Boy... this makes me really eager to stop advocating mens rights...

[Deleted]

I cannot be blamed if you fail to see a point just because it has to be implied using a little of your brain cells




Your logic would ONLY make sense if consider that all woman are skanks that only care about money. But I will be nice and explain to you again, feel free to post whatever else after to avoid facing the argument.

The situation is not supposed to be "fair" for men, and it wont be "fair", because AS IS the situation is already very unbalanced unfair for woman. Imagine if the woman in question gets pregnant and we live in a world that only woman is hold responsible for the consequences (wanted or not) from having sex. What the woman has to loose? Read my post again maybe now you will get it.

What man has to loose? In the hypothetical world I said, men has nothing to loose. You might even not be aware that you are a father.

So thanks to many good men and women taking care of our legal system, they made sure that in the real world, men will have to hold responsibility for its acts somehow. Since you cannot carry the baby yourself for 9 months, congratulations you gonna be hold responsible with the only thing you can give away: money.

So because the woman gets pregnant and CHOOSES TO KEEP THE BABY, I need to be forced through 20 years of financial slavery.

Nice insulting me for the lack of brain cells, because I can tell you for a fact that 20 years is A LOT LONGER THAN 9 months.

[Cybran]

Your protection is condoms or abstinence, use them or don't have sex.

Aren't "abstinence" or "don't have sex" the same thing? This is sexist.

No, I advocate personal responsibility. If you can't handle the situations that can arise from having sex then you should not have sex in the first place. You're not entitled to having sex.

Again, Women have 6 months to terminate their responsibilty and ruin a man's live? We want legislation that will give us some sort of protection. If you keep yelling "don't have sex, because you are the inferiorior gender" we will keep calling you out as a Sexist.

You have the option of abstinence aswell. As I said, you're not entitled to have sex just because you're a man.

You are saying. We have to deal with it, because we are the wrong gender? This is still sexist.

And pregnancy is inherently unequal. Men cannot get pregnant, women can. You cannot try to equalize it.

So we are inferior, we get that. We know we are. We wan't laws that will help us fight the inherent inequality.

You do know sperm donors do not have sex with the client(Atleast not here in Sweden.) that's gonna receive the sperm, right? As such, you'll want the pleasure of the sex in itself and then be regarded as a sperm donor. That just reeks of "I DUN WANNA TAKE RESPONSIBILITY" and a sense of entitlement to having sex.

In Sweden to be a sperm donor you're required to have an altruistic view about it. Not something even close to your view on it as you want the sex but be free from any responsibilities, you want the pleasure sex gives and no responsibility.

Women can terminate their responsibility in the first 6 months or give the child up for adoption after it's born. Men deserve legal protection to correct the current inequality. As long as you are against that you remain a sexist.

[Deleted]

I don't know what a "pro-lifer" is and do not care what it is.

People who are against abortion. They think that if a woman can't handle a kid and needs abortion, she should've thought about it before she had sex.

I'm going to post my edited reply again:

This is the exact same argument that pro-lifers use against abortion. Do you know that?

And do you know what, the counter-argument to this has nothing to do with "it's my body I do what I choose". No the counter argument to that is that people will have sex anyways, and there will be a lot of kids that people do not want. Thus out of practicality we want abortion to make sure we do not have too many unwanted kids in our society. This is a better solution for everyone.

But why do we not allow men to get a say about whether to abort or not? After all, if the dad doesn't want the kid, it's still "unwated". Well because of the bodily integrity of women. So the next best thing is to allow men to financially opt out of their rights and responsibilities towards the kid. This puts pressure on the woman to not have the kid, because clearly the kid will not have two willing parents. This still gives her the right to have the kid if she thinks she can handle it alone. A unique opportunity only for women.

Again - everyone wins except gold digging whores.

[starlord]

She's pregnant.

because of the risk you took.

Now you either have to be with her or pay money, either way, the game is rigged.

And unlike the Legacy of Kain games, Our coin cannot land on it's side unless she dies by some freak accident.

biology is a buyer's market. it lands on your side when you pick the side (hint, dont flip it).

[Deleted]

Please, the noble goals of those feminists who wanted Equality have been met years ago, and those with any lick of sense have moved beyond a monogender based Equalism movement.

Those who still hang their heads under the notion of Feminism are either hateful towards men, or so blindsided by the extremism of the movement they don't see how extreme it is.


An advocate for women's rights =/= a feminist.

You're mistaking modern feminism for the single entity it was at the beginning, as I said there are a multitude of different ideologies at play here and it would be nice if you would read up before making incredibly stupid statements.

[Deleted]

oh really.

you were saying?

you dont have to be with her.

Not if she blackmails you with accusations of rape. And you can't win as a man since you know, all rapists are men. Welcome to the real world, where shit like this happens.

[Deleted]

because of the risk you took.

biology is a buyer's market. it lands on your side when you pick the side (hint, dont flip it).

So I have the responsability to contraception, but she does not?

I am sorry but contraception does not work 100%, so if the small chance of the die is down to her being on the pill or not.... Where is the risk I took again?

[Deleted]

I cannot be blamed if you fail to see a point just because it has to be implied using a little of your brain cells




Your logic would ONLY make sense if consider that all woman are skanks that only care about money. But I will be nice and explain to you again, feel free to post whatever else after to avoid facing the argument.

The situation is not supposed to be "fair" for men, and it wont be "fair", because AS IS the situation is already very unbalanced unfair for woman. Imagine if the woman in question gets pregnant and we live in a world that only woman is hold responsible for the consequences (wanted or not) from having sex. What the woman has to loose? Read my post again maybe now you will get it.

What man has to loose? In the hypothetical world I said, men has nothing to loose. You might even not be aware that you are a father.

So thanks to many good men and women taking care of our legal system, they made sure that in the real world, men will have to hold responsibility for its acts somehow. Since you cannot carry the baby yourself for 9 months, congratulations you gonna be hold responsible with the only thing you can give away: money.

If we are going to be hypothetical what if the women signes a deal before they have sex that states that "she is of legal age and does not demand anything of him if she gets pregnant". Would the justice system validate it?

And in the real world for this example, let's say I am a single male and got with a single women, should I check her to make sure she is of legal age (even if to be in a bar you need to be of such, maybe she has a fake ID) and do I need to check where the condom gets after I used it, or if she is really on birth control?

While the sistem today has it's logic only when applied to a real couple or family (as in married couple) it leaves the rest fucked up.

[starlord]

So I have the responsability to contraception, but she does not?

I am sorry but contraception does not work 100%,so if the small chance of the die is down to her being on the pill or not.... Where is the risk I took again?

right there.

[Deleted]

You're mistaking modern feminism for the single entity it was at the beginning, as I said there are a multitude of different ideologies at play here and it would be nice if you would read up before making incredibly stupid statements.

I have read up on them, but let me just make a statement.

Would a benign and incredibly equal movement of female rights advocation be arguing on a World of Warcraft off topic forum that men have no rights to their child or their financial future if pregnancy is conceived?

Pretty sure TRUE Equalists would be saying "If Women have a get out clause for pregnancy, Men should have some protection too".

[Deleted]

And unlike the Legacy of Kain games, Our coin cannot land on it's side unless she dies by some freak accident.

If you know what I mean,

[Deleted]

right there.

So all the responsability rests on the man, yet he gets no say in the outcome?

Thats very very sexist.

[starlord]

Not if she blackmails you with accusations of rape.

yeah blackmail is bad.. what does that have to do with this?

And you can't win as a man since you know, all rapists are men. Welcome to the real world, where shit like this happens.

different issue.

[Deleted]

yeah blackmail is bad.. what does that have to do with this?
different issue.

No it isn't. They are linked to each other, and it's obvious. Hell, even my MOTHER warned me several times in life about women like that.

[Deleted]

yeah blackmail is bad.. what does that have to do with this?
different issue.

Actually, it all links in with men's rights. This is not just a pregnancy thread you know.

---------- Post added 2013-01-20 at 12:20 PM ----------

You forgot to quote the rest of my message .

The best part is, not one of these people have answered my Hypothetical.

What happens if the man was date raped? Is it HIS FAULT he may have impregnated a woman while being raped?

[Deleted]

That was really.. bad. Maybe even beyond horrible.

Not a far stretch from, "You could get someone pregnant." -> "You're not entitled to have sex."

Thing is, it's entirely possible for a woman to force, trick or blackmail a man into parenthood. Are you still insistent a man be financially supportive for a child if the former can be proven?

[Deleted]

Aren't "abstinence" or "don't have sex" the same thing? This is sexist.

You could say they're the same yes. I don't see how it is sexist. You're not entitled to have sex with women just because you're a man you know and women are not entitled to having sex with men just because they're women.

Again, Woman have 6 months to terminate their responsibilty and ruin a man's live? We want legislation that will give us some sort of protection. If you keep yelling "don't have sex, because you are the inferiorior gender" we will keep calling you out as a Sexist.

Telling people they're not entitled to having sex, is sexist? I'd say the same to women who think they're entitled to having sex.

You are saying. We have to deal with it, because we are the opposite gender? This is still sexist.

No, I'm saying "deal with it" because you were equally responsible in getting the woman pregnant as she was for having sex with you.

So we are inferior, we get that. We know we are. We wan't laws that will help us.

Exactly how are you inferior?

Women can terminate their responsibility in the first 6 months or give the child up for adoption after it's born. Men deserve legal protection to correct the current inequality. As long as you are against that you remain a sexist.

Why you even wrote this in response to the quoted text I do not understand. You talked about wanting to be regarded as a sperm donor - you don't have sex with the one who is gonna receive the sperm if you're a sperm donor. You put the sperm in a glass container which they use later for insemination. You don't get to have sex with the receiver as a sperm donor, that is what you want, to have sex with a woman and THEN ALSO be regarded as a sperm donor. That's not how being a sperm donor works.

Thing is, it's entirely possible for a woman to force, trick or blackmail a man into parenthood. Are you still insistent a man be financially supportive for a child if the former can be proven?

Then you report it the police.

[Deleted]

Then you report it the police.

Answer the question.

[Deleted]

No, I'm saying "deal with it" because you were equally responsible in getting the woman pregnant as she was for having sex with you.

So if the genders are equally responsible, they should have equal say in the matter.

[starlord]

So all the responsability rests on the man,

he has full responsibility for his decisions, yes. she has responsibility for hers as well.

yet he gets no say in the outcome?

Thats very very sexist.

he did have a say in the outcome.

"stick it in and roll the dice"
vs
"decide he'd rather not risk potentially 20 years of financial slavery on a moments pleasure."