Dailies vs. ?

[MoanaLisa]

The real problem are the bonus rolls - if you raid on a server-top-10-level, you must feel that the bonus roll coins are mandatory. And the easiest way to get them is still daily quests. That has to stop.

Read what you wrote.

Blizzard provides a bonus roll and people twist it around until it's mandatory. Go look up the definition of 'bonus'.

It's perfectly true that peer pressure from your guild may have made them mandatory. Guilds in server 10-ten races may have made them mandatory. That's a people problem, not a Blizzard-makes-us-do-this-when-we-don't-want-to problem. And SamR has it right. Pet Battles are an entirely low-stress and easy way to get the coins.

[Pann]

Read what you wrote.

Blizzard provides a bonus roll and people twist it around until it's mandatory. Go look up the definition of 'bonus'.

It's perfectly true that peer pressure from your guild may have made them mandatory. Guilds in server 10-ten races may have made them mandatory. That's a people problem, not a Blizzard-makes-us-do-this-when-we-don't-want-to problem. And SamR has it right. Pet Battles are an entirely low-stress and easy way to get the coins.

If players feel that the dailies are mandatory and most importantly not much fun it is very much Blizzard's problem.

[Thelxi]

Well, at the moment at least I don't feel the need to do dailies anymore so that is good. I just do a few dungeons/scenarios to cap on valor now.

My big problem with dailies was not dailies themselves, but the fact that I couldn't slap on a tabard and grind out a rep at my own pace.

I hate hate HATE that blizzard managed to greedily and shamelessly squeeze in a daily lockout on REPUTATION. I get that cataclysm failed miserably from a business point of view, but give me a fucking break with the lockouts and timesinks.

My point is that as long as Blizzard doesn't tie dailies/reputation/valor gear/profession recipies all into one clusterfuck daily lockout nightmare again, I am happy

[BLSTMASTER]

If players feel that the dailies are mandatory and most importantly not much fun it is very much Blizzard's problem.

I think this is the answer.

Blizzard tried to make it more lenient/feel less mandatory with 5.2 dailies.

They're making improvements to the system I'd say. (as they should be)

[Maelstrom51]

Give other sources for lesser charms. Problem solved.

Pet battles and daily quests should not be the only source for a currency mainly useful in raiding.

---------- Post added 2013-03-30 at 12:53 AM ----------

Read what you wrote.

Blizzard provides a bonus roll and people twist it around until it's mandatory. Go look up the definition of 'bonus'.

It's perfectly true that peer pressure from your guild may have made them mandatory. Guilds in server 10-ten races may have made them mandatory. That's a people problem, not a Blizzard-makes-us-do-this-when-we-don't-want-to problem. And SamR has it right. Pet Battles are an entirely low-stress and easy way to get the coins.

Your logic can also be used for flasks, potions, gems, and enchants.

And we can all agree that the above are all practically mandatory for raiding, yes?

[Deleted]

Read what you wrote.

Blizzard provides a bonus roll and people twist it around until it's mandatory. Go look up the definition of 'bonus'.coins.

I read what I wrote. If you want to be successful, bonus stuff becomes mandatory. Calling it bonus does not change anything.

I have no problem that in order to achieve something you have to do extra stuff. But I think most people's problem with dailys is that you cannot do them in advance. You have to log in every day.

That said, pet battles are a much nicer way, I admit that.

[Maelstrom51]

It's not impossible if you spend less time griping about it and more time just getting it done.

You know there's a problem when complaining about something is more enjoyable than doing something.

[Deleted]

You know there's a problem when complaining about something is more enjoyable than doing something.

Haha, great line :-)

[Cernunnos]

-Bring back being able to get to honored with factions by questing. This drastically reduces the number of dailes required to get to revered/exalted
In TBC you could get to honored with Thrallmar/Honor Hold, Lower City, Sha'tar and Cenarion Expedition. Keepers of Time you got to honored with if you did the little quest chain to unlock black Morass (which did require you to first run hillsbrad, but only once). Heck even in Wrath you could get Kirin Tor, Wyrmrest, Ebon Blade, Argent Crusade to friendly if not Honored by questing, and in cata you could get Therazane and Dragonmaw to honored, and you got guardians of hyjal to revered with ease, and could then pick up 1-2 quick upgrades from your leveling greens/blues.

In MOP, the only faction you could quest to Honored to was Klaxxi, Shado Pan, was close, but not close enough, you had to do 1 run of Shado Pan Monastery for the quest plus Sha of Anger, and even then you still weren't honored. Unless you were a Human, and were in a level 12 or higher guild. August Celestials you barely got to halfway into Neutral while questing, and Golden Lotus was 1000 or so rep short of Friendly. If you could get a few more of the various factions to at least honored, you could have gotten a small handful of upgrades easily.

-Turn ins for rep
Cenarion Expedition had their unidentified plants and coilfang armaments, Lower City had their arakkoa feathers.

Even with the pretty horrible drop rate the amber shards for klaxxi, (250 rep for 20 shards, now 250 rep for 5 shards I believe) is still an alternative to dailies, and you could possibly get enough for one turn in, through the course of questing in the zone, if you did all the quests to get to honored.

And why don't the other factions have turn ins? I slaughter countless Mogu just doing the dailies for golden lotus, surely proof of my efforts (20 mogu heads for 250 rep, say) would be more impressive to them than returning a few kegs of beer some imps stole from them. The Shado Pan have me slaughter untold amounts of Mantid, Yaungol and Mogu, returning the severed body parts or rank insignias should definitely be a great sign of my dedication to their cause. Blowing up a few statues doesn't seem to do much for the Shado Pan.

-Though my biggest issue, is the gating of AC and SP behind golden lotus. You encounter both of these factions well before you first encounter Golden Lotus. So that in itself makes the gating rather silly. And secondly, why does it need to be gated like this at all in the first place?

If I want to work on klaxxi, and shado pan and august celestials and golden lotus, all at the same time, shouldn't that be my choice?

And while we are on the subject of choice, where is the choice for how to work on the reps? Only now do we have some semblence of choice. Work orders at the farm, 1st Heroic/Scenario of the day, or dailies.


I'll admit slapping on a tabard and chain running a handful of heroics and getting exalted in a day is pretty silly, and far to quick of a grind, but going to the other end of the spectrum is pretty retard too. As was the removal of my ability to choose how I go about getting the rep. At least cata had dailies AND the grind. Therazane and Dragonmaw/wild hammer had dailies, heck even Ramkahen had 2 dailies, guardians of hyjal got their dailies with firelands. Ok so Earthen Ring got kinda screwed on that one and didnt have squat for dailies (and quests for that matter).

Reputation gear is, with the exception of odd numbered non raid patches with their item upgrades, the only real way to spend all the VP you get from heroics and Raiding. You can't buy a BOE item or two for your alts or guildies, and now they dont even downgrade to justice anymore. So without rep, you have nothing to spend it on.

And here comes the issue of the feeling of Mandatory, since the only way to spend VP is on rep gear, and the only way to get rep is to do dailies, of course they are going to feel mandatory, since there is no other way to get that rep.


At least now in addition or instead of dailies you can;
-Kill Scritch the hozen in Kunlai Summit for the Peace Pipe (+1000 addition rep to all sources of rep gains for all factions for 6 seconds, but you cannot move (also doesnt work for dominance offensive or Black Prince)
-kill warbringers for a chance at a mount, they drop 1000 rep tokens that are BOA
-Your first Heroic of the day and your first Scenario of the day
-Work orders at the farm (although that in itself requires a bit of rep grinding, to get to the point where you can unlock the ability to buy the farm in the first place.

[MoanaLisa]

Your logic can also be used for flasks, potions, gems, and enchants.

And we can all agree that the above are all practically mandatory for raiding, yes?

Flasks, potions, gems and enchants are specific tools that give specific boosts to stats pretty much 100% of the time. Bonus rolls are a free turn at a slot machine that guarantees nothing. I think that's a pretty significant difference.

---------- Post added 2013-03-29 at 06:16 PM ----------

- Bring back being able to get to honored with factions by questing. This drastically reduces the number of dailes required to get to revered/exalted

- Turn ins for rep

-Though my biggest issue, is the gating of AC and SP behind golden lotus. You encounter both of these factions well before you first encounter Golden Lotus. So that in itself makes the gating rather silly. And secondly, why does it need to be gated like this at all in the first place?

If I want to work on klaxxi, and shado pan and august celestials and golden lotus, all at the same time, shouldn't that be my choice?

Just wanted to highlight this as I agree with it 100%. The second thing should be available in the game as an option. A lot of people think that farming mobs is no great fun but it's simply another thing to do if that's to your taste and you could build rep with it.

I also agree that gating the other reputation stuff behind Golden Lotus was one of those "What the hell were they thinking about" things and much (but certainly not all) complaining about reputations could have been saved.

[Deleted]

Flasks, potions, gems and enchants are specific tools that give specific boosts to stats pretty much 100% of the time. Bonus rolls are a free turn at a slot machine that guarantees nothing. I think that's a pretty significant difference.

But wearing the item you will inevitably win, if you do it long enough, boosts you 100% of the time.

You're not getting the point.

A good raid group will always maximize their stats in order to do good progress. Flasks and food are one source, but equipment is the other, even more important source. A good raid member will always try to get the best possible equipment in order to not let the raid down.
If a diligent raid member chooses not to do dailies for coins, he might feel he lets the raid down, expecially after ne next 1% wipe.

There is no difference between a flask and bonus rolls, in effect, various game mechanics, like the item drop system or stats like crit rating work like "a slot machine". I don't get that argument, really.

Therefore the bonus rolls are mandatory.

[Ryanlol]

Oddly enough, I hate running 5 mans and enjoy dailies. I guess I just don't voice my opinion about it.

[Frolk]

For me dailies are a chore, they should double the amount of lesser charms u get from them, the rep is fine, maybe buff rep by like 10% or something

[Deleted]

Oddly enough, I hate running 5 mans and enjoy dailies. I guess I just don't voice my opinion about it.

That is how it is intended. If you don't like instances, then you do dailies.

The problem is, that people who would like to run instances must do dailies.

The argument is not that dailies are bad. It's just that they feel mandatory because they provide a currency meant for the I-run-only-instances-sort-of-people.

[Ryanlol]

That is how it is intended. If you don't like instances, then you do dailies.

The problem is, that people who would like to run instances must do dailies.

Except it's really not mandatory, as has been proved over and over again. At no point in MoP have dailies ever been mandatory.

Regardless, this is a discussion about what you would prefer instead of dailies for recurring content, and I was mentioning that I prefer dailies over 5-mans.

[Deleted]

At no point in MoP have dailies ever been mandatory.

They. Are. Mandatory. For. Raiders. (well, since 5.2 you might do Pet Battles, as well.)

Proof:

Assumption: Any good raider will obtain the best possible gear.
Only if you do dailies/pet battles, you will have the bonus rolls. If you have bonus rolls you will statistically have better gear.

Therefore, daylies are/feel mandatory. Where is my error?

[Socialhealer]

easy to solve the problems, remove bonus rolls, remove valor from heroics, remove dailies, give the players nothing, then nothing is mandatory, remove normal modes so ppl don't feel like heroic is the same thing.

the more options that are added the more ppl feel they MUST DO EVERYTHING, then all they do is clear fucking normal mode....if you're gonna QQ about needing to do everything at least clear every boss on heroic or go away -.-

[ZakAtack]

It's clear that there exists a popular negative opinion on the substantial number of Dailies in World of Warcraft. Dailies that, in many people's opinions, are boring and feel mandatory.

Dailies take up a considerable chunk of our PvE game play, which means that there possibly could be something else in lieu of them that a majority of players could be positive about. But what could it be? We're asking for less Dailies, but what could Blizzard introduce instead of Dailies that could feel just as mandatory, but in a good way?

That is what I am asking you today, because I can't think of anything.

I think the group that complains the most about dailies are those that play to raid and only to raid. You'll often find these complaints accompanied by the argument that you should be able to Valor cap from raiding. I'm not trying to pass judgement on this group, it just seems that this is the only thing they enjoy from the game, grouping up and taking on huge, difficult bosses. Comparatively, dailies are underwhelming. During Cata, you could run your Heroics 7 in a row on Tuesday afternoon and Valor cap and pick up whatever gear you wanted, rep gates being opened by tabards as well. Now to get that Valor gear at MoP launch, you had to do dailies, and people just didn't like daily questing. They want to raid and only raid.

But at the same time, I do believe there is a group that enjoys just doing their dailies, and maybe an LFR wing or two per week. But on forums and such, you're going to naturally find more of the serious raider-type players than the super casual dailies-type.

I think GC is right about one thing in particular and that is that claiming a majority when you have no proof of such doesn't make for a strong argument. Just because there's a bunch of forum threads about it doesn't mean the majority of ~8-9mil other players agree. And from a company perspective, if a player is only playing one aspect of the game, if something happens to stop them from this (schedule change so they can't raid anymore, for instance), then they're more likely to just quit. If they're interested in other parts of the game, they might stick around still.

[Kaleredar]

Tabards and force me to grind HC's instead. Like in cataclysm but with a maximum rep increase/day. They can nerf the rep gain aswell.

Oh and I hate dailies because of the only way to get rep.

There's no lore to "tabards" or dungeon running. There's no reason to have a rep at all at this point; it might as well be "run X amount of dungeons and then get an item."



I don't care about dailies. They aren't mandatory. I finished with the isle of thunder ones last week, but I still do them for the shots at palace keys/other fun stuff. They don't take long. They give valor. They tell the story. And you can get some nice things if you stick to doing them.

They. Are. Mandatory. For. Raiders. (well, since 5.2 you might do Pet Battles, as well.)

Proof:

Assumption: Any good raider will obtain the best possible gear.
Only if you do dailies/pet battles, you will have the bonus rolls. If you have bonus rolls you will statistically have better gear.

Therefore, daylies are/feel mandatory. Where is my error?

Your error is that "feeling mandatory" and "being mandatory" are two entirely different things. If you feel they're mandatory, you're taking it upon yourself to do an activity you hate. That an option exists should not mean it's "mandatory."

Players that raid can get gear
Players that do dailies and raid can get shots at EXTRA gear for putting in EXTRA effort.


Changing the way dailies are structured and removing their benefits is like demanding that a service provider company take a faster internet package off of their available listings because you don't want to pay for it.

[Pancaspe]

Bitching about Dailies is the "Cool Kid" thing to do. Nothing more.

Dailies are fine as is.