Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[PhaelixWW]

So considering the rittenhouse trial, he shot 4 rounds within 0,8 seconds.

Slow machine guns fire 8 rounds per second. I mean, what's the point of banning machine guns if the semi-auto ones are just as fast and with a velocity that deals almost always fatal wounds?

I mean, some people have argued just that.

But also, even a revolved can be fired quickly.

Here's Jerry Miculek, shooting 8 rounds out of a revolver in under a second, and also 12 rounds with a reload in between each 6, in under 3 seconds.



But realistically, most fully automatic fire is going to be faster than a human can achieve. More importantly, there's really no justification for automatic fire to be available for defense or hunting purposes, whereas there is easily an argument to be made for semi-automatic fire.

[Mayhem]

I mean, some people have argued just that.

But also, even a revolved can be fired quickly.

Here's Jerry Miculek, shooting 8 rounds out of a revolver in under a second, and also 12 rounds with a reload in between each 6, in under 3 seconds.



But realistically, most fully automatic fire is going to be faster than a human can achieve. More importantly, there's really no justification for automatic fire to be available for defense or hunting purposes, whereas there is easily an argument to be made for semi-automatic fire.

Oh sure there'll always be people that achieve almost impossible-looking things, but 4 shots in under a second do not strike me as a needed feature, neither for hunting nor self-defense especially with a firearm that deals these kinds of wounds with every round.

[PhaelixWW]

Oh sure there'll always be people that achieve almost impossible-looking things, but 4 shots in under a second do not strike me as a needed feature, neither for hunting nor self-defense especially with a firearm that deals these kinds of wounds with every round.

Then you've never been charged by a wild boar, where a round as small and light as a .223 is far from ideal.

There's a reason why a lot of people use semi-automatic .308 rifles to hunt boar, for example. A .308 bullet is generally fired with 80-90% the muzzle velocity of a .223, but 3x the weight.

In fact, most hunting rounds are capable of much, much more damage than a .223.

But most importantly, a manual action firearm would be too slow for effective use as a defensive weapon. The next step up is semi-automatic. So there you go.

[Mayhem]

Then you've never been charged by a wild boar, where a round as small and light as a .223 is far from ideal.

There's a reason why a lot of people use semi-automatic .308 rifles to hunt boar, for example. A .308 bullet is generally fired with 80-90% the muzzle velocity of a .223, but 3x the weight.

In fact, most hunting rounds are capable of much, much more damage than a .223.

But most importantly, a manual action firearm would be too slow for effective use as a defensive weapon. The next step up is semi-automatic. So there you go.

Oh, I think you don't understand what my point is. It's the combination that I think is too much. Sure if you go getting chased by wild boars because apparently, all other equipment that is out there is too much but a firearm that tears large parts of flesh out of the body with every shot is totally fair and ok, I understand your point of needing something like this.

For civilians running around in the streets, not so much.

[Zeth Hawkins]

https://www.lubbockonline.com/story/...on/8765295002/

New shooting. Man goes to property of ex-wife and her new partner (shooter) to get his son as part of his custody. Son was not at the house, father refused to leave, shooter keeps telling him to leave then goes into house to retrieve gun. Shooter comes back out onto porch with weapon, father presses his chest against the shooter's and says, "use it". Father grabs the gun, shooter fires warning shot at ground, father grabs the gun again and swings the shooter away, shooter almost falls to the ground. Shooter then shoots father twice while father appears to be standing still.

I could see this going either way, but there did not seem to be any threat toward the shooter's life or any implication he would suffer great bodily harm from the Father. I will lean toward a manslaughter charge.

[Edge-]

I'm glad literally every minor inconvenience is now a deadly threat to a person and we need to instantly get a gun and be ready to shoot - showing no remorse or shock afterwards but instead all the swagger we'd expect of a Paul Kersey wannabe - rather than doing what every sensible human being would do which is to return inside and call the police to report that an individual is trespassing on their property.

This is a pretty perfect example of the kind of toxic machismo and absolute insanity that has warped "gun culture" into what it has currently become.

I'm mostly just shocked at how absolutely calm and collected he was after he killed an unarmed man who was not a threat to him. That's some sociopath level shit.

Great job stepdad, you get to explain to your stepkid why his biological father is dead.

[Endus]

https://www.lubbockonline.com/story/...on/8765295002/

New shooting. Man goes to property of ex-wife and her new partner (shooter) to get his son as part of his custody. Son was not at the house, father refused to leave, shooter keeps telling him to leave then goes into house to retrieve gun. Shooter comes back out onto porch with weapon, father presses his chest against the shooter's and says, "use it". Father grabs the gun, shooter fires warning shot at ground, father grabs the gun again and swings the shooter away, shooter almost falls to the ground. Shooter then shoots father twice while father appears to be standing still.

I could see this going either way, but there did not seem to be any threat toward the shooter's life or any implication he would suffer great bodily harm from the Father. I will lean toward a manslaughter charge.

See that bit in bold?

That's why it's first-degree, premeditated murder. That's what "premeditation" is. He made a choice to go and get his gun so he could kill his stepson's biological father.

[Stormdash]

See that bit in bold?

That's why it's first-degree, premeditated murder. That's what "premeditation" is. He made a choice to go and get his gun so he could kill his stepson's biological father.

He'll end up convicted of manslaughter.

[postman1782]

He'll end up convicted of manslaughter.

If he only gets manslaughter for leaving and coming back, then the judge needs to be fucking replaced.

[PhaelixWW]

If he only gets manslaughter for leaving and coming back, then the judge needs to be fucking replaced.

What does it have to do with the judge? The DA sets the charges and the jury renders a verdict on the available charges.

There are very, very few avenues in which the judge would be directly responsible for the verdict.

[postman1782]

What does it have to do with the judge? The DA sets the charges and the jury renders a verdict on the available charges.

There are very, very few avenues in which the judge would be directly responsible for the verdict.

I don't know, but the manslaughter shouldn't be an option if someone leaves, has time to cool off, and come back with a gun and murders someone.

[Egomaniac]

Weirdest thing is after Kyle shoots the dad ...the dad's new wife, instead of actually calling 9/11, starts on Kyle like "you did this Kyle, not him".

Like, I dunno, maybe she's in shock or something...but yelling at the guy with the gun while her husband is bleeding out seems a little counter-intuitive.

- - - Updated - - -

This is a pretty perfect example of the kind of toxic machismo and absolute insanity that has warped "gun culture" into what it has currently become.

Not to victim blame...but that toxic machismo was on display from both men. I mean, Kyle is the asshole that brought a gun into their little dick-waving contest and absolutely needs to be charged with murder. But, Dad wasn't operating on his best behaviour either.

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I don't know, but the manslaughter shouldn't be an option if someone leaves, has time to cool off, and come back with a gun and murders someone.

You'd think that...but this is Texas....

[postman1782]

Weirdest thing is after Kyle shoots the dad ...the dad's new wife, instead of actually calling 9/11, starts on Kyle like "you did this Kyle, not him".

Like, I dunno, maybe she's in shock or something...but yelling at the guy with the gun while her husband is bleeding out seems a little counter-intuitive.

- - - Updated - - -



Not to victim blame...but that toxic machismo was on display from both men. I mean, Kyle is the asshole that brought a gun into their little dick-waving contest and absolutely needs to be charged with murder. But, Dad wasn't operating on his best behaviour either.

- - - Updated - - -



You'd think that...but this is Texas....

Yeah, that makes sense, they do hate women and fetishize killing anyone they can.

[Armael]

Not to victim blame...but that toxic machismo was on display from both men. I mean, Kyle is the asshole that brought a gun into their little dick-waving contest and absolutely needs to be charged with murder. But, Dad wasn't operating on his best behaviour either.

Even though he wasn't on his "best behaviour," it doesn't mean he deserved the other guy dialing it to an 11 and shooting him.

[Egomaniac]

Even though he wasn't on his "best behaviour," it doesn't mean he deserved the other guy dialing it to an 11 and shooting him.

Please, don't take what I said the wrong way...I am in no way suggesting that the dad deserved it. You bolded the last sentence of what I said...but take another look at the previous one.

Not to victim blame...but that toxic machismo was on display from both men. I mean, Kyle is the asshole that brought a gun into their little dick-waving contest and absolutely needs to be charged with murder. But, Dad wasn't operating on his best behaviour either.

I'm just saying that not a single person involved in that confrontation was using good judgment. Bringing out the gun is obviously far and away the most egregious example of that.

[Armael]

Oh yeah, I agree. Just pointing out in general, way too many people escalate the most mundane of things to an 11 and now you must die for it.

[Egomaniac]

Also, what the fuck is it with dude's named Kyle bringing guns out when they ain't needed?

[anveena]

https://www.lubbockonline.com/story/...on/8765295002/

New shooting. Man goes to property of ex-wife and her new partner (shooter) to get his son as part of his custody. Son was not at the house, father refused to leave, shooter keeps telling him to leave then goes into house to retrieve gun. Shooter comes back out onto porch with weapon, father presses his chest against the shooter's and says, "use it". Father grabs the gun, shooter fires warning shot at ground, father grabs the gun again and swings the shooter away, shooter almost falls to the ground. Shooter then shoots father twice while father appears to be standing still.

I could see this going either way, but there did not seem to be any threat toward the shooter's life or any implication he would suffer great bodily harm from the Father. I will lean toward a manslaughter charge.

Looks like a justified shoot. Hopefully he isn't charged.

[Armael]

Looks like a justified shoot. Hopefully he isn't charged.

A gun wasn't necessary at all in this situation. Kyle's life or property was never threatened. He leaves to get the gun. Kyle dialed the situation to an 11 for no reason. The Father even had a 100% legitimate reason to be there.

[PhaelixWW]

Also, what the fuck is it with dude's named Kyle bringing guns out when they ain't needed?

They've just teed up the next South Park special.

Looks like a justified shoot. Hopefully he isn't charged.

This was in no way justified, even if it ultimately doesn't lead to a charge/conviction.