4th spec and New models instead of new class and new race?

[Deleted]

Really didn't like your idea of the Ranger as a new class - but as a spec it would work. There's not enough to warrant a new class, but there is for a spec, especially if you make it the pet-less hunter spec.

Love the idea in general, instead of giving us a new class or race - 11 classes is enough already, especially with the prevalent raid size of 10 man, same for classes - but giving each class a new spec, great idea. Also like most of your spec ideas, e.g. time definitely works for the Mage. They tried to tell us that Time was a Mage-thing, which was just never presented very strongly, but as a healing spec, yeah, it would work. Design all spells around the idea of reversing damage, throw in some more time-oriented heal/dps spells like Alter Time, would work.
Same for the Ranged DPS Monk, Shaman Tank, Paladin Ranged DPS, and so on.

I actually really hope that's what Blizz has planned for the next expansion. I have wanted a heal-spec on my mage for a long time, I like the class the best (well, actually, right now, not so much) but, seeing as there is no longer any hybrid tax, hybrids do as good or better damage as pure dps classes ....... I think all pure dps classes should get a new heal or tank dps to make them hybrids, to enable to them to fill other roles, to help their raids better etc.

[Deleted]

Has been my prediction ever since druids got a 4th spec and warlocks almost got a glyph that would have turned demo locks into tanks.

Except for druids it makes sense, they practically had 2 feral specs all along. I never knew it made sense for every spec in game, so that's big news to me.

Not quite. 10 new specs wont require new artwork for tier sets like a new class would. Also most/all classes share SOME abilities between specs. So they only have to come up with these new specs unique abilities.

Not quite. Artwork and such is creative work by a completely different team than class balance (maths, statistics, game design, ...). Also, new abilities from these 10 classes could very well imply new artwork required, too.

And if some of the new specs are pve oriented (tanks) there wont be as big an impact on pvp balance as an entire new class.

(Tanks are not PvE oriented. A tank is a perfectly valid component in PvP.)

[Teriz]

Really didn't like your idea of the Ranger as a new class - but as a spec it would work. There's not enough to warrant a new class, but there is for a spec, especially if you make it the pet-less hunter spec.

Love the idea in general, instead of giving us a new class or race - 11 classes is enough already, especially with the prevalent raid size of 10 man, same for classes - but giving each class a new spec, great idea. Also like most of your spec ideas, e.g. time definitely works for the Mage. They tried to tell us that Time was a Mage-thing, which was just never presented very strongly, but as a healing spec, yeah, it would work. Design all spells around the idea of reversing damage, throw in some more time-oriented heal/dps spells like Alter Time, would work.
Same for the Ranged DPS Monk, Shaman Tank, Paladin Ranged DPS, and so on.

I actually really hope that's what Blizz has planned for the next expansion. I have wanted a heal-spec on my mage for a long time, I like the class the best (well, actually, right now, not so much) but, seeing as there is no longer any hybrid tax, hybrids do as good or better damage as pure dps classes ....... I think all pure dps classes should get a new heal or tank dps to make them hybrids, to enable to them to fill other roles, to help their raids better etc.

Yeah, ever since I saw temporal shield as a mage talent, I was thinking how cool it would be to have mages be able to have a time spec. They have Time Warp, Alter Time, and Temporal Shield.

Also getting healed via time magic would be a new and interesting way to heal.

---------- Post added 2013-01-26 at 10:59 PM ----------

Except for druids it makes sense, they practically had 2 feral specs all along. I never knew it made sense for every spec in game, so that's big news to me.

Not quite. Artwork and such is creative work by a completely different team than class balance (maths, statistics, game design, ...). Also, new abilities from these 10 classes could very well imply new artwork required, too.

(Tanks are not PvE oriented. A tank is a perfectly valid component in PvP.)

Where's the PvP gear for tanks?

---------- Post added 2013-01-26 at 11:04 PM ----------

Imo, this will actually help balance in the long run. Sure, some specs will always struggle in pvp - I think it is inevitable, even if they have made an admirable job in making most at least function in BGs etc. But what they can do with a 4th spec more than add a role is to add a new way to play the class, and in some cases perhaps give new angles to balance it overall for pvp - since not only would they likely add new spec abilities, there could be one or two new baseline for the class as well. since all other classes would also get this, it'd be a great opportunity to plug some holes.

Good post. I largely agree with that perspective. Let's also not forget that it has a strong potential of bringing back old players who may have left the game because their old class felt stale. I know a lot of Shaman just stopped playing for a variety of reasons. A new spec changes things for the entire class, because the tank's abilities (for example) get distributed among the other 3 specs as well.

[Deleted]

Where's the PvP gear for tanks?

is this guy serious. You never heard of a tank in PvP? Have you never seen a tank guard a base in AB? A tank in IoC? A tank carrying a flag in WsG? The PvP gear for tanks is similar as DPS, but gemmed/enchanted different as well as different talent tree, and trinkets are more defensive if possible. Yes, Blizzard did nerf PvP tanks (they were OP, especially DK self heal) but they're still viable for specific tasks.

[Darksoldierr]

There are already way too much specs. Give 4th to everyone then you put yourself into chaos.

[notorious98]

3 million copies sold apparently means "not so popular" in your book.

2 million of that came at the very beginning. Check and see what kind of numbers the expansion puts up. It'll give you a better idea of how popular the game is.

OT : WoW doesn't need more specs. That's just more balancing nightmares. Be happy with what you have because it's plenty.

[Teriz]

2 million of that came at the very beginning. Check and see what kind of numbers the expansion puts up. It'll give you a better idea of how popular the game is.

OT : WoW doesn't need more specs. That's just more balancing nightmares. Be happy with what you have because it's plenty.

Its all about sales man. Which is why Blizzard adds either a new Race or a new Class every expansion. Like it or not, new races and classes keep the game fresh.

[openair]

Not quite. Artwork and such is creative work by a completely different team than class balance (maths, statistics, game design, ...). Also, new abilities from these 10 classes could very well imply new artwork required, too.

Yes, artwork is done by a different team... But, with a new class, they have new long term artwork requirements. An extra new set every tier. This most likely means hiring some new artists every time they release a new class. So instead of hiring new artists, they hire new coders, designers, ect. Artwork for new abilities is one time require. Not every tier.

Tanks are not PvE oriented. A tank is a perfectly valid component in PvP.

A tank.... A tank per rated capture the flag team. Tanks in the rest of rated pvp are largely just distraction. Also "as big an impact" does not equal NO impact.

[Coolie]

I would hope that they would add more customization to current classes to really make them more unique.

[Thimagryn]

Its all about sales man. Which is why Blizzard adds either a new Race or a new Class every expansion. Like it or not, new races and classes keep the game fresh.

If this is true, then making new specs for existing classes isn't the way to draw a bigger crowd.

Lets put it this way - Say Mists of Pandaria didn't ship with Pandarans or the Monk class. Lets say the new feature was Druid's Guardian spec. Are you excited?

[Elegiac]

So yeah, Runemasters for DKs.

The Runemaster class is pretty poorly defined. Exactly what niche do you expect them to fulfill?

Hunters: Rangers. Mix in spells from the Warden, Dark Ranger, and other ranged Heroes from WC3. The petless class Hunters have always wanted. You got it.

This can and should be achieved by focusing effort into the Marksmanship tree, so no.

Mages: Time. Basically a healing/support spec that utilizes Time magic. It'll make Mages into a hybrid class.

No. We have druids for a HoT based healer class, and visually it would be too similar to Arcane.

Monks: Chi-Ji The Red Crane spec: A long range DPS spec utilizing Chi abilities. They would use INT leather.

Boomkin Mk II?

Paladins: Shockadins, more than likely called Templars or something. Basically a DPS spec that does long range holy damage. INT plate.

Probably the only viable other fourth spec, but unlikely to happen since the playstyle would basically be a ranged version of Retribution.

Priests: Psion/Mesmer. Combines Shadow and Discipline magic to utilize Telepathic and Telekinetic abilities.

Sounds awful with no real niche.

Rogues: Stalker. Rogue tanking class that uses shadow abilities. Rogues need something other than another melee DPS spec.

Or they don't. The Pure/Hybrid problem has other solutions than this. Making more tank specs has never solved the tank shortage.

Shaman: Earth Warden. Shaman 2H tanking spec that uses the Earth element.

We have Blood DKs for the 2H tanking niche, sorry.

Warlock: Demon Hunters. DPS melee spec.

Too similar to Demonology.

Warriors: Blade Master. Wind Walk, Mirror Image, and Endurance Aura.

Arms. Sorry.

----

In essence, what you have proposed either coincides with existing specs, or are fluff additions with no real niche or definition.

The only reason the Guardian spec was added was because the Feral tree was pretty much always a '2 for 1' spec deal combining tank and melee dps abilities. The only other spec I can envisage coming close to that is Holy for Paladins due to the Shockadin deal, but since it was always more of a FotM curiosity rather than an intentionally viable playstyle I don't believe it fits the bill.

Rather than adding yet more specs to be balanced, resulting in a huge waste of development time and resources, would not it be better to focus on adding definition and identity to existing specs? Rogues and Mages are in sore need of focus to delineate their specs from each other, Marksmanship is as well.

[iadamson]

The fourth specs would (in my opinion, which doesn't really matter), however would be best used to incorparate hero classes to the game. Also provide new dynamics like two handed weapon tanking ala Death Knight. Things like Caster/ clothie tanks, another physical ranged class prepherably not pet based, and a plate spell caster. Although many of these bring ideas to mind, the new fourth spec could possbily introduce armor type restrictions that vary from the rest of the specs. Although I hope not.

Death Knight, in my opinion would make a better Necromancer, A plater caster, awesome, plus epic necromancer, two fun things wow could use for flavour/ variety. Runemaster imo isn't a great choice, the runes a dk uses and that of which a runemaster uses are similar, but different. Runemasters are also centered around life and living forces of the world like ley lines, and arcane power, which is contrasting to DK's. Just because they share a resource shouldn't make them a combo, I mean all mana users aren't the same thing a moonkin isn't a warlock or a mage.

Without further a do...

Death Knight - Necromancer (Plate caster)
Mage - Battle Mage/ Spell Breaker (Cloth Tank)
Warlock - Demon Hunter (Cloth Tank)
Rogue - Dark Ranger/ Warden/ Scout/ Sentinel (Another physical ranged class, besides just hunters)

Other more farfetched ideas include...

Shaman - Shadow Hunter/ Witch Doctor
Warrior - Warden/ Scout/ Sentinel (Another physical ranged class, besides just hunters)
Monk - Runemaster


I've left out a couple other classes from receiving a fourth spec, because I ran out of popular classes. I'm sure we all know what they would be, plus I only see 3 classes receiving a fourth spec any how, because thats how many specs they would have to add for a new class any how. (Not sure if good logic)

[Elegiac]

The fourth specs would (in my opinion, which doesn't really matter), however would be best used to incorparate hero classes to the game. Also provide new dynamics like two handed weapon tanking ala Death Knight. Things like Caster/ clothie tanks, another physical ranged class prepherably not pet based, and a plate spell caster. Although many of these bring ideas to mind, the new fourth spec could possbily introduce armor type restrictions that vary from the rest of the specs. Although I hope not.

Death Knight, in my opinion would make a better Necromancer, A plater caster, awesome, plus epic necromancer, two fun things wow could use for flavour/ variety. Runemaster imo isn't a great choice, the runes a dk uses and that of which a runemaster uses are similar, but different. Runemasters are also centered around life and living forces of the world like ley lines, and arcane power, which is contrasting to DK's.

Without further a do...

Death Knight - Necromancer (Plate caster)
Mage - Battle Mage/ Spell Breaker (Cloth Tank)
Warlock - Demon Hunter (Cloth Tank)
Rogue - Dark Ranger/ Warden/ Scout/ Sentinel (Another physical ranged class, besides just hunters)

Other more farfetched ideas include...

Shaman - Shadow Hunter/ Witch Doctor
Warrior - Warden/ Scout/ Sentinel (Another physical ranged class, besides just hunters)
Monk - Runemaster


I've left out a couple other classes from receiving a fourth spec, because I ran out of popular classes. I'm sure we all know what they would be, plus I only see 3 classes receiving a fourth spec any how, because thats how many specs they would have to add for a new class any how. (Not sure if good logic)

All of the hero class abilities have been incorporated into the existing classes and specs. No -thankyou-.

[Adramalech]

A fourth spec isn't, in my opinion, something you add as a big feature, but something you add to classes who need it. Druids needed one to separate tank and melee DPS. At most, you might see a tank spec for warlocks, and even that one is a stretch.

[Elementalkin]

I really, really don't like the idea of 4th specs. I don't even like it that Druids have one.

[Skorpionss]

Tbh I'm all for it except for Demon hunters...

I really want those to be their own class with 3 specs 1 for melee dps, 1 for tanking and 1 for ranged dps(not like meta but more like mana burning and stuff that deals with weakening the enemy)...

They could make it into a really unique class, a melee cloth user... but ofc they'd have to itemize more cloth items with agil and stuff...

Also they'd have some work to do with the chest pieces since demon hunters don't wear them, and the weapons...

They'd have to make all chest pieces into tattoos when equiped on demon hunters(maybe just have a tattoo for each quality but with colorings change with items like all gray items have 1 shape, all whites have their shape etc... and the coloring is determined by something else(maybe on char screen and barber...))

The Weapons also would have to be converted into glaives...

But as I'm writing this I'm realising blizz is prolly too lazy to do this so they'll either go with your route of making it a lame spec for warlocks or just not adding them ...

[iadamson]

All of the hero class abilities have been incorporated into the existing classes and specs. No -thankyou-.

The monk and brewmaster created all new abilities very few are from that game.
The small niches they could fill are very possible, and yeah.


Death Knight - Necromancer (Plate caster)
Warlock - Demon Hunter (Cloth Tank)
Rogue - Dark Ranger (Another physical ranged class (which also isn't pet based), besides just hunters)

1) People love necromancers, demon hunters, and dark rangers.

2) People want a plate caster, cloth tank, and additional physical ranged class besides just hunters, which aren't pet based.

3) you can't explain that.

4) 3 new specs is equal to one new class, except easier because you can borrow the abilities baked into existing classes into the new spec. eg, Summon Army of undead for DK's necromancer spec could borrow that.

5) Gooby pls

[glowpipe]

Way to much work adding 11 new specs you say. Well. yeah. Blizzard deffo cant afford that. Not at all. Its not like they are getting a craptonne of cash every month from 10 mill players + all banned bot accounts being re-purchased.

That was sarcasm btw

[Coolie]

I wouldn't want Demon Hunters as a class, because I just always felt they were on their own in the world fighting a bigger fight.

[Lord Pebbleton]

What about not just new models, but better character customization?
Why should a mage have the same big muscles of a warrior, why everyone is tall the same, why cannot i choose to be a Dark Iron or a Wildhammer dwarf?