[Megathread] Star Citizen

[kenn9530]

snip

You have already been called out by another poster about your complete nonsense, most of the other posters care little about what is actually true and just want the game to fail anyway, i dont believe a single thing you say so you are not going to win any argument, i go with the information that the CiG devs give me not random posters who dont know anything on MMO champ or the game they are talking about.

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Yes, and when they mentioned Stadia you said, "But they are using AWS so it is cloud." because you don't even know the difference.

The devs have not mentioned anything about stadia at all so if they dont say anything about it they are not using it, pretty simple to understand.

[banmebaby]

You have already been called out by another poster about your complete nonsense

... so have you, by pretty much everyone in the thread, including other backers. What's your point?

most of the other posters care little about what is actually true

No, most posters don’t care what YOU claim to be the truth, because can’t ever seem to be able to backup shit at all, and often, it just contradicts another “truth” of yours.

just want the game to fail

False, that’s just a silly way to attempt to vilify those you disagree with.

It’s not that people want the game to fail, they just don’t believe it will succeed, at least not as CR claims.

win any argument

Pointing your finger at people and repeatedly accusing them of being ignorant can hardly be considered arguing, let alone “winning” it.

i go with the information that the CiG devs give me

No, you don't, official website clearly states that Javelin has an 80 max crew capacity, yet you spent 3 pages arguing against it.

[Kyanion]

You have already been called out by another poster about your complete nonsense

Ah yes that one person that showed up and said 'nuh uh you are wrong' with no explanation as to why they were wrong and never replied? This one?

Ironic from the person that gets called out on their crap all the time and refuses to acknowledge it. lol.

[Ghost of Cow]

The devs have not mentioned anything about stadia at all so if they dont say anything about it they are not using it, pretty simple to understand.

...yeah, no shit, that's what was already said.

Are you a bot?

[kenn9530]

...yeah, no shit, that's what was already said.

Are you a bot?

The poster didnt have a clue what he was posting about, he was unaware that the game actually uses cloud based tech, your posts are nonsense SC use EC2 AWS so to even mention stadia is just dumb.

[Ghost of Cow]

The poster didnt have a clue what he was posting about, he was unaware that the game actually uses cloud based tech, your posts are nonsense SC use EC2 AWS so to even mention stadia is just dumb.

Wow.

You're so far down in that hole you can't even see the daylight anymore.

Did you even manage to forget what the context of that discussion was?

[kenn9530]

Wow.

You're so far down in that hole you can't even see the daylight anymore.

Did you even manage to forget what the context of that discussion was?

Im not one that even mentioned something irrelevant like the cloud in the first place , so you are the one digging a hole because you have no leg to stand on and everyone knows it.

[Ghost of Cow]

Im not one that even mentioned something irrelevant like the cloud in the first place , so you are the one digging a hole because you have no leg to stand on and everyone knows it.

Ah yes. Everyone. Of course.

[kenn9530]

snip

You have not contributed anything of substance so far and not even mentioned anything about the game so everyone knows what your purpose here is and its not to make anything constructive at all just like several posters in here, when a person constantly complains about something it just shows the lack of character they have.

[banmebaby]

You have not contributed anything of substance so far and not even mentioned anything about the game so everyone knows what your purpose here is and its not to make anything constructive at all just like several posters in here, when a person constantly complains about something it just shows the lack of character they have.

Oh yeah, because your posts are hell of constructive, they totally don't consist just in unbacked contradictory lies, accusations and personal attacks towards everyone who isn't praising SC to heavens.

If it wasn't for the lengthy history of such behavior people would just take that foolish sort of crap for high quality trolling.

[Proskill]

got again that issue with the launcher, where play/update button dissapeared. what was the combination of keys to fix it? ctrl - alt - R or something like that, but this one doesnt work

thanks in advance

[Antipathy1018]

Wow.

You're so far down in that hole you can't even see the daylight anymore.

Did you even manage to forget what the context of that discussion was?

This is why I don't tend to post unless someone other than Kenn or Mr.A has a question about what I said.

Here we have Kenn not understanding that I was talking about how Stadia lets you play games without downloading them, the first service to do it was OnLive which I tried years ago but the input lag was pretty bad. Kenn is confusing this with renting servers to connect the players of the game instead what Stadia does which is let you play any game they have without having to load the game on to your hard drive.

[Soikona]

3.17.2 Patch isn't out yet, but trailer has been found.

That’s a really cool trailer. If the game is actually going to release, it looks very much up my street!

[Wilian]

That’s a really cool trailer. If the game is actually going to release, it looks very much up my street!

At this rate of progress your grandchildren will inherit the JPGs of the ships you'd potentially buy.

[InfiniteCharger]

You were talking about how SC loads in an entire model but you are to dense to get that it does not need to do that. You just move the goal post claiming it is only more data when I already said that it is not apples to apples comparison, but you are also to dense to get that. I also did not say that I expected SC to have as many players (in one system) as Eve.

And if SC server does load entire models of everything, the devs are incompetent. Loading location data is enough, you don't need to know the exact size. Also, there is a thing called hitboxes for a reason, you do not use the model to look up if an object is hit, you use a hitbox.

And removing an object when no longer needed isn't hard to do and should have been done ages ago, like before they released the first alpha. That's '1985' level of "tech". So they really are incompetent, that's basically keeping a memory leak on purpose.

So, answer the question, why load data you do not need that only wastes resources? (Or why keep it if no longer needed....)



And there you go, wrong.

Make a cube of 1 meter by 1 meter by 1 meter. How many points does it have? 8. Now scale it up by 10. How many points does it have?

Make a sphere with a diameter of 1 meter, do you know many points a sphere has? I give you a hint 3. All you need. 3 points. The game client can then add vertices to make it more detailed if needed, the server does not need that level of detail. It just needs to know those 3 points and even that's debatable as you could argue the server only needs to know it's location. (and yes, attributes of where it becomes dangerous and when it destroys the ship, but that's not model data)

Can you say tessellation?

Do you know the difference with level of detail and scale? You can make a model of 1mm by 1mm by 1mm with more detail then a model of 1km by 1km by 1km.

The problem with Star Citizen is that the physics are calculated on the server side. This is why things like physicalized inventory are still on the roadmap, because physicalized means part of the physics calculation done on the server. This is also part of the reason you get problems with ships and elevators. That means some level of geometry must be loaded on the server for these physics to work, with the insane part being a future roadmap with salvageable wreckage. Which potentially means more physics calculations to determine how ships get destroyed and what cargo remains and can it be looted. All of which is a total hog in terms of network and server load......


So technically Ken is not wrong here. But you are right that this is a bad way to design a game intended to for massive numbers of players.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/s...s-server-side/

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen...how_you_proof/

https://starcitizen-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Physics

https://askagamedev.tumblr.com/post/...hink-elevators

[Amorac]

The problem with Star Citizen is that the physics are calculated on the server side. This is why things like physicalized inventory are still on the roadmap, because physicalized means part of the physics calculation done on the server. This is also part of the reason you get problems with ships and elevators. That means some level of geometry must be loaded on the server for these physics to work, with the insane part being a future roadmap with salvageable wreckage. Which potentially means more physics calculations to determine how ships get destroyed and what cargo remains and can it be looted. All of which is a total hog in terms of network and server load......

So technically Ken is not wrong here. But you are right that this is a bad way to design a game intended to for massive numbers of players.

Hm, yea but they still (should) use hitboxes for that, I still see no reason to load every point/vertex of a model (on the server), more geometry then that is not needed (and hitboxes can be complex as well). Even for a destroyed ship or part of, a hit box should suffice to tell the clients its state so it can render it.

Like you say that means some level of geometry, so not the entire model. I mean, an oil barrel with 6 points for 'top circle' would be just as fine as 6000 points, and the cargo bay doesn't need every point either, just enough to get the rough shape. If they do load in the entire model that's just weird and a waste of resources as the server has a lot more surfaces to consider while the result won't differ that much. I mean, isn't that what programmers do, get rid of data you have no need for and don't load what is just wasted. (Also doubt the server kicks the barrel to see how it rolls in a virtual environment, it's 'just math' )

At least not with CPU/GPU power for the foreseeable future. If they do and just found a way to add 3 to 4 times of players per server, performance is going to tank as soon as they implement physicalized inventory and all (well, it will tank regardless esp. if every bit of equipment is going to be part of that)

Then again, we are talking, apparently, about a developer that does not unload data that is no longer needed for some reason.

Will be interesting to see the amount of data being send to clients <> servers and also server instance 1 <> server instance 2 <> server instance 3 etc...

(I also remember the WoW elevator boss rather well.. )

Thanks for the links and reply, a lot better then some other posters.

[banmebaby]

got again that issue with the launcher, where play/update button dissapeared. what was the combination of keys to fix it? ctrl - alt - R or something like that, but this one doesnt work

thanks in advance

Sounds like a weird feature, I'm sure =P

Your RSI Launcher will be missing the "Launch" button if you accidentally melted your game package, have only pledged for a standalone ship, or are trying to use an old PTU RSI Launcher to access our Live environment.

If you reclaim or melt a package on your account, you may have melted your game package. Without the game package, you cannot install or run Star Citizen.



NOTE: We are tracking and investigating an issue where players may see no launch/install buttons regardless of the status of their game packages. If this occurs, there are a few possible work arounds:

Completely shut down the launcher, ensure that it is not still running in the Windows Taskbar, and then restart the launcher.
Logout and back in to the launcher multiple times.
Clear the Launcher cache by bringing the launcher into focus and hitting Ctrl + Shift + Alt + R to attempt to bring the buttons back. (This will log you out)

Please also report the situation, any steps taken, and what did and did not work to correct this via the Issue Council.

[Rennadrel]

Honestly trying to offload so much physics calculations to the server seems like bad design when PCs are more than capable of rendering some form of physics on their own. Trying to do that all en masse seems like a design mistake that's going to hurt them long term. I don't see why physical inventory shouldn't just be rendered on the client side.

[kenn9530]

This is why I don't tend to post unless someone other than Kenn or Mr.A has a question about what I said.

Here we have Kenn not understanding that I was talking about how Stadia lets you play games without downloading them, the first service to do it was OnLive which I tried years ago but the input lag was pretty bad. Kenn is confusing this with renting servers to connect the players of the game instead what Stadia does which is let you play any game they have without having to load the game on to your hard drive.

You are the one being confused.

A poster makes a comment about cloud not knowing the servers are at least partly cloud based, i mearly stated what the servers SC uses were using cloud in some format, there is nothing to confuse about that statement, stadia is a different company altogether and SC doesnt use it so to even mention it is just dumb when we already know they use EC2 AWS.

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Honestly trying to offload so much physics calculations to the server seems like bad design when PCs are more than capable of rendering some form of physics on their own. Trying to do that all en masse seems like a design mistake that's going to hurt them long term. I don't see why physical inventory shouldn't just be rendered on the client side.

A ton of work the server currently does will be offloaded on the quanta simulation once thats ready to put into the game so as systems get completed the servers will eventually get less and less work to do, server meshing will also divide a ton of work the current servers do.

Physical inv is probably required so if one player puts something in a ship or box all other players can see it if they look, that doesnt happen atm apart from checking the lootable boxes.

Currently the servers are running pretty smooth with barely any issues, just the normal desync stuff with lots of AI that spawn on a regular basis.

[Edge-]

A ton of work the server currently does will be offloaded on the quanta simulation once thats ready to put into the game so as systems get completed the servers will eventually get less and less work to do, server meshing will also divide a ton of work the current servers do.

But...the server is doing that quanta simulation too, no?