Should men have the right, for legal-abortion?

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Not once the child is born. Its the father saying "I will not pay my share of the burden for this child, you will". That she can abort a fetus is irrelevant to the father shoving his share of the child's needs on her.

No one has shoved anything. She has the choice to abort, put up for adoption, etc. You're conveniently skipping that.

[Heineken]

Very small minority of women doing either of those things is not equal to the majority of women doing those things.

I never said it was... just that it was possible. As a man, if I lose my job I'm on the street. Any woman can buy a $10 webcam and make that money. As I said, it's hard being a woman today.

[Velaniz]

Again, the notion that you can create the legal equivalent of an abortion is a joke.

Yes, and it's not at all a legal equivalent of an abortion that is wanted here. That is a straw-man.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

The child, once born, does not however.

Which was a womans choice to bring to term. Just like buying a car, a house, etc.

[Deleted]

I never said it was... just that it was possible. As a man, if I lose my job I'm on the street. Any woman can buy a $10 webcam and make that money. As I said, it's hard being a woman today.

Yeah, because every woman will totally do that if they need money, degrade themselves like that.

Not to mention you don't really make that much money on it unless you get famous.

[The soulless]

i am sure this has been said with 92 pages. but i feel that if it hasn't then it needs to be.

Condoms break, or as with the case of my ex women have been known to poke holes in condoms so they can have a baby that they know the guy does not want (at least at that time) What course of action does the man have when trickery is used on them? Answer none.

[alturic]

Some people are just way off base with some of the things they're saying.
Firstly, not ALL women have the "simple" choice of
A. have the baby
B. Abort the baby
C. give it up for adoption/ "safe haven" dropoff
There's about 74 million children in the USA under the age of 18, and under 500k orphans/foster children..so safe haven/adoption doesn't happen nearly as often as some posters make it sound.
And when it comes to abortion..some people choose not to for religious/moral reasons, or hell, some people don't know they're pregnant till far into the pregnancy.
Not to mention, it's getting harder and harder to even have access to an abortion.
So yeah, if you have sex and a child is the result, then there is 2 people responsible for that child.
The idea of men being able to "legally abort" is ridiculous, and it would just create a mass of deadbeats

No-one is making it sound like anything. The point of the thread/posters is that the women CAN do so.

[Wells]

I would've agreed with this a century ago. In this day and age, sex is hardly an act that creates a child, nor is it typically reasonable the majority of the time it's done, to expect that a child be created from it.

Sex is an act that can result in a child. Everyone is aware of this. Not wanting the results of your actions does not absolve you from having to deal with them as required.

No one has shoved anything. She has the choice to abort, put up for adoption, etc. You're conveniently skipping that.

All of that is irrelevant. The father has a share of the burden for supporting his child. Whether she can abort, adopt or fly it to the god damn moon does not change the fact that if the child exists he has a share in supporting it.

[Heineken]

Yeah, because every woman will totally do that if they need money, degrade themselves like that.

It's either that or sit on the corner begging for money? Which do you do?

[alturic]

Yup. Because its his child that needs to be supported. If the mother doesn't want a fetus in her body she can abort it. No one just gets to walk away from the child.

Again, the notion that you can create the legal equivalent of an abortion is a joke.

If a mother doesn't want to support it. Abort it. - Oh boy, think I just make a slogan for the pro-choice crowd.

If a mother doesn't want to support it. Safe Haven.

If a father doesn't want to support it. Too bad, so sad.

You realize the legal equivalent of an abortion is not having to support the child which is what happens if you don't have an abortion, right?

[Velaniz]

Mother surrenders child at a safe haven.

Father goes and gets it.

If the woman made an agreement prior to birth with the father that she'd carry his baby to term if he raised it solely on its own, then no, she shouldn't be held liable to make any payments either.

[Deleted]

It's either that or sit on the corner begging for money? Which do you do?

I'd rather sit on the corner and beg for money than sell my body or put my body up for show for horny men for money.

[Wells]

Which is why BEFORE the child is born, the father should have the right to abandon the rights to the child. Leaving the mother, knowingly, with the choice to abort or not.

When he says it is irrelevant. You don't get to declare you're not responsible for a car accident before you get in the car. If its your child you help support it. Your child's needs trump your interests here.

[PizzaSHARK]

Not at all. The ultimate say here still rests with the woman. With the exception that she's also going to be held accountable to whichever outcome she chooses.

Cool. So you're saying a guy can get a girl pregnant and then get off with no responsibility either way? Yeah, very fair.

[Windfury]

Which was a womans choice to bring to term. Just like buying a car, a house, etc.

So? Can your mothers choices override your legal rights? Would you be ok with it if she could?

eta: and seriously did you just compare a human being to a car in terms of its rights?

[Wells]

If the woman made an agreement prior to birth with the father that she'd carry his baby to term if he raised it solely on its own, then no, she shouldn't be held liable to make any payments either.

If a woman and a man sign an agreement where she agrees to accept his share of carrying the child then so be it. I'm against people placing their share of their responsibilities for their children on others without their consent.

[alturic]

I understand, it just doesn't make any sense in the context of the child being a separate human being with it's own rights.

You're over-thinking. I don't think any of the men and no rights comments are making ANY mention of a child having rights.

[Wells]

Cool. So you're saying a guy can get a girl pregnant and then get off with no responsibility either way? Yeah, very fair.

I believe he has to shout "OLLIE OLLIE OXEN FREE" at the moment of climax or it doesn't count.

[chrisberb]

It should also be noted that not EVERY single parent attempts to collect child support from the other parent (whether mother or father raising the child).

[Wells]

Unless the mother suddenly decides, at the last minute, she wants to give the child away.

Again, a choice the father does not have. Which is why the choice to surrender the rights far before the child exists should be an option. If she can surrender the rights to the fetus, why can't he?

Women can destroy the fetus because its in their body. Men don't get to abort because nothing is in their body. Sorry dude, you don't have the same burdens as the woman, you have no reason to get the options she has as a result of burdens you don't carry.