Old gods are a thing okay? Deal with it.

[Zorperior]

Not convinced at all. There are voice files for him in the game; dead things don't speak or think.

Weeeeell, since the Old Gods are based on Lovecraft Old Ones... they are dead... but not dead... Says multiple times dead C'thuhlu lies waiting, but at the same time it says what which is eternal can not die.

[Belloc]

That is old. It is from before 5.3, where the Old God itself SPOKE and said "I only sleep.."




Yeah, dead things talk and state that they are only slumbering, obviously.

That is not dead which can eternal lie,
and with strange aeons, even death may die.

[Wondercrab]

A story making sense doesn't equate to the storytelling being good, original, or engaging, that's the main problem.

Garrosh was a chance for Blizzard to do something different with a villain, but they decided to fall back on the same trope we've seen too many times to count in this game. It would've been nice for the Big Bad not to sprout tentacles for once, is all.

[Orange Joe]

A story making sense doesn't equate to the storytelling being good, original, or engaging, that's the main problem.

Garrosh was a chance for Blizzard to do something different with a villain, but they decided to fall back on the same trope we've seen too many times to count in this game. It would've been nice for the Big Bad not to sprout tentacles for once, is all.

For once? How many have?

[Twilight Cultist]

Even if they can't really die, Y'shaarj is more dead than C'thun and Yogg-Saron were when we met them. That's why even a dumb orc warrior is able to weaponize what's left of it.

It's not that Y'shaarj is empowering Garrosh. Y'shaarj is not there to speak. Garrosh takes its heart and extracts power from it, that's it.

C'thun had been just resurrected when we "killed" it, then Cho'gall took its power like Garrosh is doing, and we killed Cho'gall.

Yogg-Saron had been just released from his imprisonment when we "killed" it, and we officialy did it with the aid of four Watchers.

It's still very likely they are all alive somewhere somehow, but their physical manifestations are dead, and they will need a lot of time to bring them back.

We haven't even met Y'shaarj, it was "killed" a long time ago, and all that remains is the residual Sha and its heart. Neither of which are it.

This is absolutely false. http://www.wowhead.com/news=214667/p...osh-hellscream Here is the Dungeon Journal for the Hellscream fight. In the intermission phase, it says that Garrosh and the players are ported into the realm of Y'shaarj by the call of Y'shaarj. In the second phase, it says that Y'shaarj bestows power onto Garrosh. This means that the Old God still has a will and is conscious. For more proof, lets look at the sound files from the Dark Heart Scenario. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPg5C7kUwXg The mere fact that he is speaking proves his will is active, and at around 40 seconds into the video, he says "release me." This means that he is simply imprisoned and wants to get out.

Now to make things clear, Y'shaarj was killed by the titans. However, when an Old God dies, only the physical body dies, but the essence remains. This is why the titans decided to imprison the rest of the Old Gods, because killing Y'shaarj cursed the land of Pandaria and his essence could not be destroyed, so all they could do is seal it away.

[hanketsu]

Okay, really who didn't see this coming? The moment the final Sha was revealed to be pride, you knew Garrosh would be consumed by it in some way. Why? He was proud of the old horde and his orcish heritage. It just went a bit overboard....
Furthermore, we really don't know completely yet as to why he is possessed. Whether it be because he himself was too proud and it just consumed him or because he wanted to find a way to harness it as a weapon and allowed it through some experiment, we will have to wait and see.
I wouldn't be surprised if we fought the old god itself after killing Garrosh, as maybe killing all 7 of the Sha would reawaken Y'Shaarj.

[DeadmanWalking]

I don't know about you but I never tire of whooping up on a slice of Old Gods. They's pretty creepy!

Garrosh is not corrupted. Deathwing was corrupted, in his pursuit to make dragons the supreme life on Azeroth and himself on the top of that doggy pile he was going to blow the world to smithereens. That doesn't even make logical sense since having nothing left means you don't get to rule over anything. Thats because he was corrupted by the Old Gods. Garrosh has been making decisions that are not because he is corrupted. Stupid yes, corrupted no.

Besides not understanding his allies his biggest flaw is that He doesn't just want to win, he wants to win big. When Varian came to Pandaria he just wanted to find his son and make a military beach head to keep the Alliance in step with the Horde. When Garrosh came to the island he saw the potential for finding another cache of weapons of mass destruction to use on the Alliance. Thats been his pursuit since day one. Now he found one, and hes going to use it. Thats not corruption, thats just Garrosh following through with what he wanted to do.

Even after he has taken the power of the Dark Heart he is not corrupted, he is applying it as he see's fit. He is empowering those loyal to him.

[TheAmazingFeedz]

Its entirely possible that he'll lose control at the end of the fight, and become fully corrupted and controlled. Its possible that as the fight goes along more Sha energy is drawn into him, and eventually combine with the heart and Y'Shaarj is 'reborn' inside him.

But now? He knows what he's doing, and he doesn't care. He just wants the power to defeat his enemies and dominate the world.

In a way he's similar to Arthas - he took Frostmourne willingly, knowing the dangers.

---------- Post added 2013-06-13 at 08:38 PM ----------



Indeed. We pretty much defeated what's equivilent to a finger, poking through the bars of his prison.

If Y'shaarj was fully reborn he would fuck up all of Kalimdor and eventually all of Azeroth. The only reason the ones we've "killed" weren't so difficult is because they were at a fraction of their power, and even then we needed outside help to defeat them.

[vep]

If this was reddit I would upvote you. It's like people complaining about seats in a car (yup, thats my analogy) it's the main villain of the game, it will always be around.

Since when are the Old Gods the main villains? Is Word of Warcraft not based on the Warcraft story? Is Warcraft not based around the Burning Legion? And Orcs and Humans?


Anyway, the problem lies not in the Old Gods but in Blizzard using the Old God card every now and again.

[Doombringer]

Yes, the Old Gods exist. Yes, they corrupt people. We get it.

What we take exception to is that this story-thread has been used again and again. It's worn out. Worse, each time 'corruption' is employed it seems to have a magical 'reset' that takes place thereafter -- essentially, we vanquish the Big Baddie with the Tentacles and then all trace of his existence is effectively wiped out. Until we find another tentacle-monster, a different one, and start the process all over again.

Imagine if you will, every comic book villain having the exact same origin story. How fun would that be? But in WoW, we're getting into this territory. Our villains are either '
"already insane" or "driven insane/made corrupt". Illidan, Arthas, Malygos, Deathwing, Cho'gall...

At least Garrosh is inherently dark-hearted and he simply makes use of a dark power... but the end result is still something tentacle-y with eyeballs. It's a theme many are getting sick of seeing.

[DeadmanWalking]

A story making sense doesn't equate to the storytelling being good, original, or engaging, that's the main problem.

Garrosh was a chance for Blizzard to do something different with a villain, but they decided to fall back on the same trope we've seen too many times to count in this game. It would've been nice for the Big Bad not to sprout tentacles for once, is all.

No. I want a huge epic fight for the final tier. I don't want Garrosh running around with an axe swinging away while 12 people poke him with swords and 13 people toss spells at him. I don't want Warmaster Blackhorn to be the final battle of an entire expansion. I want a 40 foot tall tentacle growing monstrocity threatening to bring all of Azeroth to its knees while channeling the darkest mystical powers ever seen. I want awesomeness. I don't want a cow who is moved occaisionally out of black circles while shouting out aoe damage periodically and popping tanks with an axe swing.

[Deleted]

In light of all the QQ and butthurt about the Garrosh model and all the "OH WHAT A SURPRISE MORE OLD GOD CORRUPTING SOMEONE"

I feel like a Majority of you have no idea about the story at all.

Yes, We have killed old gods before (Cthun and Yogg-Saron come to mind) Since I feel a majority of you have no idea of the story, Why don't you read this http://www.wowpedia.org/Old_Gods

They ruled over Azeroth before the Panethon came and cleansed it. Giving order to Azeroth. They were forced under the surface of Azeroth. IF the panethon had killed them all. Azeroth would have shattered. It's why Cthun was under miles of sand and Yogg-Saron was put in a prison in the mountains of northrend.

from WoWpedia itself "Though chained or dead, their influence still corrupts mortals, and even immortals, to this day."

They are a strong factor in the WoW-Lore and at least 2 of them (that we know) are still around. N'Zoth (Who hasn't been found yet) and Y'Shaarj (Who cursed pandaria with the Sha)

Lest we all forget about the burning legion and http://www.wowpedia.org/Sargeras Basically the SATAN of WoW, But then I guess you would complain about Sargeras in some way shape or form.

Christ almighty....

Trust me, every time something new is released or announced, the same 50 kids go on here and complain about it.
Always trying to find the negative and ignore the positive in the changes.

Unfortunatly this will never end

[marthsk]

*deals with it*

Done! What's next?

[Deleted]

No. I want a huge epic fight for the final tier. I don't want Garrosh running around with an axe swinging away while 12 people poke him with swords and 13 people toss spells at him. I don't want Warmaster Blackhorn to be the final battle of an entire expansion. I want a 40 foot tall tentacle growing monstrocity threatening to bring all of Azeroth to its knees while channeling the darkest mystical powers ever seen. I want awesomeness. I don't want a cow who is moved occaisionally out of black circles while shouting out aoe damage periodically and popping tanks with an axe swing.

How about you go apply for a job at Blizzard then? Some people want tentacles other people want real bosses.

[DeadmanWalking]

How about you go apply for a job at Blizzard then? Some people want tentacles other people want real bosses.

You mean people want different stuff? I thought we did a poll where we all agreed that everyone in the world wanted what I wanted as I am the only one who knows whats right for this game? Careful if you disagree with me I will tell you to go get a job somewhere and then tell you that some people want different stuff than you.

[marthsk]

You mean people want different stuff? I thought we did a poll where we all agreed that everyone in the world wanted what I wanted as I am the only one who knows whats right for this game? Careful if you disagree with me I will tell you to go get a job somewhere and then tell you that some people want different stuff than you.

But we can't have that, now can we? I believe there is a slight misunderstanding in how this is supposed to work, specifically when it comes to the identity of who the template should based on. While I hate to be the bearer of bad news, I must inform you that there was an error; it is not based on your preferences that the game must, and will be designed. It will be based on mine. I know this is rather unfortunate, but it is an executive decision, as they deemed, and rightfully so, that my personal preferences "kick more asses" than yours. Their words, not mine.

My apologies for all the trouble this causes.

[Noorri]

Blizzard is simply unable to make a raid tier that doesn't involve the Old Gods or the Titans in some way. The only raid I can think of with no interference from any Old God or Titan in any way is Gruuls Lair. They had a shot to make a tier without interference from them this time, but they just couldn't.

The Old God stuff is starting to get cliche.

[marthsk]

The Old God stuff is starting to get cliche.

Just like Shredder is chiché'd with it comes to TMNT... oh wait...

[Destinas]

Old Gods never truly "die" in any sense. It's been stated that if the Old Gods die, Azeroth dies as well. They're parasitic in nature - they latched onto Azeroth's very life essence and all the things that have made up what makes the world. In books, they've even reached into places like the timeways Nozdormu travels (in War of the Ancients) and more recently we've found that they're in the Emerald Dream, causing the Nightmare. The only record of an Old God actually dying is Y'shaarj, who left behind his seven heads and obviously screwed things up...but even so, his heart was preserved by the Titans for the sake of Azeroth.

When we defeat an Old God, we more or less put them to rest, but we don't kill them. C'Thun was resurrected/awakened in the comic series by Cho'gall, and Yogg-Saron is definitely not dead. As for Yogg, his corruption has reached obviously from Ulduar all the way to places like Howling Fjord and Grizzly Hills and we even see one of his "maws" in Icecrown, where the Scourge is digging up Saronite/his blood. Even N'zoth has an amazing reach with his physical body, as it's hinted that it's his tenacles corrupting L'ghorek in Vashj'ir. They've burrowed so deep into Azeroth that killing them fully kills the planet. The Titans discovered this, most likely due to the defeat of Y'shaarj, and decided to preserve and imprison them.

All that said, we won't ever stop seeing the Old Gods and their creations. Most insect races WILL be related to the Aqir. anything with tentacles WILL be related to the Old Gods. They're very much a threat, and it's obvious now, the Old Gods never truly die. Just a part of Warcraft's lore that will stay around, no matter how much people like it or find it unoriginal.

[Keny]

Old Gods are Main themed villians, ofc...
Oh and we did Not kill them.