Reason's behind disgust at 60$ for level 90 chars

[Ecwfrk]

$60 bucks is the price of a brand new game - it's as simple as that

Which is why I think the price is right. If they didn't sell them people would be buying multiple copies of the game and transferring the chars to their main account. This makes the price more reasonable than that would be but not so low that you'd never see another char below level 90 again.

Although a better solution would have been to not give people instant 90s at all. But they're hoping to bring back players they've lost over the last few years in WoD but that'd be a lot harder if they had to go through the content they hated so much that they cancelled before getting to the new stuff.

[xcess]

I feel like my post was short and to the point yet you missed the closing point. A race change for a slight advantage isn't going to provide a win. You have to work to win in this game.

Also faction change was added back in 2006. To this day not one BiS item has been sold via the store in the last eight years. Your argument is pretty weak when you will go as far as freebie 20s to make a point validating Warcraft is in any way p2w.

Unless you can find me an official definition of the term p2w then the general consensus and according to urban dictionary p2w means anything that you can buy that will give you an advantage and the services blizz currently provides do

[KCguy]

You had to see it coming. There was no way they were going to make this like, I don't know, 20 bucks. You knew it was going to be higher. Being able to skip almost all the content? It was going to be high.

At least now it'll make most people think twice about it. How things have changed though. Before the price, everyone was upset about being able to buy them and how it was a bad idea to be able to skip everything. Blizzard sets it at a higher price and now people are complaining it's too high. LOL. Amazing.

[MoanaLisa]

Unless you can find me an official definition of the term p2w then the general consensus and according to urban dictionary p2w means anything that you can buy that will give you an advantage and the services blizz currently provides do

The rhetorical problem with pay-to-win is really about what constitutes 'winning' in World of Warcraft. Personally I don't believe that for PvE 'winning' is even an issue. And certainly getting to ten levels south of end-game in gear that's nowhere near even raid quality doesn't sound like 'winning' to me. Anyway, that's why people can't agree about any of this: there's no clear definition of what it even means to win in WoW PVE. PVP is another thing but skilled PVP players are going to own anyone else that buys a boost. Not much of a 'win' there either. And if a skilled PVP player gets defeated by someone with a boost it's difficult to argue that that's a bad thing. Skill is skill.

[Sury]

Unless you can find me an official definition of the term p2w then the general consensus and according to urban dictionary p2w means anything that you can buy that will give you an advantage and the services blizz currently provides do

Im not going to go in circles with you lets stick to your original argument and ignore things like urban dictionary.

Lets back up. You made the argument that paying your subscription to remove the restrictions on free accounts is p2w.

Paying to gain access to level 21 is pay to play.

::edit::

The services that Blizzard currently provides give a time advantage in many situations. That advantage is restricted exclusively to time. In no way does it give you a winning advantage. Again, you have to work in this game to win.

[silvercentric]

You guys are all completely missing the point. You guys can argue all you want about whether it constitutes P2P or P2W (I'm on the P2W side though).

Most of you would agree that something is wrong with leveling correct? That's why this is being implemented in the first place. Most people aren't interested in it and see it as a tedious grind to get to the content they actually consider worth playing.

So why is this disgusting? Because instead of FIXING leveling to make it more interesting and not such a drag, they slap a $60 price tag on it to let you skip it. How any of you can defend this option is beyond me. How do you make that leap of logic? Something is wrong with the game and instead of saying "Hey Blizz, you should probably take a look at this..." you instead pull out your credit card and ignore the problem.

How do they fix this problem? I don't know the best one, but there are solutions. My suggestion would be to induce a level squish (they're doing a stat squish anyway) and stagger their expansions leveling zones. Right now you have to level up through each expansion, linearly. Just squash it down so there are less levels, instead of playing in each zone for 30 minutes and out-leveling it make it so each zone actually lasts and players can pick 6-7 zones to level to the new max level (ignoring the latest expansion of course).

As of right now there are two ways to get to 90:

• Get to level 15 and queue up via LFD all the way without ever leaving a city
• Visit 26 to 30 zones on your way to level 90, often as little as 2 hours in each before you out-level and out-green all the quests there

[xcess]

No I am comparing a lvl 20 subbed lets say he locked his exp gain so he cant go past lvl 20 to the lvl 20 playing for free. The subbed 20 gets extra armour duribility so it means his armour is stronger he can mount faster he can have increased chance at making more mats he gets mass resurrection he gets faster flight point rides he he generates more gold, honor justice than the free 20. If thats not the definition of stronger better and more advantage then what is

Hey I didnt want to use urban dictionary as a source but I dont know who invented the term p2w so I cant really ask for their definition but its more official than me pulling one out of my ass

[Sury]

No I am comparing a lvl 20 subbed lets say he locked his exp gain so he cant go past lvl 20 to the lvl 20 playing for free. The subbed 20 gets extra armour duribility so it means his armour is stronger he can mount faster he can have increased chance at making more mats he gets mass resurrection he gets faster flight point rides he he generates more gold, honor justice than the free 20. If thats not the definition of stronger better and more advantage then what is

Now that you have stated the obvious about WoW, a subscription based game.. Make your point of how any of that has to do with p2w or disgust at paid 90s.

Hey I didnt want to use urban dictionary as a source but I dont know who invented the term p2w so I cant really ask for their definition but its more official than me pulling one out of my ass

Barely.

You guys are all completely missing the point. You guys can argue all you want about whether it constitutes P2P or P2W (I'm on the P2W side though).

stuff about spending development time on another leveling revamp...

If you have read any of my previous posts in this thread you would know I feel paid 90s are a necessary evil. The leveling process is tedious and boring for millions of players. Nine years after my first character, I play this game now for end game. I've seen Westfall and The Barrens enough times.

The real point to be made is there would be no paid 90 if they scrapped the free 90.

People want to keep over using made up phrase like p2w...which they have to go to urban dictionary to fact check. Let me repeat that...they have to go to urban dictionary to fact check.

Paid 90
Sex Change
Race Change
Faction Change
Server Transfer

Services Blizzard has provided with one basic goal in mind. Convenience. If you don't like the features or feel they are band-aids to fix a broken system then you aren't alone. I feel no disgust towards a paid 90 service or the zones I have many good memories of. The content is relegated to nostalgia at this point for me.

[Adominitis]

I'm a serious PvP/PvE'r and I want to get a toon to lvl 100.

I'm also a college student and work an almost full time job so, I don't really have the time to lvl a toon to 90 let alone 100 so what should I do? Most people would say stick with what you have then and stop complaining but, I want to enjoy the game as much as possible too I don't want to just sit out of RBG's or Raids because my class doesn't fit their needs and I also enjoy learning new class's as well so 60 for a lvl 90 isn't bad. If it was 60 bucks for a lvl 100 then, yea by all means all hell break loose but, I still have to lvl from 90-100 and if the grind is the same as MoP (idk don't read too much as far as posts mostly watch video updates) then that isn't a bad trade off.

For those saying it's P2W now, it's really not because I could just get a RaF account going right now and dualbox my way to 90 if I really wanted to but, I don't. It's 60 bucks sheesh that's like paying for a AAA title so it's not an investment I or I guarantee anyone who gives a damn about money would take lightly.

[silvercentric]

I'm a serious PvP/PvE'r and I want to get a toon to lvl 100.

I'm also a college student and work an almost full time job so, I don't really have the time to lvl a toon to 90 let alone 100 so what should I do? Most people would say stick with what you have then and stop complaining but, I want to enjoy the game as much as possible too I don't want to just sit out of RBG's or Raids because my class doesn't fit their needs and I also enjoy learning new class's as well so 60 for a lvl 90 isn't bad. If it was 60 bucks for a lvl 100 then, yea by all means all hell break loose but, I still have to lvl from 90-100 and if the grind is the same as MoP (idk don't read too much as far as posts mostly watch video updates) then that isn't a bad trade off.

I don't understand yours and everyone else like your's mindset. I ask this in a completely honest manner, are you a shill?

You say you don't have time to level a character and your first reaction is to shell out money to compensate for this? Why are you not pressuring Blizzard to redesign and fix their leveling system if it's so tedious?

You say you want to take the endgame seriously but you want to play 5-10 different classes. Sounds like you have plenty of time to me.

[worstpvperus]

Making level fun or more interesting would require development time and that takes away from stuff at max level. Maybe offer suggestions... I suggest making lower level pvp balance a thing so warriors and hunters can't tab target and destroy everything in one global. I don't think that would hurt max level to much but that is all I came up with.

[ihyln]

Anyone find it interesting that Orcs in WOD have been massively nerfed when it comes to racials compared to the rest? They probably figured since so many play orcs now they will pay to change races. Probably a little tinfoil hatting on my part but I found it interesting.

[Elian]

I don't understand yours and everyone else like your's mindset. I ask this in a completely honest manner, are you a shill?

You say you don't have time to level a character and your first reaction is to shell out money to compensate for this? Why are you not pressuring Blizzard to redesign and fix their leveling system if it's so tedious?

You say you want to take the endgame seriously but you want to play 5-10 different classes. Sounds like you have plenty of time to me.

that's the mindset here; you will see many people with 5,000-10,000+ mmo champion posts here and they will keep on telling you why Blizzard should make changes to the game to make it more convenient because they don't have "time to play"
look at some LFR debates, you'll see what im talking about.

[Sury]

I'm a serious PvP/PvE'r and I want to get a toon to lvl 100.

I'm also a college student and work an almost full time job so, I don't really have the time to lvl a toon to 90 let alone 100 so what should I do? Most people would say stick with what you have then and stop complaining but, I want to enjoy the game as much as possible too I don't want to just sit out of RBG's or Raids because my class doesn't fit their needs and I also enjoy learning new class's as well so 60 for a lvl 90 isn't bad. If it was 60 bucks for a lvl 100 then, yea by all means all hell break loose but, I still have to lvl from 90-100 and if the grind is the same as MoP (idk don't read too much as far as posts mostly watch video updates) then that isn't a bad trade off.

For those saying it's P2W now, it's really not because I could just get a RaF account going right now and dualbox my way to 90 if I really wanted to but, I don't. It's 60 bucks sheesh that's like paying for a AAA title so it's not an investment I or I guarantee anyone who gives a damn about money would take lightly.

I don't understand yours and everyone else like your's mindset. I ask this in a completely honest manner, are you a shill?

You say you don't have time to level a character and your first reaction is to shell out money to compensate for this? Why are you not pressuring Blizzard to redesign and fix their leveling system if it's so tedious?

You say you want to take the endgame seriously but you want to play 5-10 different classes. Sounds like you have plenty of time to me.

At what point did they say anything about having time for 5-10 different classes?

All I read was they are a college student that wants to play end game. They also seem to be busy as they have a full time job to go along with a class load.

If you can't understand their mindset it might be because you aren't in their situation. From an open mindset I see a valid reason to use a service that is intend for people like them.

[GrinningMan]

It's probably already been said, but there really is no winning with this crowd.

'BAWWWW It's 60 bucks! They just want our money!'

Okay, we'll drop the price.

'BAWWWW IT'S CHEAPENING IT FOR THOSE OF US THAT LEVELED!!'

Just no winning.

[Surfd]

WOW is going to take some hits this year. Especially if WoD has the same linear gated leveling system MoP had. THere has already been significant drama surrounding flight being removed.

What? "Linear gated leveling system that MoP had"? The hell are you babbeling about? WoW has had pretty much the same leveling paradigm since Burning Crusade launched. Start in a specified starting zone, level up throguh the zone's story path, finish zone, proceed to next appropriately difficult zone. Nothing much has changed since then, and MoP is no different. Trying to act like this is new to Mists is stupid in the extreem.

As to the Drama regrding flight being removed? A pretty famous quote summs that up pretty easily: "Full of Sound and Fury, Signifying Nothing". Just the same windbags blowing the same hot air they tossed around back when Wrath did it, and when Cata did it.

[dontknowdoya]

The purpose of this thread is to help understand why some people are crying out about this (possible) number for the cost. I personally think it is a reasonable price for the amount of content that you are skipping.

The concept is kind of funny, paying to skip content that you paid for. How reasonable the price is rather subjective and is going to vary from person to person depending on their gaming budget.

To say that the price being set that high was not to turn a profit is bullshit. The entire concept behind the game is to make money and there is nothing wrong with that. Personally, $60 is well inside my game budget. Will I use the service? Hell no. For starters I already have a toon of each class between 85 and 90, plus a few extras. Secondly, I would rather blow $60 on a bunch of Steam games that I will never get around to playing.

[MoanaLisa]

The concept is kind of funny, paying to skip content that you paid for. How reasonable the price is rather subjective and is going to vary from person to person depending on their gaming budget.

To say that the price being set that high was not to turn a profit is bullshit. The entire concept behind the game is to make money and there is nothing wrong with that. Personally, $60 is well inside my game budget. Will I use the service? Hell no. For starters I already have a toon of each class between 85 and 90, plus a few extras. Secondly, I would rather blow $60 on a bunch of Steam games that I will never get around to playing.

Two points:

1. Paying to skip to the content you really want to play sounds sensible doesn't it? Paying to skip over something you've already done a dozen times doesn't sound crazy either.

2. They could have made a lot more profit by setting it at $20-$30. So I'm skeptical. It's basically about the same as what you would need to do to buy the battle chest and expansion and do all of the account transfers. The point remains though that if it was simply a cash grab it would have been much less.

[dontknowdoya]

Two points:

1. Paying to skip to the content you really want to play sounds sensible doesn't it? Paying to skip over something you've already done a dozen times doesn't sound crazy either.

2. They could have made a lot more profit by setting it at $20-$30. So I'm skeptical. It's basically about the same as what you would need to do to buy the battle chest and expansion and do all of the account transfers. The point remains though that if it was simply a cash grab it would have been much less.

Eh, fair points. Although, I was attempting to point out that I found a small amount of humor in the concept of "paying to skip content that you paid for". In regards to the high price, I think it is relative to the prices of the other services.

[draykorinee]

Its a terrible price personally, like you have gone through this process so many times that as much as I'd love a priest at 90 I just can't go through it again, I don;t have the time or the patience to do it. Horrid price point.