My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic 13: Fear and Loathing in Las Pegasus

[kortin]

>mmoc vanilla nostalgia glasses thread
>implying vanilla was better than MoP

these guys

hahahahah

[Deleted]

Ah. Have fun then

You sure nothing's up?

[Dontrike]

>mmoc vanilla nostalgia glasses thread
>implying vanilla was better than MoP

these guys

hahahahah

I posted a pretty reasonable argument that everyone just skipped by because I wasn't trolling. It is a much better game now than it used to be, sure there are still problems, but I know that Vanilla had easily twice the problems.

[Deleted]

>mmoc vanilla nostalgia glasses thread
>implying vanilla was better than MoP

these guys

hahahahah

So you think MoP is better than Vanilla?

I'm curious to why

[kortin]

So you think MoP is better than Vanilla?

I'm curious to why

I don't think, it is. There are so many shit problems with vanilla wow that no one remembers because nostalgia dictates that you'll remember the good things. I can list so many improvements over vanilla though:

LFG
LFR
Quest Quality
Raid Design
Class Design
PvP (with the possible exception of AV, seeing as AV is basically just a race to see who can PvE better now)

There's so much everything that is massively better than anything vanilla provided, anyone who thinks Vanilla was better is sitting there with their nostalgia glasses in their eyeballs and are purposefully ignoring all of the bullshit.

[Hetalia]

Fuck. I did that social intelligence quiz. 16/36. I really suck at reading people.

---------- Post added 2013-04-27 at 11:47 AM ----------

Adds an extra step when spamming 2 threads, before they were both in Fun Stuff. Not sure really why just a bit meh =/

Leave the threads both always open?

[Azmaria]

Fuck. I did that social intelligence quiz. 16/36. I really suck at reading people.

---------- Post added 2013-04-27 at 11:47 AM ----------



Leave the threads both always open?

I got 28/36 so I'm average -.-

Only thing I miss about vanilla is the feel of the game being new to me.

[Hetalia]

I got 28/36 so I'm average -.-

Only thing I miss about vanilla is the feel of the game being new to me.

You like 2hu, you will appreciate this.

[Freyera]

I missed you, of course!

Do you have that Euphy gif handy? I'm watching that episode now and I feel it is appropriate.

No sorry. Review my posts you might find it. But I'm on the wrong computer

You sure nothing's up?

Nothing

[Freyera]

I'm off to bed, g'night y'all!

G'night silly one

[BAKANA]

Fuck. I did that social intelligence quiz. 16/36. I really suck at reading people.

Where is that quiz thing?

I'm totes always up for internet quizzes telling me about me.

[Azmaria]

You like 2hu, you will appreciate this.

That was interesting.

[Deleted]

I don't think, it is. There are so many shit problems with vanilla wow that no one remembers because nostalgia dictates that you'll remember the good things. I can list so many improvements over vanilla though:

LFG
LFR
Quest Quality
Raid Design
Class Design
PvP (with the possible exception of AV, seeing as AV is basically just a race to see who can PvE better now)

There's so much everything that is massively better than anything vanilla provided, anyone who thinks Vanilla was better is sitting there with their nostalgia glasses in their eyeballs and are purposefully ignoring all of the bullshit.

I don't know man, I think the things you just listed are the reason MoP is worse than Vanilla, or even Burning Crusade.

LFG and LFR is probably the worst thing of them. I really do not like the idea of dungeons being something that is that easy to farm. I really liked it the way Burning Crusade did the dungeons, I think it was the best dungeon/instance system I've ever seen in a game: You want to do a normal dungeon? Find a group, stick with the group, if you're good then you won't wipe, but expect to wipe at least once. You get rewarded for what it is: A dungeon. Some blue gear and mostly money and rep on the side. If you want a challenge, gather people for a heroic, and heroics were hard as balls but if you did them, you got rewarded greatly: Every last boss could drop epics that were actually quite good, in that way you could fill the slots you needed for raids, but you still had to fight to get it. Along with gems, money and rep on the side. And raids were something you aimed at as an end-game goal. It was something you needed to be good at if you wanted to see more than just one or two raids. You had to put in time and efford to get your prize, not only the bosses were hard but the raid itself was hard, the trashmobs could cause trouble and required tactics, along with traps and other tricky stuff you had to evade. It felt like a raid, a place where Heroes died, but Legends endured. You did not raid for loot, you raided to raid. I think WoW has lost that touch. I'm not talking about every raid being Vanilla Nax difficulty, because that was bullshit hard, but if you in Vanilla had BWL on farm, that meant you were good. That your guild was good.

With that, I think the class design we have now is beyond horrible. It's the main reason I stopped doing PvE all together. They took so much away from the individual classes and spread it out over all the classes. The change of buffs and abilities, both in PvE and PvP, are so simular now. Everyone has a stun, everyone has an interrupt, everyone has a slow, everyone can heal themselves in some way. There are not much charme in classes anymore when everyone does the same, but merely gets different numbers.

Vanilla had its problems, yes. It was grindy, it was necessary of you to get into a good guild if you wanted to do more than just 5mans, there were a long wait time on BG's and many classes were unbalanced in PvP. Gear meant a lot, so much more than it does now, because the jump in epics just from MC to BWL was huge, mostly because of the set-bonuses actually contributed to your class abilities instead of just 20% more damage on X. But all in all, I think it was better. It had the feel of an MMO, it was hard and it was rewarding. I did one LFR on my Warlock, and I got 3 epics and we wiped once. And that was from doing the 3-4 first raids. I can't even remember if it was 3 or 4, because they were so boring and easy that it just felt like a 5man dungeon that took 40min instead of 20min to complete.

It's easy blaming nostalgia, but in doing so I think you're overlooking the actual gameplay mechanics that were, and is now, and how players reacted and reacts to them.

[BloodyAngel12]

[Gemini Sunrise]

Snip

Not to mention the sense of server community. In BC, when I was doing heroics, EVERYONE knew my tank and healer's names, and they'd be chomping at the bit to get me for their heroic run. Like, I wasn't even looking for a group, just shooting the shit in Trade, and they'd whisper me to go into a heroic for them. Just because they found I knew what I was doing, and would likely get the run done with little to no trouble.

[Deleted]

Not to mention the sense of server community. In BC, when I was doing heroics, EVERYONE knew my tank and healer's names, and they'd be chomping at the bit to get me for their heroic run. Like, I wasn't even looking for a group, just shooting the shit in Trade, and they'd whisper me to go into a heroic for them. Just because they found I knew what I was doing, and would likely get the run done with little to no trouble.

Yes. It put focus on the individual. Not to say that there are still not good tanks, healers and DPS, but crossrealm makes you lose the fellowship feeling that is a server. When I played, I knew of course all the guys from my guild, but I knew just as many people outside my guild, from guilds that were better than mine, people that did better than me, knew more than me. And I looked up to them, because not only did they get shit done, but they earned their right to carry their aura of authority.

I remember, in Burning Crusade, I met a hunter in trade chat, and we were talking about the change on Arcane shot for like two hours. That guy later became one of my close friends, and I still play with him to this day, and it all started because he was from one of the top-tier raiding guilds and I felt like he was wrong. It turned out, after that long debate, that he actually agreed with me, and with that I had proven myself to join in on some of their raids. And I was a good player back then, so I didn't let them down. On the Doomhammer server, I had a name, and later joined one of the best guilds on the server because they knew me from dungeons and the IF general (which I always wrote in when I was bored. Still do, just SW now).

It's something I'll never forget, and will always hold dear, and it's what I sincerily miss when I log on now. Not that I am not longer a special snowflake, but the fact that even if I was a special snowflake, crossrealm is a gigantic blizzard.

[Golden Dragon]

time for this dragon to retire to his cave
g'nite everypony

[Dontrike]

I don't know man, I think the things you just listed are the reason MoP is worse than Vanilla, or even Burning Crusade.

LFG and LFR is probably the worst thing of them. I really do not like the idea of dungeons being something that is that easy to farm. I really liked it the way Burning Crusade did the dungeons, I think it was the best dungeon/instance system I've ever seen in a game: You want to do a normal dungeon? Find a group, stick with the group, if you're good then you won't wipe, but expect to wipe at least once. You get rewarded for what it is: A dungeon. Some blue gear and mostly money and rep on the side. If you want a challenge, gather people for a heroic, and heroics were hard as balls but if you did them, you got rewarded greatly: Every last boss could drop epics that were actually quite good, in that way you could fill the slots you needed for raids, but you still had to fight to get it. Along with gems, money and rep on the side. And raids were something you aimed at as an end-game goal. It was something you needed to be good at if you wanted to see more than just one or two raids. You had to put in time and efford to get your prize, not only the bosses were hard but the raid itself was hard, the trashmobs could cause trouble and required tactics, along with traps and other tricky stuff you had to evade. It felt like a raid, a place where Heroes died, but Legends endured. You did not raid for loot, you raided to raid. I think WoW has lost that touch. I'm not talking about every raid being Vanilla Nax difficulty, because that was bullshit hard, but if you in Vanilla had BWL on farm, that meant you were good. That your guild was good.

Raids were actually pretty simple. Bring out Molten Core or BWL now and people would walk over it. Most bosses in MC had one or two abilities and BWL wasn't all that hard, just enormous cock blocks, sure the 1st boss was hard, seeing as it is the first raid escort fight basically, the only reason Vael was hard was it's enormous gear check to be able to dps him down fast enough, but if you ran with enough druids and warlocks it wasn't all that big of a deal. The next 4 bosses was basically a push over, with 3 of them being close to the same exact boss, then it was Chromagg, which was an awful fight for being a healer, but he was actually difficult, and of course Nef was hard being the last boss and all.

The only reason people thought it was hard was because it was their first time at raiding, getting used to new ways of playing, playing around an enormous amount of people, at least 10 of them were not doing much of anything besides auto hitting and still were dying to something as simple as fire on Magmadar.

If you want trash where you have to watch where you are going and watch out for traps then go to Throne of Thunder it is quite amazing, but you need to realize that a lot of trash was just aoe'ed down anyways. In MC you focused the fire elemental or anything big and anything small you took down in a group. Trash in BWL was pretty lame too, but of course there was that awful room of gas. CC was only used because gear didn't allow you to get away with it, even in SSC and BT you could get away with aoe almost all of the trash.

Raids were also stupid since every guild damn near required you to have 300 fire resist to join, then if you wanted in a guild that was into AQ you were required to get nature resist. Resistances made the raids hard back then because you had to farm that shit forever, it is basically why Mother in BT didn't drop in the first week because of the shadow resist you needed to beat her. Not to mention you couldn't get in without an Ony cloak, which you never got because you were not in a guild that did Ony.

As for dungeons. I don't know about you, but I HATED sitting in Org for 45+ minutes trying to get a group, finally getting it, taking 10 minutes to get to the dungeon, someone leaving, then someone needing to go back, them finding the next person for another 10 minutes, taking another 10 for travel, then someone leaving half way because they are babies about gear and we have to do the same thing again. This is all in the land when Hearthstones had a 2 hour cooldown. LFD and LFR made a lot of that waste go away. It. Was. Not. Fun.

With that, I think the class design we have now is beyond horrible. It's the main reason I stopped doing PvE all together. They took so much away from the individual classes and spread it out over all the classes. The change of buffs and abilities, both in PvE and PvP, are so simular now. Everyone has a stun, everyone has an interrupt, everyone has a slow, everyone can heal themselves in some way. There are not much charme in classes anymore when everyone does the same, but merely gets different numbers.

Sorry, but no. Sure everyone having the same things is bad, but I am glad that you no longer need to bring 8 shaman to a raid, like in BC, or needing a specific tanking class, although right now pally tanks are the best because they are the only ones with their own unique ability which allows single tanking of raid bosses to be possible.

If you think that is bad now, then I welcome you to go back to Vanilla where a third of specs were not even allowed into raids, classes were forced to heal or tank and do nothing else. Things may be similar, but I welcome where each spec has viability somewhere, rather than nowhere.

Also, not every class has a stun.

Vanilla had its problems, yes. It was grindy, it was necessary of you to get into a good guild if you wanted to do more than just 5mans, there were a long wait time on BG's and many classes were unbalanced in PvP. Gear meant a lot, so much more than it does now, because the jump in epics just from MC to BWL was huge, mostly because of the set-bonuses actually contributed to your class abilities instead of just 20% more damage on X. But all in all, I think it was better. It had the feel of an MMO, it was hard and it was rewarding. I did one LFR on my Warlock, and I got 3 epics and we wiped once. And that was from doing the 3-4 first raids. I can't even remember if it was 3 or 4, because they were so boring and easy that it just felt like a 5man dungeon that took 40min instead of 20min to complete.

It's easy blaming nostalgia, but in doing so I think you're overlooking the actual gameplay mechanics that were, and is now, and how players reacted and reacts to them.

Unless you are 13/13 raiding I don't think you can say it is easier. This is probably the first tier that even the top guilds didn't beat in the first two weeks and not because of bugs, although Ra-den certainly had many from what I read.

Also, you can't judge the supposed to be easy mode of LFR to normal raiding of back then. LFR is supposed to be easy, just like how normal dungeons are supposed to be.

Not to mention the sense of server community. In BC, when I was doing heroics, EVERYONE knew my tank and healer's names, and they'd be chomping at the bit to get me for their heroic run. Like, I wasn't even looking for a group, just shooting the shit in Trade, and they'd whisper me to go into a heroic for them. Just because they found I knew what I was doing, and would likely get the run done with little to no trouble.

Not every server was a community. I have been on the same server for 7 years and the only ones that know me are the only guilds I was in for 2 or more years, no one else does.

[kortin]

Not to mention the sense of server community. In BC, when I was doing heroics, EVERYONE knew my tank and healer's names, and they'd be chomping at the bit to get me for their heroic run. Like, I wasn't even looking for a group, just shooting the shit in Trade, and they'd whisper me to go into a heroic for them. Just because they found I knew what I was doing, and would likely get the run done with little to no trouble.

Server community is a horrible thing. I utterly despise the thought of server community and am glad it's gone.

Sorry Ziru, I'm not in the mood to formulate a worthy argument. I can, however, say that LFR is not a replacement for raiding. It gives the people who want to experience the raid content but don't have the time the ability to do the content. It's a great thing. Just like LFG. Both of those systems improved the game tenfold.

[Dontrike]

Yes. It put focus on the individual. Not to say that there are still not good tanks, healers and DPS, but crossrealm makes you lose the fellowship feeling that is a server. When I played, I knew of course all the guys from my guild, but I knew just as many people outside my guild, from guilds that were better than mine, people that did better than me, knew more than me. And I looked up to them, because not only did they get shit done, but they earned their right to carry their aura of authority.

I remember, in Burning Crusade, I met a hunter in trade chat, and we were talking about the change on Arcane shot for like two hours. That guy later became one of my close friends, and I still play with him to this day, and it all started because he was from one of the top-tier raiding guilds and I felt like he was wrong. It turned out, after that long debate, that he actually agreed with me, and with that I had proven myself to join in on some of their raids. And I was a good player back then, so I didn't let them down. On the Doomhammer server, I had a name, and later joined one of the best guilds on the server because they knew me from dungeons and the IF general (which I always wrote in when I was bored. Still do, just SW now).

It's something I'll never forget, and will always hold dear, and it's what I sincerily miss when I log on now. Not that I am not longer a special snowflake, but the fact that even if I was a special snowflake, crossrealm is a gigantic blizzard.

You can still do that with all the new people that CRZ has brought in. Personally, I don't mind all of those extra people, mostly because none of them will be talking to me anyways. Hell, I just had a 3 hour conversation with someone about guilds and I met him randomly as a landed to kill a rare and he was there and wanted some XP.

Just because it is different doesn't mean it is bad. There are plenty of people that talk to each other, as if they know one another, in trade chat all of the time. You just have to just show who you are to more people.

---------- Post added 2013-04-26 at 11:02 PM ----------

Server community is a horrible thing. I utterly despise the thought of server community and am glad it's gone.

Sorry Ziru, I'm not in the mood to formulate a worthy argument. I can, however, say that LFR is not a replacement for raiding. It gives the people who want to experience the raid content but don't have the time the ability to do the content. It's a great thing. Just like LFG. Both of those systems improved the game tenfold.

Only time their was community is when you had someone famous on there or they were from a top guild on the server, everyone else was in the shadows. Hell, I am in a top guild on my server now and no one knows of me.

---------- Post added 2013-04-26 at 11:13 PM ----------

And I clearly scared everyone away.