Should Blizzard Release Multiple Tiers

[geekx]

Back at the launch of BC blizzard put out 2 tiers of raiding off the bat, should they go back to this?

I would like to see them try this again with only difficulty holding players back (no forced gating).

Thoughts?


Edit:

I've given this a little more thought and i came up with a structure for this. This is mainly to keep LFR and funnel new players into real group content.

Tier 1&2 open in full day 1 (must complete tier 1 to unlock tier 2)

Normal/Heroic - Same as always but without gating or nerfs.

LFR - Keep LFR gated and release it in sections on the current tier schedule of one tier at a time. So LFR is one tier behind flex/normal/heroic this is to give people a reason to raid outside of LFR. With Flex raiding on its way LFR no longer needs to be the soul sucking afk fest it is now.

Flex - Gate flex in sections of 1 raid a week, don't keep flex 1 tier behind like LFR.

[torterra275]

No, it is better to stagger the content, even if it is already done. 8 Months without content after 1 month of content is worse than 2x 4 Months without content after 2-3 weeks of content.

[Deleted]

No, the current model is fine - as long as they can keep putting out large tiers, not Firelands / DS, 1 tier is plenty.

[fangless]

We got that this expansion (HoF/Terrace spread apart by a week due to having to clear HoF first), and in Cataclysm. It's not really a BC only thing.


People want non-linear content, so why not.

[geekx]

No, it is better to stagger the content, even if it is already done. 8 Months without content after 1 month of content is worse than 2x 4 Months without content after 2-3 weeks of content.

I understand why this is better for the rate people consume content now. But at the time it took world first guilds 5~months to clear both tiers and that was just at the plain jane normal difficulty of BC. If the bosses where tuned correctly and LFR was gated like in tier 14 it wouldn't be such a short period of content.

We got that this expansion (HoF/Terrace spread apart by a week due to having to clear HoF first), and in Cataclysm. It's not really a BC only thing.


People want non-linear content, so why not.

Im not going to say what people want bc i don't know everyone personally, and most people don't even know what they want. To me non-linear content feels just like linear content, i had a better experience with the grass is greener in the next raid mindset.

And in Cata/MOP we did get multiple raids but they where force gated and it was all the same tier. This is similar but not the same flavor as what i was suggesting.

Thanks for the reply guys i hope more people tell me how they feel.

[fangless]

What is forced gated?

Bastion of twilight, blackwing descent and throne of the four winds were all open at the same time. Nothing was gated.

Heart of Fear was required before Terrace, but that's it. They both basically came out at the same time. I suppose for Normals, it was still linear, but for heroic guilds, you could be progressing in both, if you wanted (and in MSV still, if you skipped Will like a lot of people did).

and most people don't even know what they want.

I won't argue there. For sure.

[geekx]

What is forced gated?

Bastion of twilight, blackwing descent and throne of the four winds were all open at the same time. Nothing was gated.

Heart of Fear was required before Terrace, but that's it. They both basically came out at the same time. I suppose for Normals, it was still linear, but for heroic guilds, you could be progressing in both, if you wanted (and in MSV still, if you skipped Will like a lot of people did).



I won't argue there. For sure.

Yes in Cata they where all out at the same time, but in MOP MSV/HOF/TOES where all staggered we had almost a full month of MSV before HOF.

Edit

Tuesday, Oct. 2 - Normal Mogu’shan Vaults
Tuesday, October 30 - Normal Heart of Fear
Tuesday, November 13 - Second half of Heart of Fear on Raid Finder and Normal Terrace of Endless Spring

http://us.battle.net//wow/en/blog/7435940
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/7705231

[fangless]

I didn't say anything about MSV. If anything, like I did say, MSV heroic was still progression for some Heroic guilds even after HoF/Terrace came out.

But those last two, they were basically released back to back.

[Kazgrel]

If we're going to continue to receive tiers/raids the size of ToT from now onward, I don't see the point in there being multiple tiers in the game right out the gate, unless they've really burned midnight oil and have tons of content generated and ready to go.

World first race for such a tier or set of tiers...ouch.

[fangless]

If we're going to continue to receive tiers/raids the size of ToT from now onward, I don't see the point in there being multiple tiers in the game right out the gate, unless they've really burned midnight oil and have tons of content generated and ready to go.

World first race for such a tier or set of tiers...ouch.

Well, imagine if the tier was two 7 boss dungeons, like BWD/BoT in Cataclysm. I think that's the point.

[Marxman]

Releasing 2 tiers of content immediately just means the first tier will become old useless content that much faster.

[geekx]

If we're going to continue to receive tiers/raids the size of ToT from now onward, I don't see the point in there being multiple tiers in the game right out the gate, unless they've really burned midnight oil and have tons of content generated and ready to go.

World first race for such a tier or set of tiers...ouch.

The world first race would change from being a few weeks to months and they would slow down even more due to real life jobs and such. It would turn world first into less of a 100yd dash and more into a season of your fav sport.

Well, imagine if the tier was two 7 boss dungeons, like BWD/BoT in Cataclysm. I think that's the point.

Imagine if there where 4-5 raids of 2 different tiers with 24~ bosses with raids varied in size.

Releasing 2 tiers of content immediately just means the first tier will become old useless content that much faster.

With the varied skill levels of the population people would still be on the first tier while others are on the second. Its a mix of the new with the old, LFR/flex will alleviate the extreme skill difference in most people to help them get there faster. It still wouldn't be as fast as people who go to normal first.

Maybe they should also have LFR stagger like it does now with longer breaks between tier 1 and 2 so some content exists that you cant just afk for and leave flex the same as normal and heroic so it acts as the gateway its designed to be.

LFR would still be there for the people who actually do use it for what it is and the newer player who had no way into raiding previously could start on lfr or flex and keep going instead of getting bored and afk for loot.

[Noorri]

While the wait for the expansion is going on because Blizzard has to create two full tiers before releasing several million will quit because of boredom. I doubt the game can take another 10 month+ wait without new content at this point.

It might work well in some way I can't see, but if I were running the show I would say no to that idea.

[Nobleshield]

I think every raid tier should be 2+ smaller raids than one huge raid. I'm not entirely sure they should have two separate tiers at the same time, but I think right now there is a lot of burnout just seeing the same place all the time. Having multiple raids per tier also lets them stagger the difficulty. So you might have a 5-boss raid that's pretty easy, and then an 8-boss raid that's a good bit harder. If you can't really do the 8-boss raid yet, you can probably get the 5-boss raid on farm and go clear it every week while pushing forward ever so slowly into the 8-boss raid; for instance maybe the first boss of the 8-boss raid is pretty easy as well, but the second and subsequent bosses are harder, so you can dabble in the other raid killing the first boss, making some progression attempts on the second, while clearing the 5-boss easier raid for more gear to help with your pushes.

[Chickat]

No its fine as is. I would like to see them release multiple raids per tier though. 6.0 launches with 15 bosses and 3 raids. 1 7 boss raid, 1 5 boss raid and one 3 boss raid. It would start at the 3 boss raid which would be significantly easier and reward gear 6 item levels lower, and then the 7 boss raid would be 6 higher, and then the 5 boss raid would be tha hardest and have item levels be 3 item levels higher than the 7 boss raid.

[Imnick]

No, people would defeat it just as fast as one tier but it would take twice as long to create

[Hyve]

Current model is much nicer, and works with the 10 / 25 Man LFR / Flex / Normal / Heroic settings.

[ripponesan]

you simply cant compare that to BC anymore as tier 4 was a pure 10man tier.

So we had one 10 man and one 25 man tier out.

[Deleted]

No, it will just lead to even faster burn out as people would blow the first tier up and move onto the second Tier.

I do want them to carry on with large tiers, released at a faster pace though.

Worth pointing out if SoO is out in September we will have had 43 raid bosses (excluding world bosses) in the time T10 (ICC) was out on its own.

I personally prefer multiple raids within a tier, aka T11 or T14, I prefer the T11 model where all the loot is the same iLvl though.

I don't mind big raids (Ulduar and ToT are 2 really really good raid) but my one criticism of ToT is it is totally linear.

[Kazgrel]

Well, imagine if the tier was two 7 boss dungeons, like BWD/BoT in Cataclysm. I think that's the point.

That would be two separate raid instances within the same tier, which is fine if they want to do that. I tend to prefer larger, single instance raid tiers (such as the current one), but either way it's still 14 bosses be it 14 x 1 or 7 x 2.