When did Garrosh became this evil?

[Faroth]

Well, the Warsong is indeed amazing (military speaking).

They always were, under the leadership of Grom. And as I said before, it takes the entire horde + Alliance to take Garrosh and his ''True Horde'' down.
That's quite a feat, specially considering that Orcs aren't that numerous.

More accurate is Garrosh has that magical bag of pocket dimension that he can pull out super monster weapons at a moment's notice for plot convenience.

And the siege isn't a siege. A real siege would be boring raid content, though.

[docterfreeze]

Evil? Where?

He is killing alliance, he gets my stamp of approval.

[Faroth]

Such a shame......
The son of mutherfuckin Grommash Hellscream could have so much more......

I dunno, there's some level of Shakesperean poetry that Garrosh becomes what he wants, to be like his father, but fails to achieve what he wants: to live up to his father's legacy.

[Jokubas]

The most positive way to interpret this, is that the Stonetalon quest was Garrosh attempting to learn from Saurfang in order to better himself, but he already was a reckless, angry guy who already risked the world once on his inability to not get into a fight (Ulduar). Obviously he did not find being honorable as a good a thing as Saurfang told him it was. Besides, I don't call executing someone on the spot honorable, regardless of what they've done. That's why we have things like trials in real life.

As for some other posts, it really disturbs me how far people will go to insist that a genocidal tyrant is "not evil." There is no possible excuse that makes brutally murdering everyone who is not both of your race and utterly loyal to you a good thing. He doesn't just want the Alliance dead. He wants all non-orcs dead too. And get this, the Alliance isn't evil, so killing them does not make you good.

[Zaelsino]

When "I'll stop at nothing to give my people a prosperous future" became "I'll stop at nothing until everyone else on Azeroth is dead."

[Deleted]

I don't think he's actually evil, rather he has become a stereotypical, simple minded, brutish Orc of the 'raw, me Orc, me smash' vein.

Added to that he has got drunk on the power that was handed to him by Thrall. Power that due to his tiny intellect and broken personality, he is clearly unfit to wield. Still he is doing a bang up job of destroying the Horde from within, so he gets my vote

[TheWindWalker]

I dunno, there's some level of Shakesperean poetry that Garrosh becomes what he wants, to be like his father, but fails to achieve what he wants: to live up to his father's legacy.

In a certain way, at least, he became a lot more than his father in terms of sheer individual, political and military power. Grom got a pit lord, Garrosh got an Old God. Grom had say over Orcs and some trolls. Garrosh controlled six different races that spanned two planets. Grom would not have been able to take the Alliance in a decisive war, Garrosh stood a chance to at least sack Stormwind.

[Dreknar20]

to be like his father, but fails to achieve what he wants: to live up to his father's legacy.

He wants to become a legendary hero of the Horde........well the Horde will definatly remember him.....
Irony is a bitch eh?

[docterfreeze]

When "I'll stop at nothing to give my people a prosperous future" became "I'll stop at nothing until everyone else on Azeroth is dead."

What are you talking about? Garrosh only wants the alliance and horde traitors dead.

[Sierra85]

i think he has always had that evil seed inside him, giving him authority and leadership watered that seed.

he blossomed into full evil fairly recently.

[Zaelsino]

What are you talking about? Garrosh only wants the alliance and horde traitors dead.

Read The Blank Scroll or Siegecrafter Blackfuse's journal entry. Given the tools to do so, Garrosh's endgame includes wiping out every other race on the planet.

That's not very nice.

[melodramocracy]

Stonetalon was him acting pretty much out of character, if anything. He's grown from a completely timid orc (BC) to a kill-the-enemy-at-all-cost, poor decision maker of a leader. You see this now all throughout MoP, you see it in Twilight Highlands when not only does he make the terrible move of attacking an alliance fleet when he should be defending his own, but he doesn't even have the balls to fight Mor'ghor himself at the start of the zone (and goes on to not even give you props for doing it).

In short, eff that guy, any of the other potential candidates will be more interesting.

[Kralljin]

Read The Blank Scroll or Siegecrafter Blackfuse's journal entry. Given the tools to do so, Garrosh's endgame includes wiping out every other race on the planet.

That's not very nice.

Which is mostly Alliance and Non orcish Horde races, don't think he really cares about Gnolls, Kobolds, Ogres and whatnot, though he would kill him obviously for the lulz.

[Abstieg]

Yeah, he doesn't flip flop as much as people think. It's been progressive with desperation and frustration of failure pushing him further and further.

I think Garrosh's entire plot is summed up as "Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Or as Kosak recently said.......the druids weren't combatants......waste of a good bomb.

The problem is Garrosh's speech makes it very obvious that he considered Krom'gar's actions morally wrong and completely dishonorable. Kosak's statement doesn't make sense given Garrosh's view at the time. He has changed significantly since then.

[docterfreeze]

Read The Blank Scroll or Siegecrafter Blackfuse's journal entry. Given the tools to do so, Garrosh's endgame includes wiping out every other race on the planet.

That's not very nice.

Dafuq? Everything up to now has been for the benefit of the true horde... that seems a little too out of the blue for me...

[Talen]

So i'm lvl'ing a blood elf atm and just finished the Stonetalon questline, and I'm wandering does blizzard have just very bad character development or did I miss something?

Take your pick:

The general wasted a mana bomb
The general embarrassed his warchief in front of his allies - a time when he still valued said allies
Garrosh got rid of a successful general who may have been too popular for his own good

Blizzard pretty much stated that he is not corrupted or influenced in any case so wtf?

If anything, the trouble with this scene is not that it showcases how far Garrosh has fallen. It showcases just how much he could have risen had he NOT been an aggressive warmongering racist scumbag.

That's a storyline I'd have loved Garrosh to follow - to see him rise from where he was to actually have him learn the lessons of leadership, embrace and develop a true sense of honor where before he barely understood the term, and show that he could be a Warchief the players would be proud to follow. Stonetalon, for me, shows a hint of what could have been...but doesn't actually reflect what Garrosh was or is.

EJL

[Zaelsino]

Which is mostly Alliance and Non orcish Horde races, don't think he really cares about Gnolls, Kobolds, Ogres and whatnot, though he would kill him obviously for the lulz.

Eh, if he considers the genuinely civilized and technologically advanced races to be "lesser" beings who, in his words, need to be "purged with steel and fire," I doubt those are safe either. Well, maybe ogres.

I imagine the first thing he'd do after conquering the Hordalliance is go and raze those centaur who kicked his ass back in Baine's short story.

[Faroth]

What are you talking about? Garrosh only wants the alliance and horde traitors dead.

And any non-orc of the Horde if they're more useful to him as cannon fodder. He really doesn't care about the Horde, just the orcs.

[Aquamonkey]

He wants to become a legendary hero of the Horde........well the Horde will definatly remember him.....
Irony is a bitch eh?

"No. You have your legacy as a brutal, tyrannical dictator, and that will outlive any monument."

[Sierra85]

i bet he had a bad childhood. poor garrosh baby