[Prot] Fix my Tanking!

[Moussaka]

Also, I prefer to use Light's Hammer on virtually every fight, I like the utility it gives me for threat, slows, heals, etc. But some people say Holy Prism is better, is it a noticable difference?

You have to try it to find out what fits best with your raid imo, but there are fights where one or the other is better.
I'm kind the opposite, where I find LH only useful on Thok and Garrosh. I like HP because it gives me a more active play style and a better room for decision.

Although I'm interested what you guys are using on fight to fight basis. Would be great to have some sort of list

[trystero]

The fraps looked fine, though your UI confuses me a bit (I keep thinking that you have wings available because I see its icon on the top). But hey, it's a UI, personal preference.

One question I have is when does SS > EF? My friend told me to use SS on fights with an immense amount of physical damage, instead of EF. I'd just like to know if this is true?

I may use it on the last few heroics but I've not gotten to those yet. Some of the tanks here who've done H Paragons/Garrosh may be able to tell you whether SS is viable there. SS becomes an option when you're in danger, generally, of being gibbed. I heard that you should use it on Nazgrim because of Execute, but with SotR it hardly does a dent.

but I am a bit "trigger shy" when it comes to blowing my big CD's. I'm not sure why, I always feel like I need to keep it for an "oh F***" moment.

That's what they're for mostly...no worries. Unless you anticipate a heavy damage phase incoming, they should be used as 'oh shit' buttons. Of course, if you die with them on your bar, you have to take some responsibility for the death, so what constitutes an 'oh shit' moment may be a bit more...fluid...than what some people assume it is. I tend to save Guardian for shit hit the fan moments and am pretty liberal with using AD. At least on progression - farm I'm too lazy to hit shift+1 for AD.

I also noticed I tend to leave EF off for about ~5 seconds if I know that I'm going to take a big hit (like from 100% to 30%), because I can use it to top myself back up. Is this a good way to use it?

Nothing wrong with that, but you are costing yourself damage with 4P/WoG glyph (if you use it). On fights where my survivability isn't challenged, or times in a fight where it isn't (such as the pull on D Shamans) I'll use EF at 3 BoG to try and fish extra DP procs...

[Deleted]

Hi guys, I posted here last week in regards to feeling like I get hit too hard - making it hard for healers to heal me.

I've taken the input given and these are some things I've been trying to work on:
*On taunt swaps, make sure I have 5HP before i taunt.
*If i dont have enough HP for the taunt, use a DP, so I don't get rolled because I don't have active mitigation up.
*Try and time SoTR's with the melee swing of the boss, don't cast it when theres no physical damage going out.
*I've changed from holy avenger to Divine Purpose on most fights.

One question I have is when does SS > EF? My friend told me to use SS on fights with an immense amount of physical damage, instead of EF. I'd just like to know if this is true?
Also, I prefer to use Light's Hammer on virtually every fight, I like the utility it gives me for threat, slows, heals, etc. But some people say Holy Prism is better, is it a noticable difference?

I also fraps'd a kill of Seigecrafter this week, and am just wondering if anyone could watch it to see if they have any tips they could give me.
From watching it I noticed that I do use my small CD's, but I am a bit "trigger shy" when it comes to blowing my big CD's. I'm not sure why, I always feel like I need to keep it for an "oh F***" moment.
I also noticed I tend to leave EF off for about ~5 seconds if I know that I'm going to take a big hit (like from 100% to 30%), because I can use it to top myself back up. Is this a good way to use it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msrOr9yS7KI
Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...teara/advanced

After my last post, and now that I have a 4 set, on most boss kills I have >90% uptime on EF, and >50% uptime on SoTR now that I use Divine Purpose. I feel like I've improved so thank you

Your ui could use some work. Do you really need to see buffs/debuff of the target of your focus? (do you even on your focus?) do you need to see your own characters: name, lvl, and so on? (buffs in the middle of the screen seems rather silly too).

EF is superior on pretty much all fights. Specially with 4p.

Some people on here will advocate that using the initial heal from EF is the intended way to use it, I personally prefer to keep it up full time unless I'm waiting with a bit of downtime or need it up and might not be able to refresh it later on. For instance on garrosh hc I tend to wait with using it at the end of p1 until he's sending me into the transition. On siegecrafter the 2nd time I tank the boss I also wait a little bit to use it after his blast to top myself while healers are otherwise occupied.

[Deleted]

I may use it on the last few heroics but I've not gotten to those yet. Some of the tanks here who've done H Paragons/Garrosh may be able to tell you whether SS is viable there. SS becomes an option when you're in danger, generally, of being gibbed. I heard that you should use it on Nazgrim because of Execute, but with SotR it hardly does a dent.

I wouldnt say you "should" use it on Nazgrim. More that it is perfectly a viable option, especially if you are undergearing it. But as you say, SotR should be enough.

As for the later heroics, EF wins hands down on Siegecrafter and Garrosh. I know some people use SS for Thok, I think that is fine for personal survivability, but during progression I loved using EF to help the healers out by healing the raid during the transition phases. For Paragons, hmm, EF wins hands down for the first 5 paragons. Depending on your strat for the last 4, if you are tanking Ka'Roz and POSSIBLY if you tank Wind-reaver, SS could be viable. But, I rather ask myself the question why is the paladin tanking Ka'Roz since without doubt paladins are the by far worst tank for that job. I would definately use EF for the entire fight bar Ka'Roz tanking, to which I probably would use EF anyway.

Honestly, EF is so strong, you can never go wrong with it on any fight. Unless you specifically understand why and when to go SS, you should just automatically go for EF. There is no fight where SS handsdown wins over EF, just some situational scenarios.

[Apaz]

Your ui could use some work. Do you really need to see buffs/debuff of the target of your focus? (do you even on your focus?) do you need to see your own characters: name, lvl, and so on? (buffs in the middle of the screen seems rather silly too).

You're right, I really shouldn't use xperl anymore, but I've been using it since 2007, and I've tried to change to pitbul and shadowed unit frames many times and I just can't get used to it. It's kind of like when I made the switch (the benefitial switch IMO) of moving unit frames from the top to the bottom. Do you have a preferred unitframe you could suggest? (Perhaps where I could initially give it an xperl style look and gradually work on cleaning it up?)

Also, I set my focus like that for Galakras Heroic so i could see the stacks on the drakes flying in the air, and just forgot to set it back, so it's not usually that big >_<

[Deleted]

Some people on here will advocate that using the initial heal from EF is the intended way to use it, I personally prefer to keep it up full time unless I'm waiting with a bit of downtime or need it up and might not be able to refresh it later on. For instance on garrosh hc I tend to wait with using it at the end of p1 until he's sending me into the transition. On siegecrafter the 2nd time I tank the boss I also wait a little bit to use it after his blast to top myself while healers are otherwise occupied.

I prefer using it right before I reach my adds in the first P2 transition so I get full up-time on the WoG glyph for the adds. EF is off GCD anyway. Using it when going up seems like a perfect waste of WoG glyph as there is no damage at all going on.

I do not use the 4p, so my way of runnig around with EF.

Boss deals negliable non-threatening damage (i.e. SoI is enough to keep me alive) - I sometimes let EF drop with no intention of wasting HoPo to get it up again. With 4p I would just go for throughput, bosses like Protectors HC and Sha of Pride HC comes to mind

Boss deals moderate amount of substainable damage, not life threatening - I try to just maintain EF all the time, a fight like Spoils HC or Malkorak HC and similar.

Boss deals high amount of substainable damage, may be with a bit of burst, could be life threatening - I try to maintain EF all the time, but when it comes time to reapply it I try to time so I get good usage of the intitial EF heal. Like Thok HC.

Boss deals high amount predictable burst damage, low amount of substained damage - Using EF is all about the initial heal, like Siegecrafter HC or tanking Earthbreaker on Shamans HC.

Of course, that is just a very rough guideline that is easy to deviate from. Some bosses have different damage patterns in different phases aswell so could use multiple ways of using EF on the same boss.

[Deleted]

Hello, not so much an 'issue' but if there's any advice to give, please, I'd like some. I'ved been looking through some logs of other prot pally's in 10 mans and they seem to be pulling higher numbers than me. I know this could be for numerous reason, like different tanking methods etc, but still.

eu battle net /wow/en/character/kazzak/Crakkabread/advanced
worldoflogs /guilds/113253/ (I'm in ALL of them)

(Can't post links yet)

Thanks in advance!

[Jellospally]

Hello, not so much an 'issue' but if there's any advice to give, please, I'd like some. I'ved been looking through some logs of other prot pally's in 10 mans and they seem to be pulling higher numbers than me. I know this could be for numerous reason, like different tanking methods etc, but still.

eu battle net /wow/en/character/kazzak/Crakkabread/advanced
worldoflogs /guilds/113253/ (I'm in ALL of them)

(Can't post links yet)

Thanks in advance!

Hand of Sac glyph(Don't see a reason to use this on any fight you lose too much by not having other glyphs). Focus Shield is massive dps increase on single target fights. Alabaster is the 3rd glyph you should be using for dps(though id say WoG is probably better with 4 set but ill never run 4 set)

No Final Wrath Glyph? No single target Holy Wrath minor glyph?

You Judgment to CS ratio is off(imo) maybe its more dps to judge more if you aren't using DP idk. DP for life.

Holy Avenger isn't that good(maybe it is with your haste idk) I personally have 21250 haste and 22% crit atm so DP is massive dps except on Malk and Thok where I have to use HA.

You don't combine Eng Gloves + Wings.

The fights you have Holy Prism on you don't use it that often. My guilds kill time was 4:24 today on Sha of Pride I had 13 and yours was 6:17 and did 8.

Can't really compare too many fights with myself to yours because I solo tank(or tank 95% of the fight) on most of the first half of the instance. Maybe it is just the less haste but you seem to not be attacking enough. Even your monk isn't doing that much damage.

You need to let that monk let you solo tank thok so you can get a tail tip....lol or a ring/helm or something.

[Deleted]

Hand of Sac glyph(Don't see a reason to use this on any fight you lose too much by not having other glyphs). Focus Shield is massive dps increase on single target fights. Alabaster is the 3rd glyph you should be using for dps(though id say WoG is probably better with 4 set but ill never run 4 set)

No Final Wrath Glyph? No single target Holy Wrath minor glyph?

You Judgment to CS ratio is off(imo) maybe its more dps to judge more if you aren't using DP idk. DP for life.

Holy Avenger isn't that good(maybe it is with your haste idk) I personally have 21250 haste and 22% crit atm so DP is massive dps except on Malk and Thok where I have to use HA.

You don't combine Eng Gloves + Wings.

The fights you have Holy Prism on you don't use it that often. My guilds kill time was 4:24 today on Sha of Pride I had 13 and yours was 6:17 and did 8.

Can't really compare too many fights with myself to yours because I solo tank(or tank 95% of the fight) on most of the first half of the instance. Maybe it is just the less haste but you seem to not be attacking enough. Even your monk isn't doing that much damage.

You need to let that monk let you solo tank thok so you can get a tail tip....lol or a ring/helm or something.

Well, any advice? Also, struggling to hold aggro on trash to the monk. Is that normal? I can be tanking trash for like 30 seconds, he comes in and takes it straight away.

[Jellospally]

As for the threat thing. Nah you really can't do much other than keep Conc down and HotR and hope for AS procs heh.

Really if you want to max your damage you are gonna have to tank longer. Take more stacks of debuffs/solo tank fights. Granted monks still do more damage than pallies and can solo tank just as well....

Not sure what you really can do other than get 21250 haste and go crit instead of mastery and drop 4 set for max dps.

[Deleted]

Heya.

Just picked up the heroic tier chest from Sha. I'm wondering if i should pick the ret chest instead of the prot chest? It has a ton of haste and the 4p doesnt feel that attractive to me (maybe im wrong), any ideas?

[jasdasm]

take ret go for 50% haste !

[Nillo]

If you're going for off-set better get a warforged item imo. Tier chest isn't that bad and the 4p is fairly useful on some encounters.

[Deleted]

4p is amazing. Such a quality of life improvement and makes for much smoother gameplay- specially with DP.

That being said if you don't plan on using 4p definately take the ret piece over the prot piece (assuming you still want to stick to 2p - head + gloves is the obvious choice).

[MerinPally]

If you're going for 4p you want the legs as the non tier item. I'd recommend the 4p but I know some people wouldn't. Failing getting the 4p if you don't want it then go with what Spacebubble says.

[Deleted]

I have http://www.wowhead.com/item=104492 atm, don't want to get rid of that for a normal mode tier helm.

But, with the 4p you can more or less spam WoG with +3 stacks of BoG? Does it take into account current stack of BoG to amplify the heal, or does it count as a 0 stack BoG heal?

Guess i have to try it out before i can make a call.. aaah decisions decisions.

[celinamuna]

I have http://www.wowhead.com/item=104492 atm, don't want to get rid of that for a normal mode tier helm.

But, with the 4p you can more or less spam WoG with +3 stacks of BoG? Does it take into account current stack of BoG to amplify the heal, or does it count as a 0 stack BoG heal?

Guess i have to try it out before i can make a call.. aaah decisions decisions.

It burns the stacks, so you can't really spam it. Which is why you would still go up to 5.

[Deleted]

I have http://www.wowhead.com/item=104492 atm, don't want to get rid of that for a normal mode tier helm.

But, with the 4p you can more or less spam WoG with +3 stacks of BoG? Does it take into account current stack of BoG to amplify the heal, or does it count as a 0 stack BoG heal?

Guess i have to try it out before i can make a call.. aaah decisions decisions.

If tank damage isn't an issue on the fight, you can certainly game DP procs at 3+ stacks - it eats up your current bog stacks so yes the amount does matter.

If it's a hard hitting boss (to some extent siegecrafter but more so paragons & garrosh) wait till 5 stacks

[Nillo]

I like spamming EF at 3 stacks to max my Shor and Glyph of WoG uptimes on bosses where a high powered EF hot isn't necessary.

[celinamuna]

I like spamming EF at 3 stacks to max my Shor and Glyph of WoG uptimes on bosses where a high powered EF hot isn't necessary.

Hmm, I can see it on farm bosses, but personally i'd rather use 5 stack one and just know that i don't need any outside healing (i mean, at this point, healers are mostly to heal up the dps)