Why do lesser skilled players feel entitled to see content?

[Deleted]

Nah fuck it. LFRs are literally some of the biggest dolts I have ver talked to on a forum. It doesn't matter if it's explained for the 100th time because you people don't seem to comprehend it. You just respond with whatever cliche answer fits. When you pick anything apart you can make an argument. But it's clear your full of it when all your different answers condescend eachother.

Like I said, there are those of us that know what this game was and has turned into. And those that don't see whats happening.

Replace LFR with "pro raiders" and you'd be correct.

Like EVERYONE has pointed out in this thread, there has been no argument against LFR that can't be countered by reason.

[Aquamonkey]

And yet Blizzard disagrees, enough to have gone on record about it. Huge amounts of the wow population have never been raiders and never been interested in organised raiding or able to participate for whatever reason. LFR is primarily tapping into those people. They're not people who would otherwise be joining raiding guilds.

Most of the players doing LFR just didn't raid at all before. They were never really eligible for recruitment. (Source)

GC just says that most LFRers didn't raid before. Because this non-raiding population vastly outnumbers raiders, even if every traditional raider quit to do LFR, LFR would still be dominated by people who wouldn't otherwise be raiding.

[Dormie]

Replace LFR with "pro raiders" and you'd be correct.

Like EVERYONE has pointed out in this thread, there has been no argument against LFR that can't be countered by reason.

Lol. What you think is reason maybe.

It's a shame the game will probably die for good before you people realize what has happened.

GC just says that most LFRers didn't raid before. Because the non-raiding population vastly outnumbers raiders, even if every traditional raider quit to do LFR, LFR would still be dominated by people who wouldn't otherwise be raiding.

uh huh. And explain how this has any bearing on anything when the game was doing just fine before LFR.

[Windfury]

Really because I was doing LFR all until a couple weeks ago for legendary parts and I'm one of the most accomplished players in my class into the entire game. Their "data" is bork as fuck. New players will do LFR. How are new players supposed to get into the game and get better when the Normal mode scene is deteriorating? There is no middle ground. Blizzard effectively removed a stepping stone in the process.

They effectively threw away the proverbial ladder and now it's a we have a rope. But hey we always wanted a return to TBC style. Time to work on those poaching skills.

So despite being "one of the most accomplished players in my class into the entire game" you quit hardcore raiding to do LFR and nothing else?

Or do you mean you did both, because if that's what you mean you aren't actually contradicting me. You, who are so damn amazing, remain in the raiding and recruiting pool. The people who are just doing LFR and nothing else in the main weren't in it to start with and either didn't want to be or couldn't for various reasons.

[Tehgypsy]

Fail analogy. You pay for access to the room where the movie is. Whatever happens after that is up to you. Would you complain to the movie producers if the movie is too difficult to understand too? What if the movie was too short.

Your ticket will not say "Access and enjoyment guaranteed for the full duration"

Not sure about that.. Ive got my money back to 2 bad films in the last year.. Ted and Prometheus.. Both sucked after 20mins so i walked out, asked (not demanded) my money back and got it.. As with most things, if you dont like it, you are entitled to a refund...

[barackohmama]

LFR is anti-social in it's basic principles. Normal and Heroic is the opposite, it's quite social and you get to know great ppl. But maybe this is what the LFR ppl want. They want their content with as little in game socialization as possible.

[jazen]

Wish the 'elite' players would quit complaining about 'casuals' and 'terribads' as you so eloquently put it. Blizz doesn't make/run this game for the 5-10% who actually do hc content before outgearing it. Blizz makes the game to make money, and the vast majority of subscribers fall into the category of 'casual' and 'terribad'....if anything, blowhards like the OP should be kneeling down and thanking them, as without their money, the content the OP thinks should be restricted by skill wouldnt be created.

[smiiiff]

vs the argument that LFR is killing the normal raid scene;

We as a guild are about to start a third 10 man group because we keep growing. We have about 3 or 4 people join every month. We do LFR on friday with friends, we do alt runs to TOT or even lower raids when we feel like it and have a nice, relaxing guild chat we keep free of elitists and children. We do not notice any decline of interrest in wanting to raid. we do hear a lot of people who join our guild complain about feeling like they have to be as good as everyone else in the 'elitist' guilds the second they join.

If heroic raiding guilds are as bad, i'd advice you to put the time into training who you have and not whine about the LFR players.

[Aquamonkey]

Not sure about that.. Ive got my money back to 2 bad films in the last year.. Ted and Prometheus.. Both sucked after 20mins so i walked out, asked (not demanded) my money back and got it.. As with most things, if you dont like it, you are entitled to a refund...

Unless it's a video game. Then you need to have the authorities raid the company's offices before they'll give out refunds. (D3 in South Korea)

[Windfury]

Most of the players doing LFR just didn't raid at all before. They were never really eligible for recruitment. (Source)

GC just says that most LFRers didn't raid before. Because this non-raiding population vastly outnumbers raiders, even if every traditional raider quit to do LFR, LFR would still be dominated by people who wouldn't otherwise be raiding.

And what does that say about the broad appeal and popularity of organised raiding?

Even accepting it's made a huge dent in recruitment (which I don't - but if people aren't going to accept blues on it then there's no point me arguing it) why is it those people's fault for not wanting to raid? They're propping up hardcore raiding with their subs already, why should they be expected to prop it up with their time as well if they don't want to? It's their time. Why are they obligated to have fun in the same way hardcore raiders do? Why isn't organised raiding appealing to them more than LFR if it's so awful?

[anaxie]

Think I've hit a sore spot there. It's pretty obvious that is why you guys dislike LFR so much, you are no longer the special snowflakes, no longer get whispers from Loldkdkdkpwn saying "nice gear m8". I feel for you, I really do.

Yes I do. And I love LFR. LFR is responsible for the rediculously huge raids we are getting now. Blizzard said so themselves. The consequence is it getters harder ever tier to fill recruits because of the diminishing upper tier skillbase of players. Though it's likely sometime in the future if we make it to Tier 20 I'll be needing Flex and LFR as my content path to see the story.

[Deleted]

Nah fuck it. LFRs are literally some of the biggest dolts I have ver talked to on a forum. It doesn't matter if it's explained for the 100th time because you people don't seem to comprehend it. You just respond with whatever cliche answer fits. When you pick anything apart you can make an argument. But it's clear your full of it when all your different answers condescend eachother.

Like I said, there are those of us that know what this game was and has turned into. And those that don't see whats happening.
It basically comes down to everything from the actual content to the lore being trivialized due to all the oversimplifying, streamlining and dumbing down of the game.

Right so you just don't like it, you could have just said that instead of filling a post with bollocks.

The thing is, you're allowed to not like it...it's true, you can hate it to the very core of your being and it still doesn't matter! Not one tiny little bit, because if you can't look past what you don't like to focus on what you do then you'll hate everything eventually because nothing in the world is designed with just you in mind.

[Deleted]

It's a shame the game will probably die for good before you people realize what has happened.

Please explain how LFR will bring about the end of the world (of warcraft).

- - - Updated - - -

Yes I do. And I love LFR..

But you're positive about LFR, I'm starting to see a pattern here :P

[Tehgypsy]

Unless it's a video game. Then you need to have the authorities raid the company's offices before they'll give out refunds. (D3 in South Korea).

No, you are entitled to a refund on video games too. Havent got one recently since all i have played the past 5 years is wow, but prior to that, i used to buy games regularly and if they were shit i would return them.. All you need to do is give name and address and reason.. simple.. same with music cds, so long as you hand back everything you bought, they have to give you a refund, or credit to use on something else... be nice when you speak to them and you will get a refund, be a dick about it and you wont. of course it helps if you use jedi mind tricks..

[Dormie]

Well it's clear from the forums that the legendary wow is dead. Replaced with an arcade game.

Not worth it anymore then. You all have fun with your mediocore game. Please, the next game anything like pre-Wrhat wow...stay the fuck out of it..

Please explain how LFR will bring about the end of the world (of warcraft).

Not LFR alone, but LFR is part of the new carebear direction they have taken WoW which it can not recover from.

[Lord Blackmore]

Hey, OP:

Why do people need to keep beating the dead horse with threads like these?

[Aquamonkey]

And what does that say about the broad appeal and popularity of organised raiding?

Even accepting it's made a huge dent in recruitment (which I don't - but if people aren't going to accept blues on it then there's no point me arguing it) why is it those people's fault for not wanting to raid? They're propping up hardcore raiding with their subs already, why should they be expected to prop it up with their time as well if they don't want to? It's their time. Why are they obligated to have fun in the same way hardcore raiders do? Why isn't organised raiding appealing to them more than LFR if it's so awful?

Here's another quote:

There is this myth that most LFR raiders were former N raiders. By and large this is not true. Most of them were not prior raiders. (Source)

My same point still stands. Because of how small the population of traditional raiders is, even if every single one of them quit for LFR, both of GC's statements would still be true. Non-raiders would outnumber raiders in LFR no matter how many raiders did it.

Show me where they said explicitly that LFR hasn't poached from traditional raiding.

[Deleted]

Hey, OP:

Why do people need to keep beating the dead horse with threads like these?

Because they have a stream channel that they make money from in their signature :P

[anaxie]

I think one issue is not that players don't WANT to raid above LFR I think new players have no idea where to BEGIN. Lets be honest we have come a long way from Karazhan when I began raiding. What were the mechanics? Shade of Aran DONT FUCKING MOVE?, Attunme the huntsman, My abilties include nothing and tanknspank, Hello friend my name is curator I do less abiltiies then a single add on Horridon performs!.

Raids are COMPLEX today. I can't even imagine a NEW player to mmos in general seeing to soon to come Paragons encounter. holy shit.

[Hypro]

Why do they?

If you are a terrible player who has no chance to ever get into a raiding guild or pug normal modes, why do you expect to see raid content? Thats the reason LFR was implemented but WHY do terribads demand content just for them? LFR was made to see content, but why did Blizzard do so?

I just don't understand how hard can it be to read up on your class for 1 hour, ask a better player for tips and then improve yourself to get into raiding...


I think WoW is going down the toilet if something isn't done soon to stop catering to the majority. Dont get me wrong, im fine with catering to casuals, but not like this. Not this way with giving welfare "special" content just for them rather than incentive to improve your gaming skills.

I've been there, clueless. I learned, asked better players. I've been high rated in PvP and raided top PvE content but we ALL started on the bottom some time. Why cant those who run LFR do the same?

Ok mate. Me i have a full time job that is night shift. During the day if im not asleep i spend with my girlfriend. I AM NOT A UNSKILLED PLAYER. i dont have time to raid the normals or heroic modes (even though i would like to get back into it). This gives me the same chance you have at seeing the end game content which i too pay a monthly sub too. So i would suggest getting back in your eliest hole and shut the fuck up