"If you can't afford to tip then you can't afford to eat out"

[Celista]

I actually dont see why people hate tipping so much.

In my experience, most of the people who did not tip were of low socioeconomic status, who came from a culture of low/no tipping. Most people who are middle class or upper middle class tipped, and usually tipped 20% or more.

So I'd venture to say that it boils down to how you were brought up.

And yes, you can tell what an individual's socioeconomic station is when you wait on them.

[Collegeguy]

Spitting isn't putting anyone in harms way. Its nasty, it isn't harmful.

It's assault.

[Pebble]

It IS harmful, this isn't even arguable. There is the chance that you will harm them from your actions, stop trying to rationalize that away.

And of course it can be proven. You have paychecks, you have tax forms, your employer has to record everything for THEIR taxes, there's a huge paper trail...

Anything truly harmful that someone could pass on through their spit will also be something they're aware of having, in which case yes that's putting someone in harms way. The vast majority of people don't have anything that's going to hurt you, so don't act like they will.

And no, there isn't some magic paper trail. When there's cash sitting on a table, that cash can just as easily slip directly into someone's pocket and never be seen again.

[Deleted]

Excuse my ignorance on the matter, but why is it called tipping if it's pretty much "mandatory" and expected?

[Pebble]

It's assault.

Legally, sure. You're point? I said nothing of the legalities of it.

[Celista]

Anything truly harmful that someone could pass on through their spit will also be something they're aware of having, in which case yes that's putting someone in harms way. The vast majority of people don't have anything that's going to hurt you, so don't act like they will.

And no, there isn't some magic paper trail. When there's cash sitting on a table, that cash can just as easily slip directly into someone's pocket and never be seen again.

Why are you guys still arguing about this? Mishandling food simply does not happen the way people in this thread are making it seem...it is not an everyday occurrence. Considering I NEVER saw it happen in various restaurants over 4 years, I'd say you're pretty safe as long as you're not a complete ass to your server or the chef.

[Pengalor]

Anything truly harmful that someone could pass on through their spit will also be something they're aware of having, in which case yes that's putting someone in harms way. The vast majority of people don't have anything that's going to hurt you, so don't act like they will.

And no, there isn't some magic paper trail. When there's cash sitting on a table, that cash can just as easily slip directly into someone's pocket and never be seen again.

Lol look up mononucleosis which many people can carry for their entire life with no symptoms but can spread to other through saliva. That's just one example. You seriously have no idea what you're talking about.

And yes, there IS a paper trail. It's called a paycheck and taxes, as I've already said. If your paycheck doesn't add up to minimum wage then you're set. Yeah, so very hard.

[Rifter]

In 1993 the wage for a server was 2.13 an hour + tips.

In 2013 the wage for a server is 2.13 plus tips - most places...

While the cost of living has increased significantly in that time span - 2.13 was half the minmum wage back then.

So the next time you skip giving someone a tip in the US out of 'spite' or to attempt to change the system remember that you are fucking the server not the employer.

[announced]

as some1 in the service industry.. I tip and expect tips when doing an exceptional job. if i did a terrible job.. dont bother tipping me. but for someone doing an amazing job, its respectful to offer them a tip.

im still wondering about the logic of paying like $30 for food and not wanting to tip $3 or so because you are "broke" it makes no sense. if that was the case, just order $27 worth of food and save $3 for the tip. its the same thing really.

i do feel relying on tips is ridiculous, it'd make more sense for people to be paid an hourly wage and have the tips shared upon the restaurant staff. that would be the smartest thing to do.

[Pengalor]

Why are you guys still arguing about this? Mishandling food simply does not happen the way people in this thread are making it seem...it is not an everyday occurrence. Considering I NEVER saw it happen in various restaurants over 4 years, I'd say you're pretty safe as long as you're not a complete ass to your server or the chef.

We've had two people just in this thread supporting it as something ok to do, one of whom claims to have witnessed it/done it themselves. The fact that ANYONE could think that its something that's ok to do should worry you.

[Celista]

We've had two people just in this thread supporting it as something ok to do, one of whom claims to have witnessed it/done it themselves. The fact that ANYONE could think that its something that's ok to do should worry you.

I'm not going to be worried about some dude who might spit in my food if I'm an ass, I have better things to worry about. Like, not acting like an ass in the first place.

[Pengalor]

In 1993 the wage for a server was 2.13 an hour + tips.

In 2013 the wage for a server is 2.13 plus tips - most places...

While the cost of living has increased significantly in that time span - 2.13 was half the minmum wage back then.

So the next time you skip giving someone a tip in the US out of 'spite' or to attempt to change the system remember that you are fucking the server not the employer.

As I posted from someone earlier:

"If an employee's tips combined with the employer's direct wages of at least $2.13 an hour do not equal the federal minimum hourly wage, the employer must make up the difference. "

[url]http://www.dol.gov/elaws/faq/esa/flsa/002.htm

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I'm not going to be worried about some dude who might spit in my food if I'm an ass, I have better things to worry about. Like, not acting like an ass in the first place.

So not leaving a tip is now 'being an ass' and said 'ass' deserves to be potentially infected with whatever disease you might be carrying because they did some small thing that you don't agree with? If that's your logic then sounds like your 'not being an ass' isn't really going well.

[inboundpaper]

We've had two people just in this thread supporting it as something ok to do, one of whom claims to have witnessed it/done it themselves. The fact that ANYONE could think that its something that's ok to do should worry you.

Depends on the staff really, most places don't put up with that shit.

[Celista]

So not leaving a tip is now 'being an ass' and said 'ass' deserves to be potentially infected with whatever disease you might be carrying because they did some small thing that you don't agree with? If that's your logic then sounds like your 'not being an ass' isn't really going well.

Yeah that is not what I said.

[Pebble]

Lol look up mononucleosis which many people can carry for their entire life with no symptoms but can spread to other through saliva. That's just one example. You seriously have no idea what you're talking about.

And yes, there IS a paper trail. It's called a paycheck and taxes, as I've already said. If your paycheck doesn't add up to minimum wage then you're set. Yeah, so very hard.

I had mononucleosis in high school, thank you very much. Its not harmful. Next.

And no, there isn't always a paper trail when cash is involved. A server can very easily make sure their paycheck doesn't add up to minimum wage when tips are kept to the individual server. It's not hard to pocket cash. Honestly, it's not rocket science.

[Pengalor]

Depends on the staff really, most places don't put up with that shit.

It's not just about whether it's put up with or not but the fact that the mindset exists and is accepted in the first place.

[GennGreymane]

I just find it odd that people like to pick fights over this with the low level employees, about ANY company policy....... because that makes sense..... i n bizzaro world

[Pengalor]

Yeah that is not what I said.

Then maybe you'd like to clarify because that's certainly what it sounds like you're saying.

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I had mononucleosis in high school, thank you very much. Its not harmful. Next.

And no, there isn't always a paper trail when cash is involved. A server can very easily make sure their paycheck doesn't add up to minimum wage when tips are kept to the individual server. It's not hard to pocket cash. Honestly, it's not rocket science.

Except it lowers the immune system which exposes you to even more diseases and can cause your spleen to enlarge, rupture, and bleed out. Again, try knowing what you are talking about. And let's not forget its connection to increased cancer risk.

Oh, and tips are taxed, you have to report them to the IRS and that creates proof.

[Celista]

It's not just about whether it's put up with or not but the fact that the mindset exists and is accepted in the first place.

No, it's not accepted or tolerated. As I said earlier. But apparently this conversation is going in circles.

I just find it odd that people like to pick fights over this with the low level employees, about ANY company policy....... because that makes sense..... i n bizzaro world

Some people do it because it gives them a sense of power. Picking on the weak, not having any empathy or consideration for other human beings, taking their frustrations out on them. Really, the life of a server, or any person who works in a service profession.

I am a strong believer in karma though. People reap what they sow.

Good night, all

[ComputerNerd]

The cost should be presented upfront, and not using customers to make up a shortfall from a stingy employer.
Tips should be entirely optional, and on top of a full and normal payment.

Mandatory payments are not tips, but a service charge which should included in proper bill and with a clearly stated requirement for it at the start.