games are being made, a company had to be build from the ground up from nothing, its the largest and most ambitious game to ever be created, GTA6 is going to be estimated to up to 13 years for its development, and recent games have taken 8-9 years before. Games are taking longer and longer to develop as technology evolves, there is no set timeframe on how long a game takes to develop and thats why game companies say nothing during most games development cycle.

Case in point, I guess. Stay the course, Kenn.

Also...

Doesnt matter if both games are similar, they are still 2 seperate games where as GTA5 just uses the same map and throws in some instanced content which is not hard to create. Its obvious you dont understand the differences between SQ42 and the MMO universe if you think its just one game.

The two games are the same using pretty much sharing all of the same assets, its basically the same as what GTA 5 done where you get to follow the story mode or at some point can just jump into the multiplayer. Creating a story campaign is still a fair bit of work but they are not two completely seperate games and many of the story mode missions can be adapted for the PU.

One or the other. There being two games is either a big deal or it isn't.

[Revamp Man]

I miss when star citizen was that game that stood to be an amazing creation dedicated to not hamstringing itself by making concessions to get picked up by Microsoft or other consoles

Now we have a money pit to fuel a guys ego and toy room with people saying “this is what you supported” nah man people supported what they thought was going to be a game that was different not a game that copied the money grabbing garbage from other games

I hate using ass blasted Alejandro for quotes but they are charging $20 for FUCKING BLUE!!!

They introduce more ships even though the current ones aren’t fully implemented

They talk about adding more to systems that aren’t even finished

Best of all they have an employee sitting on forums crying about how everyone is wrong and the game is going great even though it’s being kept alive by the dedicated whales that are ok with funding a project led by incompetence incarnate

[MrAnderson]

Lying to people and selling one game and creating another is not what other crowdfunded games do. Why does Star Citizen get a pass? People have a right to be pissed if they wanted hello kitty island adventure and instead got a half finished buggy pokemon. Even if I think pokemon is better its a scummy thing to do.

LoL 2 of the people you linked have videos from several different space games and all of them are still posting Elite videos......

The steam charts show numbers going back down to their normal levels if you were to show the full chart.


Lol he could only find 4 people with 2 of them being a couple on the same youtube channel and all the channels are still making Elite content.

Again, if you're not prepared for games to change along development or that some might release unfinished and buggy wait for polished and reviewed products. Stay away from crowdfunding, pre-ordering or buying games without actually research about them.

Dunno what you're seeing but that Steam charts link shows a clear decline from the average players concurrency after Odyssey was released. A chunk of the hard-core players enjoyed Elite for the VR experience and Odyssey pretty much broke that. I mean even the CEO had to come out and release an apology.

[Henako]

Steam charts show a clear decline from the average players concurrency after the patch was released but keep burying that head in the sand.

All games will show this trend. You're not arguing in good faith.

[kenn9530]

One or the other. There being two games is either a big deal or it isn't.

They are still developing 2 games and thats a simple fact you like to just ignore because it doesnt suit the agenda you are trying to pull off, a game can share assets and still be 2 different games, the playable area between SQ42 and the MMO alone proves they are 2 seperate games.

You are the one judging and saying development is taking too long, when you dont even have the slightest idea on how long it should take, recent games released has already proven games are taking longer and longer to complete, so according to you GTA6 would be taking too long to develop since its estimated to be taking 13 years atm to complete.

[Henako]

They are still developing 2 games and thats a simple fact you like to just ignore

I didn't say this.

according to you GTA6 would be taking too long to develop since its estimated to be taking 13 years atm to complete.

I don't care how long GTA6 takes to develop. It isn't being developed with my money.

Don't you notice a decline?


https://steamcharts.com/app/359320#6m

Re-read what I said. You will see this trend with every patch. In every game. People show up to check the new content and then they leave. You're acting like this isn't expected, which is why I'm saying that you're not arguing in good faith.

I'm sure if you dig, you will find outliers. WoW's popularity skyrocketed until the end of WotLK, as an example, but that's certainly an exception. It's probably fair to say the rule applies only after a game's population has stabilized.

[MrAnderson]

All games will show this trend. You're not arguing in good faith.

Don't you notice a decline compared with the numbers pre-update?


https://steamcharts.com/app/359320#6m

I don't care how long GTA6 takes to develop. It isn't being developed with my money.

Neither is Star Citizen/Squadron 42.

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Re-read what I said. You will see this trend with every patch. In every game. People show up to check the new content and then they leave. You're acting like this isn't expected, which is why I'm saying that you're not arguing in good faith.

I'm sure if you dig, you will find outliers. WoW's popularity skyrocketed until the end of WotLK, as an example, but that's certainly an exception. It's probably fair to say the rule applies only after a game's population has stabilized.

Yeah but the thing is that numbers dropped bellow the pre-update numbers. That is more than people showing up to check the new content and then leaving.

[kenn9530]

I didn't say this.



I don't care how long GTA6 takes to develop. It isn't being developed with my money.

You are ignoring everything simply because you think the game is taking too long to develop, if you backed the project early its simply your own fault because you didnt do enough research on who is making the game or simply didnt understand how large the game was actually going to be, it was clear from the start this would be a very challenging project.

Plus its not your own money, even if you backed it was a donation to support development so its not your money.

[notaltacc]

You are ignoring everything simply because you think the game is taking too long to develop, if you backed the project early its simply your own fault because you didnt do enough research on who is making the game or simply didnt understand how large the game was actually going to be, it was clear from the start this would be a very challenging project.

Plus its not your own money, even if you backed it was a donation to support development so its not your money.

… and you are ignoring your own contradictions even after daring people to prove you wrong.

You, are full of shit, and when proven to be full of shit, you bury your head in the sand and just repeat and same old mantra. You are a troll who keeps getting away with it by convincing everyone that’s a mental disorder.

Also, it’s not a donation. It’s a pledge, with a cash-shop sprinkled on top of it.

Start owning up what you say and stop playing dumb, it’s just humiliating at this point.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Which as far as online/mmorpgs go still holds pretty good.

Black Desert came out in 2014 and it's faces still look better than Star Citizen's. Has way more variety too. And they don't look as uncanny when their faces moves.

[qwerty123456]

Again, if you're not prepared for games to change along development or that some might release unfinished and buggy wait for polished and reviewed products. Stay away from crowdfunding, pre-ordering or buying games without actually research about them.

Dunno what you're seeing but that Steam charts link shows a clear decline from the average players concurrency after Odyssey was released. A chunk of the hard-core players enjoyed Elite for the VR experience and Odyssey pretty much broke that. I mean even the CEO had to come out and release an apology.

Please tell me what crowdfunding games have an imgur of 350+ lies they have told? Please tell me what one promised people one game then said fuck it we are going to make what we want when we want it?

Do you not see the massive spike in players for the release and then the numbers go back down to the average? This litterally happens with every game. Strange how you cut the image before sept 2020 when they averaged 5,410.6 players and peaked at 8,957.....

A CEO apologizing means players are going over to star citizen? You couldn't even get the 4 youtubers you linked to fully convert. Why is it that Elite dangerous youtubers you have shown us have thousands of subscribers and yet all the Star Citizen accounts you link only have a few hundred?

[Henako]

You are ignoring everything simply because you think the game is taking too long to develop, if you backed the project early its simply your own fault because you didnt do enough research on who is making the game or simply didnt understand how large the game was actually going to be, it was clear from the start this would be a very challenging project.

What is this CR apologist garbage? It's not my job as a backer to run a background check on a developer. They said what the project's scope was. I backed that project. Even if we pretended that they had lead with the increased scope we now have, I would still be justifiably unhappy due to the many dates they've announced and blown past. Sq42 beta when?

Plus its not your own money, even if you backed it was a donation to support development so its not your money.

Oh. It wasn't my money I backed a project with. You're right. When I paid them what they asked for as my part in funding a project, I wasn't paying with my money. This is a very good point.

Even if this was true (it isn't), it doesn't change my point at all. Even if we pretend that my money isn't my money, they're still far behind schedule on a project funded by donations. Rockstar can take 35 years to release their next game for all I care. I haven't given them a penny to do it. CiG told me Sq42 was coming in 2016, and then 2018, and then a beta in 2020, and I want my goddamn money Lebowski.

[Kyanion]

You like to ignore simple facts, 2 games are being made, a company had to be build from the ground up from nothing, its the largest and most ambitious game to ever be created

We get it, make it a signature or something. You love saying this over and over and over.

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GTA6 is going to be estimated to up to 13 years for its development, and recent games have taken 8-9 years before

So GTA6 will complete before SC does? That's good to know.

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The only despair seems to be coming from those who can't understand simple facts of game development and have to conjure a "shitshow" inside their head as a way to cope with the harsh reality of not understanding what's going on.

So simple yet so hard for some to acknowledge, it's as if they've became too comfortable being in angry mode that they refuse to acknowledge the reality right in from them.

Whats nonsense is everything that comes out of that mouth that makes no sense.

You guys sure love to do this, attack people who don't agree with you two.

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There sure are some interesting quotes in that album.

Yeah some of it directly contradicts things 2 people in this thread have often said about the size of their team. 268 people 7 years ago.

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I mean even the CEO had to come out and release an apology.

That is better than lying about release dates right?

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You are ignoring everything simply because you think the game is taking too long to develop, if you backed the project early its simply your own fault because you didnt do enough research on who is making the game or simply didnt understand how large the game was actually going to be

I mean which is it? Did they back a game expecting to have it in 2015 or did they back the game expecting it in 2024? Hmmmm.... Sorry 2024 is being too generous. 2027?

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I see now why you're so deeply/heavily invested. You likely consider many of these devs to be friends in some regard.

Except he is paying to be the 'friend' in this scenario.

[kenn9530]

What is this CR apologist garbage? It's not my job as a backer to run a background check on a developer. They said what the project's scope was. I backed that project. Even if we pretended that they had lead with the increased scope we now have, I would still be justifiably unhappy due to the many dates they've announced and blown past. Sq42 beta when?



Oh. It wasn't my money I backed a project with. You're right. When I paid them what they asked for as my part in funding a project, I wasn't paying with my money. This is a very good point.

Even if this was true (it isn't), it doesn't change my point at all. Even if we pretend that my money isn't my money, they're still far behind schedule on a project funded by donations. Rockstar can take 35 years to release their next game for all I care. I haven't given them a penny to do it. CiG told me Sq42 was coming in 2016, and then 2018, and then a beta in 2020, and I want my goddamn money Lebowski.

CiG didnt actually say SQ42 was coming in 2016, it was just an assumption. The game will only be ready when its ready and in the 2016 presentation SQ42 was stated to be in grey box or better.

When you back a project that could be considered risky you should do research unless you are 100% prepared to lose it and get nothing in return, CR is know for expanding on the origional plan and thats why i backed to get the game he really wants to make and not what the kickstarter version would of been.

If you donate money its not your money from that point on, dont put in money you are not prepared to lose or have to wait longer for the desired results. Its not up to you to decide if they are behind schedule or not, only so much work can be done each day.

[Henako]

CiG didnt actually say SQ42 was coming in 2016, it was just an assumption. The game will only be ready when its ready and in the 2016 presentation SQ42 was stated to be in grey box or better.

Just an assumption.

[MrAnderson]

I see now why you're so deeply/heavily invested. You likely consider many of these devs to be friends in some regard.

Nah not at all, they're people I've talked strictly on gaming related basis, not really personal stuff.

Black Desert came out in 2014 and it's faces still look better than Star Citizen's. Has way more variety too. And they don't look as uncanny when their faces moves.

Nah not even close, doesn't even holds up against Star Citizen 2015 avatar I posted before in terms of detail. Notice there's no facial pores or wrinkles much less dynamic animation of facial features through face capture like in Star Citizen, it's all pre-baked animations on a mannequin.

Please tell me what crowdfunding games have an imgur of 350+ lies they have told? Please tell me what one promised people one game then said fuck it we are going to make what we want when we want it?

Do you not see the massive spike in players for the release and then the numbers go back down to the average? This litterally happens with every game. Strange how you cut the image before sept 2020 when they averaged 5,410.6 players and peaked at 8,957.....

A CEO apologizing means players are going over to star citizen? You couldn't even get the 4 youtubers you linked to fully convert. Why is it that Elite dangerous youtubers you have shown us have thousands of subscribers and yet all the Star Citizen accounts you link only have a few hundred?

You can make a compilation like that from every single developer and studio in the world because change is and will always be part of game development. Hell, change is part of life. Things said years ago made sense back then and now they don't make sense. Doesn't mean they were lies, just that things changed along the way. You don't follow many games in development right? Not even noticing how many crowdfunded games have changed along development or that most of them missed their "kickstarter estimated release date" by years.

You have the link of the steam charts, it's all there clear and simple and such declined shouldn't come as as surprise considering that the Odyssey release was plagued with technical problems that made it impossible for a lot of players to play. Performance issues, bugs, stability along with the hindering of aspects like VR and Exploration gameplay or bad game design decisions.

The Odyssey update literally brought Elite: Dangerous from the "released" stage to "alpha/Beta" stage and that's why a lot of Elite players got frustrated and decided to try Star Citizen. If they were gonna play a game in alpha stage at least they would be doing so in one who provides new features and better graphics.

In a way the Odyssey update was the best marketing move Star Citizen could ever asked for, again proving that releasing rushed and unfinished products is the wrong way to go. Frontier just did it because they needed the money to meet the Fiscal Year objectives aka Please Shareholders.

Thanks, I guess.

[Kyanion]

CiG didnt actually say SQ42 was coming in 2016, it was just an assumption. The game will only be ready when its ready and in the 2016 presentation SQ42 was stated to be in grey box or better.

I mean considering all the quotes in that imgur, can you show the 'game will only be ready when its ready' one and when it was said?

[MrAnderson]

I mean considering all the quotes in that imgur, can you show the 'game will only be ready when its ready' one and when it was said?

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/c...m-The-Chairman

As I said earlier this year, Squadron 42 will be done when it is done, and will not be released just to make a date, but instead only when all the technology and content is finished, the game is polished, and it plays great.

I am not willing to compromise the development of a game I believe in with all my heart and soul, and I feel it would be a huge disservice to all the team members that have poured so much love and hard work into Squadron 42 if we rushed it out or cut corners to put it in the hands of everyone who is clamoring for it.

Over the past few years, I’ve seen more than a few eagerly awaited titles release before they were bug free and fully polished. This holiday season is no exception. This is just another reminder to me of why I am so lucky to have such a supportive community, as well as a development model that is funded by people that care about the best game possible, and not about making their quarterly numbers or the big holiday shopping season.